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Believing that everything in the complex universe came from nothing is atheistic dogma. Nothing in the wildest religion can ever come close to that. This is why every religious person looks quite normal and intelligent in comparison.
Who believes that? No one has any idea where everything in the complex universe came from. And most definitely no one has any rational basis for believing it came from a figment of a human imagination.
One. Yes, there is. You simply are not aware of it. It is called egregore. Atheist egregore. Just like any religion has its own egregore, so does atheism. I will let those in interest to find more about egregores. If I could - you can.
Two. Oh, but there is. And science has little to do with this. Incontrovertible truth for any atheist - or he is not an atheist - is that there is no god.
And, btw, thank you mentioning that science is always changing. So much for scientific values, so much beloved by atheists as eternal truths used in argument with religious folk.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzilla
So by claiming to hold no dogma you are admitting you believe in nothing. This also means you cannot make a statement of truth which is relevant since nothing you say you have any credible faith in. Dogma applies to all worldviews and those who say there is no dogma in atheism are fooling themselves.
Not believing in God is dogma in atheism. Believing that life evolved from non-life is dogma in atheism. I would go on but you get the point. The Greek definition of dogma applies to politics just as much as it does religion. It is a set of beliefs and/or principles held and believed to be true.
Of course, since every atheist professor has taught moral relativism to students for several decades now it is clear that moral relativism is also dogma. This also reduced the atheist worldview to a dogma that doesn't believe in anything. It's like the agnostic position which says 'There is no truth and that's the truth!' Such a statement cancels itself out since it is a statement authoritatively said as a dogma of being agnostic -- a statement of truth (though a contradictory one).
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzyRules
Believing that everything in the complex universe came from nothing is atheistic dogma. Nothing in the wildest religion can ever come close to that. This is why every religious person looks quite normal and intelligent in comparison.
As to the bolded parts of these three quoted posts, let me say this. Back when we had a team of moderators, some of the regulars (4-5 of them) on the Atheism and Agnosticism forum came to us and asked if we could post a FAQ in order to dispel inaccurate information posted in the forum, particularly by new members. After some considerable effort, which included each contributor and each moderator checking the FAQ for accuracy, completeness, spelling, grammar, etc., the post was added to the rules Sticky thread. [We checked the definitions against multiple online reference sources.] I had to make the post (even thought I didn't write it) because only moderators can add posts to closed threads. We had to add it to the rules thread because we are only allow to have two Sticky threads, and the owner of the company (Administrator) had already posted one when he created this sub-forum.
Please go to this thread and read Post #3. //www.city-data.com/forum/athei...s-posting.html Please do so now, before posting further in this thread. Nothing that defines an Atheist has anything to do with the creation of the Universe, creation of life, the science of evolution, or the absolute certainly about the existence of God.
On another, related matter: In another thread, one member noted that a recent Pew Research poll indicated that 9% of the US self-identified as Atheist. That means there are [roughly] 32 million atheists in the US. We we discussed this a few years ago, somebody looked up some numbers and posted that American Atheists had a few thousand members, and the FFRF had ~30,000 members. Add up all the atheist "organizations" and they total less than 1% of the atheists in the country. More than 99% of the atheists have chosen to join no organization. That's the reality, folks. It doesn't matter what YOU believe or what position you try to push onto atheists. These numbers indicate that atheists (by a vast majority) are individuals who hold exactly ONE thing in common. They have no belief in God (or gods).
Believing that everything in the complex universe came from nothing is atheistic dogma.
No. Because no atheist I've met in my entire life thinks that. It is. in fact, only thiests believe that something can come from nothing, as in ... 'My god created everything.'
Well, created it from what...yes that's right. According to theists...nothing!
One. Yes, there is. You simply are not aware of it. It is called egregore. Atheist egregore. Just like any religion has its own egregore, so does atheism. I will let those in interest to find more about egregores. If I could - you can.
Major fail. Nothing to do with atheism. The only thing common with atheism is we do not believe in gods. This idea came for me independently of what others thought. I did not even know other atheists existed. After that, atheists have different ideas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukrkoz
Two. Oh, but there is. And science has little to do with this. Incontrovertible truth for any atheist - or he is not an atheist - is that there is no god.
Major fail. I do not hold this as an incontrovertible truth. I have no reason to believe in any gods, but I am willing to change my mind given good evidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukrkoz
And, btw, thank you mentioning that science is always changing. So much for scientific values, so much beloved by atheists as eternal truths used in argument with religious folk.
Must you straw man? Eternal truths? But thank you for refuting the OP's position.
So by claiming to hold no dogma you are admitting you believe in nothing. This also means you cannot make a statement of truth which is relevant since nothing you say you have any credible faith in. Dogma applies to all worldviews and those who say there is no dogma in atheism are fooling themselves.
Non sequitur.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzilla
Not believing in God is dogma in atheism.
Straw man. Provide evidence and I will change my mind. But the fact many Christians have to lie for their beliefs leads me to conclude they have no evidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzilla
Believing that life evolved from non-life is dogma in atheism.
No, that is your straw man, and means you admit chemistry does not exist. Good luck with THAT argument.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzilla
I would go on but you get the point.
Yes, you like straw men.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzilla
The Greek definition of dogma applies to politics just as much as it does religion. It is a set of beliefs and/or principles held and believed to be true.
Ha, you do not understand what dogma means. There are online dictionaries available.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzilla
Of course, since every atheist professor has taught moral relativism to students for several decades now it is clear that moral relativism is also dogma. This also reduced the atheist worldview to a dogma that doesn't believe in anything. It's like the agnostic position which says 'There is no truth and that's the truth!' Such a statement cancels itself out since it is a statement authoritatively said as a dogma of being agnostic -- a statement of truth (though a contradictory one).
Your non sequitur has nothing to do with atheism. But well done for admitting you accept the contradictory position of your god being an immoral monster while not existing. That IS where the objective morality argument takes you.
Believing that everything in the complex universe came from nothing is atheistic dogma. Nothing in the wildest religion can ever come close to that. This is why every religious person looks quite normal and intelligent in comparison.
No, that is the Christian belief, not ours.
You have just called EVERY Christian stupid and irrational.
Your usual trick of straw manning to try and make atheists look stupid, and you call EVERY Christian stupid and irrational.
So by claiming to hold no dogma you are admitting you believe in nothing. This also means you cannot make a statement of truth which is relevant since nothing you say you have any credible faith in. Dogma applies to all worldviews and those who say there is no dogma in atheism are fooling themselves.
Not believing in God is dogma in atheism. Believing that life evolved from non-life is dogma in atheism. I would go on but you get the point. The Greek definition of dogma applies to politics just as much as it does religion. It is a set of beliefs and/or principles held and believed to be true.
Of course, since every atheist professor has taught moral relativism to students for several decades now it is clear that moral relativism is also dogma. This also reduced the atheist worldview to a dogma that doesn't believe in anything. It's like the agnostic position which says 'There is no truth and that's the truth!' Such a statement cancels itself out since it is a statement authoritatively said as a dogma of being agnostic -- a statement of truth (though a contradictory one).
Do you believe that there is no Santa? Or do you simply not believe it? Do you believe that Muhammad never flew up to heaven to visit with God astride a flying beast named Baraq, or do you simply not believe it? Are you being dogmatic in your non belief?
The Bible teaches that genocide is sometimes necessary. The Bible supports institutionalized slavery. Modern society has outlawed genocide and slavery. Moral relativism can be a good thing.
Believing that everything in the complex universe came from nothing is atheistic dogma. Nothing in the wildest religion can ever come close to that. This is why every religious person looks quite normal and intelligent in comparison.
One. Yes, there is. You simply are not aware of it. It is called egregore. Atheist egregore. Just like any religion has its own egregore, so does atheism. I will let those in interest to find more about egregores. If I could - you can.
Two. Oh, but there is. And science has little to do with this. Incontrovertible truth for any atheist - or he is not an atheist - is that there is no god.
wikipedia
Egregore
Egregore (also egregor) is an occult concept representing a "thoughtform" or "collective group mind", an autonomous psychic entity made up of, and influencing, the thoughts of a group of people. The symbiotic relationship between an egregore and its group has been compared to the more recent, non-occult concepts of the corporation (as a legal entity) and the meme. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egregore
There is no such thing as an atheist "Egregore." Atheists do not have a "collective group mind." Atheists are as diverse as the general population. There are politically liberal atheists, and politically conservative atheists. The only thing that atheists necessarily have in common is not believing in God, or the god's.
THE HUMANIST
Wait, You’re an Atheist AND a Conservative?
For many people, the idea of a conservative atheist seems like an oxymoron. One explanation could be that we mostly see popular atheist activists speaking out politically over progressive issues like marriage equality or abortion rights for women. Opponents of these issues, who generally identify as conservative, tend to use religious arguments to back their positions. Plus, conservatism is associated with authoritarianism and dogmatic tradition while atheism certainly is not. In any case, the term “atheist” has been politicized over the years, when in fact, it describes a philosophy that has nothing to do with partisan politics.
It’s certainly true that atheists tend to be more liberal and identify with the Democratic Party more naturally. However, that doesn’t mean that conservatives can’t occupy a place within this movement as well. https://thehumanist.com/commentary/w...a-conservative
Atheists do not believe in the existence of God, this is true. Do you disbelieve in the existence of Santa and his team of flying reindeer? Does this (I will presume) disbelief count as dogma?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukrkoz
And, btw, thank you mentioning that science is always changing. So much for scientific values, so much beloved by atheists as eternal truths used in argument with religious folk.
Believers subscribe to unflinching dogma. In religion, dogma is necessary to maintain the core belief. Christians are dogmatic in their belief that the corpse of Jesus returned to life and subsequently flew off up into the sky, for example. Or the belief that the Bible represents "The Word of God" and is beyond challenge. This sort of unflinching dogma is necessary to maintain the faith. Unflinching dogma is a total anathema in science. Because it closes the door to learning, and learning is the key to knowledge.
The closest thing science has to dogma are the laws of physics. These are referred to as "laws" because all observation and experimentation has indicated that the universe operates by fixed and immutable rules. Matter interacts with itself in predictable ways. No predictable laws of physics, no modern technology.
But even the laws of physics are subject to modification should unmistakable evidence present itself which indicate that modifications are necessary. True science requires being open to change as new information is discovered. Religions require being dogmatic and unflinching in their basic assumptions on reality, and the necessary truth of their core claims. Which is why religions are failing. Because modern observation has been clearly showing that the universe operates for very different reasons than those assumed to be true by ancient superstitious people. Truth is derived from direct observation. Make believe is a product of assumption.
Last edited by Tired of the Nonsense; 07-20-2018 at 11:27 AM..
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