Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I think life would be easier, not having to deal with the crap christians in particular spew towards non-christians.
It's also nice to believe in a saftey net. Unlike most 'christians', I'm not going to go through the song and dance. If 'he' IS such a merciful deity, he will judge me on the morality of my life and not by wether I believed in him.
I don't see how murderers and rapists can go to heaven, and yet those that led a moral life don't. Complete ludicrisy.
And no one suggests, David, that any of these things just "poofed" into existence. Rather, they were all products of trial and error. In fact, it would be more unlikely that such a thing "poofed" into existence (as the notion you imply with God) than with a slow, changing process.
This is the same mathematical thinking as implies the "Monkey Banging on a Typewriter". For simplicity purposes, if a monkey banged away on a standard 26-letter keyboard the chances of him typing the word banana on any given attempt would be: (1/26)(1/26)(1/26)(1/26)(1/26)(1/26). That's a pretty big number. However, if every successful letter the monkey punches in is kept, than the monkey really only stands a 1/26 chance at getting the first letter and then the second letter correctly. Such is how complexity arises. In other words, if the monkey randomly hit a "b" and the "b" was kept throughout the procedure (because it was the most suitable for its' environment), he would then move on through his trial and error process until an "a" was hit, and so on and so forth until the word "banana" was spelled out.
You can go ahead and try it on your own computer if you like. The fact remains that the chances for organized complexity greatly increase when a desired result or necessary result is warranted. So... what are the chances that the monkey will produce the correct letter on a 26-letter keyboard? Once again... 1/26! What are the chances he will type the word "banana" in the manner you suggest? 1/308915776.
That's a pretty large number. And yet, the evolutionary method works every time. In fact, if done for a long enough period using that method, a monkey could indeed type an entire work of Shakespeare.
REPLY: I have no doubt that you DONT believe a monkey could type Shakespeare given 30 billion years ! Youre not a real atheist and no one really is --- it takes wayyyy too much FAITH to be one...incredulous silly ludicrous FAITH. Its not evidence an atheist is looking for ; rather, its his WiLL that prevents him from admitting there has to be a very intelligent Creator for this very personal intelligent Universe which he is a part of. You do believe ; now, the next step is to put aside your pride, smokescreens, and admit. Then bow that knee while you can. Give The Creator his rightful place in your life and you will never be sorry you did. I went thru 10 years of giving smokescreens as a labeled atheist too, and im well familiar with the psychology behind it. Become a true Seeker/Skeptic instead of a closed minded willful atheist , for, according to atheist Dr. Francis Crick, youre looking at 10x40,000 th power that there is no intelligence for this universe. And, that is silly FAITH to put your hopes in. Regards.
I think life would be easier, not having to deal with the crap christians in particular spew towards non-christians.
It's also nice to believe in a saftey net. Unlike most 'christians', I'm not going to go through the song and dance. If 'he' IS such a merciful deity, he will judge me on the morality of my life and not by wether I believed in him.
I don't see how murderers and rapists can go to heaven, and yet those that led a moral life don't. Complete ludicrisy.
REPLY: Youve broken Gods moral law as all of us have. Hell isnt just for the Hitlers and Stalins of this world ; it is for all who willfully reject God and his free forgiveness of all sins committed while on earth. It will be for all who make up smokescreens that there is no such thing as the personal Theistic Creator so one can live as he/she likes . Gods standard is 'perfect' ,if you want him to judge you on how moral youve been in your life ; have you been perfect ? Nevermind comparing yourself to the most heinous of criminals . Its YOUR life that will be taken into account. Heres a brief test to see how moral youve been thus far in life : Have you : Ever lied, ever cheated someone, ever stole something that wasnt yours, used Gods precious name in vain, looked down upon a fellow human being made in Gods image like yourself, looked upon a woman as sexual parts, used a woman for temporary sexual relations ???? If youve done any of these once, then youve failed Gods test based on morality. There isnt ONE human being thats passed this simple test. But Christ did when he lived on earth and that made him the perfect sacrifice for us. He said he was the Son of God who came to be a ransom for many. Will you allow him to be a sufficient sacrifice for your many sins so you can experience Gods forgiveness and spend eternity WITH God instead of apart from him ? I trust you will.
REPLY: Youve broken Gods moral law as all of us have. Hell isnt just for the Hitlers and Stalins of this world ; it is for all who willfully reject God and his free forgiveness of all sins committed while on earth. It will be for all who make up smokescreens that there is no such thing as the personal Theistic Creator so one can live as he/she likes . Gods standard is 'perfect' ,if you want him to judge you on how moral youve been in your life ; have you been perfect ? Nevermind comparing yourself to the most heinous of criminals . Its YOUR life that will be taken into account. Heres a brief test to see how moral youve been thus far in life : Have you : Ever lied, ever cheated someone, ever stole something that wasnt yours, used Gods precious name in vain, looked down upon a fellow human being made in Gods image like yourself, looked upon a woman as sexual parts, used a woman for temporary sexual relations ???? If youve done any of these once, then youve failed Gods test based on morality. There isnt ONE human being thats passed this simple test. But Christ did when he lived on earth and that made him the perfect sacrifice for us. He said he was the Son of God who came to be a ransom for many. Will you allow him to be a sufficient sacrifice for your many sins so you can experience Gods forgiveness and spend eternity WITH God instead of apart from him ? I trust you will.
And what makes the christian god more probable than the FSM?
Read the following by a staunch atheist himself...Dr. Francis Crick, CoDiscoverer of the DNA Structure ; if you think of yourself as an atheist, then you have enormous FAITH at 10x40,000 th power !!! :
Creationists always try to state something dramatic like the tornado in a junkyard turns into a 727 but they always ignore the fundamental concept of evolution. You like to state these impossible statistics but you're not grasping the concept that we're not talking about a single cell turning into a full grown human being in the blink of an eye. We're talking about very small incremental steps that don't require these astronomical odds and the fact that organisms accumulate beneficial genetic traits that allow them to survive and pass along those genetics to the future generations. These small changes accumulate over vast amounts of time and result in a process known as evolution.
REPLY: I have no doubt that you DONT believe a monkey could type Shakespeare given 30 billion years ! Youre not a real atheist and no one really is --- it takes wayyyy too much FAITH to be one...incredulous silly ludicrous FAITH. Its not evidence an atheist is looking for ; rather, its his WiLL that prevents him from admitting there has to be a very intelligent Creator for this very personal intelligent Universe which he is a part of. You do believe ; now, the next step is to put aside your pride, smokescreens, and admit. Then bow that knee while you can. Give The Creator his rightful place in your life and you will never be sorry you did. I went thru 10 years of giving smokescreens as a labeled atheist too, and im well familiar with the psychology behind it. Become a true Seeker/Skeptic instead of a closed minded willful atheist , for, according to atheist Dr. Francis Crick, youre looking at 10x40,000 th power that there is no intelligence for this universe. And, that is silly FAITH to put your hopes in. Regards.
Oh give me a break. I highly doubt that you were ever an Atheist. In fact, I'd imagine that someone who was indeed a prior Atheist would have a little less in-your-face blatant rudeness to someone like me. Face it, I don't believe in God and that bothers you to the end that you feel the incessant need to badger me with your garbage excuse for arguments.
It seems you can't just leave us alone. Every single "Atheist" thread on this forum has been inundated by your proselytizing and ridiculous arguments. Face it, David, you're basically a Ray Comfort follower who thinks their arguments are made of stone. Rather, I liken them to troubleshooting my way out of a wet paper bag.
For the record, and I believe I've told you this before, if there were ever an attitude that drives me further and further away from Christianity it's yours. Regardless, you're still trying to posit proofs of a Creator, but you forget that even if a Creator exists it isn't necessarily the Christian one. Why am I automatically defaulted to the god of YOUR choice, David? Instead, if a Creator does exist... I think I'd like to believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster and not the Christian God.
To the OP: I am an atheist and struggled with wanting to believe for many years, knowing that I simply didn't. I think it is brave of you to post this question, as making such a statement seems to send people into camps. I would assume it is the same for bi-sexual people - other people telling you to get off the fence and pick a side. For me, and I only speak for myself, the road to "disbelief" was riddled with anxiety, arrogance, and the like, but now, after 20 years on this path labeled atheism, I have found a way to reconcile my utter disbelief in a creator and my belief that the I am connected to an organism, the universe, whatever one calls it, that is greater than my comprehension. When I was part of established religion (typical protestant upbringing) I had access to a "euphoria" and I related that to my belief with a god. Not the fall down praise Jesus euphoria, but those moments in prayer or meditation where you FEEL the connection. When I let go of my belief I think maybe I thought those moments had lost their validity. It took me a long time to re-frame my thinking about those moments and understand the feelings were valid and it is a consciousness I can still tap into without belief in god or a creator.
I have never wished I could be a believer in the sense of any particular religion, or wanted to go to church, etc. The only time I can say I wished I believed in some sort of divine intervention was in 2005 when my son was nearly killed in an auto accident. (He recovered completely, thanks to good luck, his good previous health and youth, modern medicine and caring people.) At the time, as he lay in the ICU, I wondered how much comfort it might be to me if I believed prayers would help him.
In any case, no one in our family came out of that experience a believer--not even my son, who at 22 is agnostic.
Not only did I wish I was a believer this morning but a creationist too. Had some very important biology exams today and after nearly 4 hours of long questions I felt like
writing "Jesus is the way" on one that asked me why some scientists didn't call a mule Equus mulus.
Far from it, I felt a freedom when I accepted the fact that there was no god. I just find it hard to understand how others can’t see the truth.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
