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Here is a little something to chew on, written by a King of Israel a few hundred years before Christ. Some of you might have heard of him, his name was David. Wrote a good chunk of the book of Psalms. This is the 53rd psalm, first five verses.
1 Only fools say in their hearts,
“There is no God.”
They are corrupt, and their actions are evil;
not one of them does good!
2 God looks down from heaven
on the entire human race;
he looks to see if anyone is truly wise,
if anyone seeks God.
3 But no, all have turned away;
all have become corrupt.
No one does good,
not a single one! 4 Will those who do evil never learn?
They eat up my people like bread
and wouldn’t think of praying to God.
5 Terror will grip them,
terror like they have never known before.
God will scatter the bones of your enemies.
You will put them to shame, for God has rejected them.
Of course, this is just the bible. Don't need to glean anything from that book now do we?
True - not much to glean from here.
I feel that it is obvious that ancient kings are not qualified to describe the nature of reality and/or God.
Didn't expect everyone on the thread to fall on their knees and repent, lol.
Moderator cut: edited out due to "no proselytizing" sticky
Personally, I don't fall into some of the comments I see here of why a person has faith in God. I am not a criminal, don't break laws, am a good parent, a good son, a good brother, a good neighbor. I am not illiterate, not anti science or education (hold a Masters Degree), not superstitious, and believe it or not, love all people, not prejudiced or racist...However, I do realize there is more to me than what I see. There is an eternal part of me, a part that will continue when this life is done.
Good, you sound like a decent human being.
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This requires a belief that God is. Still I believe there is empirical evidence of God... this wonderful earth we call home, the magnificent earth suits we live in, the automatic love a parent experiences when a child is born. Raw, cold science cannot explain the wonder of all these things. All these things point to a wonderful designer, a master architect, a creator.
So to be a good, decent human being requires believe? Who said that and where??
Are you saying you won't be if you don't believe?
Raw cold science has guts to say "we don't know, but we're trying to research and find out". I can't say the same about religious people, to bad they don't research.
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I don't come here at all to condemn, to point at anyone being evil (will point to my own evil first before I call anyone else evil). I do come in sadness that most of you here deny the one being in all of eternity that loves you more than you could ever know love, because he is love itself.
Don't be sad, rather enjoy your life and don't contemplate our denials.
Saintmarks: He certainly has shown his 'love' in strange ways: genocide, murder and rape being three. They are right there in the 'holy book'. I am sorry that you feel that we cannot be good and decent without a deity. Leviticus is frightful reading. And Jesus said that he did not come to replace the old brutal, draconian laws.
Of course, I don't believe that there is a god. The Christian version certainly isn't worthy of worship.
To answer the OP . . . NO . . . there is no such thing. Everything is natural and everything is God. Science is the study of the attributes of God. Freedom of religion means that the descriptions of our God can vary all over the place including the "indifferent, purposeless " one called Nature by scientists.
I feel that man created a god to keep from taking responsibility for his own actions. If a guy is having a bad string of luck because he made a bunch of really bad choices he can always feel better by thinking he is being "tested" by this god-thing, like he is so special that HE gets chosen to be tested. And,....if it really goes all to hell, then....it's the devils work, ergo, it didn't matter that he was inept to begin with, he is being TESTED!!!!! If not by the gawd, then by the devil. Tain't his fault.
Saintmarks: He certainly has shown his 'love' in strange ways: genocide, murder and rape being three. They are right there in the 'holy book'. I am sorry that you feel that we cannot be good and decent without a deity. Leviticus is frightful reading. And Jesus said that he did not come to replace the old brutal, draconian laws.
Of course, I don't believe that there is a god. The Christian version certainly isn't worthy of worship.
Jesus most certainly did come and change the law structure. He announced that he was the fulfillment of the law and on mankinds behalf died on the cross and absorbed the penalty of not keeping the law. Everything changed about the law because of Jesus.
Funny, the moderator edited verses from my second post that showed God's love for all, but kept the original verses from my first post. My intent for the first post was in line with the OPs question, the scriptural passage the one that came to mind that most clearly was in line with the subject on the table.
God is a good of judgment yet. But the whole of scripture is his mercy triumphing over judgment. His mercy is free for those who come to him, the same theme from Genesis thru the New Testament.
So many atheists and agnostics love to harp on the judgment side and refuse to see that mercy is first and foremost on God's heart. The judgment is still there because there is no justice as a concept without a just God behind it. When one refuses the mercy time and time again, then all that is left is judgment. It is not God's heart or desire, but it is there and this is the choice that some will make, in fact Jesus said it would be a wide path that choose this, the narrow way was thru him.
So to be a good, decent human being requires believe? Who said that and where??
Are you saying you won't be if you don't believe?
My point was that to believe in a spritual realm and an eternal existence outside of this physical body, one most have a concept of God. The goodness of humanity was not my point. However I would say the good that can be found in mankind, even that those that deny him, is still a gift from him.... "He causes it to rain on the just and the unjust...."
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Originally Posted by ShepsMom
Raw cold science has guts to say "we don't know, but we're trying to research and find out". I can't say the same about religious people, to bad they don't research.
This is a shallow and totally unfounded statement to make, can you not admit? If they don't come to your same conclusion, then they never researched?
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Originally Posted by ShepsMom
Don't be sad, rather enjoy your life and don't contemplate our denials.
My self worth and reason for living doesn't hinge on your denial, yet the God I know and have a relationship with won't let me not care.
True - not much to glean from here.
I feel that it is obvious that ancient kings are not qualified to describe the nature of reality and/or God.
I would say the writings of an ancient king about God that have survived thru millenia and still are in a book that is perenially the best seller deserve to be considered an authority on the subject.
All you atheists, I really admire you and have a love for each of you even tho I don't know you. I respect your position moreso than the shallow Christian that attends a church and gives lip service to God but doesn't care for his word or ways in any regular interaction.
Scripture speaks of this "I would rather you be hot or cold, the luke warm I will spew out of my mouth"
It has been an honor to chat with some of you, but will leave the discussion to others. Thank you for letting me post.............Saintmarks (screen name I chose is for the rural community in GA where I grew up, not a patting myself on the back because I think I am something special, FWIW)
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