Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Don't be concerned. Those people will exist whether they are allowed to speak their mind on the internet or not. May as well let it happen so that they can be countered
Thank god (but not literally) for some intelligent comment at last. I spent a couple of miserable weeks trying hard to meet the fundies in their own level, and I came away confirmed in my belief that I happen to know the bible far better than most of them do. They sure hate that, I can tell you.
This lot are saturated in negativity, as I tried to point out, but just try saying anything too unsettling on these forums and you pay the cost! That they should be afforded special protection in this way is outrageous - but complaint is useless, it seems.
Quote:
It's not illegal to incite hatred. And it shouldn't be. Hatred is not a crime. People can hate whoever they want. Let's not call in the thought police. It's action that matters.
Point taken, Frank, but I am writing from the UK where incitement to hatred is now against the law. May you soon follow in America! Not so much the thought police (terrible thought) but a measure a civilised society needs to take in the face of the danger to ordinary citizens when exposed to the unrestrained violence that has all too often exploded on our streets (here in Britain, at least).
I realise, reading your post, that I may have given the impression that I am advocating some form of CENSORSHIP where the fundies are concerned, but to say that is too simplistic. I do think, however, that the guidelines here are not strong enough to counter their blatant, ill-informed bigotry.
Let them say it as they see it by all means, but there is a conspicuous absence of balance at work here, simply because they are often protected from open criticism on these forums, as often as not. (as I found to my cost). All I ask is that that they be IMPARTIALLY moderated, which is clearly not the case as things stand.
Quote:
Christian homophobia needs to be challenged - not silenced.
I agree 100%...
If we seek to silence these hate-mongers, we are no better than they are. But our challenge to their intolerance needs to be ratcheted up several notches, as they get away without being challenged loud enough, or often enough... that is what I'm saying.
The bible is quite clear on all sexual misconduct. Homosexuality is one of them.
It would be foolish to deny that this area of sexuality is complex. It is another feature of fallen and sinful mankind. No more or less than any other. But it is sinful.
Dear Elizabeth, I am deeply flattered that you followed me here to this level-headed forum from the Christian forum where we crossed swords recently!
But please go easy on that little word sin that you are so fond of using... With all due respect, I really am very tired of it...[/i]
brianrees said..."Let them say it as they see it by all means, but there is a conspicuous absence of balance at work here, simply because they are often protected from open criticism on these forums, as often as not. (as I found to my cost). All I ask is that that they be IMPARTIALLY moderated, which is clearly not the case as things stand.
Gay people have the highest death rate between 15 and 40 of anyother group in society.
They have the highest rates of disease and depression of anyother group.
At a minimum the life choice is not one that leads to happiness, or long life.
So no matter what one thinks, the choice to be gay is self destructive and should be illegal in order to protect those that have a weakness in that area....
We have to wear seatbelts when we drive, so i think that some rules on behaviour wouldn't be a bad idea... It use to be illegal to commit sodomy in all 50 states, and still is in many countries.
Gay people have the highest death rate between 15 and 40 of anyother group in society.
They have the highest rates of disease and depression of anyother group.
At a minimum the life choice is not one that leads to happiness, or long life.
So no matter what one thinks, the choice to be gay is self destructive and should be illegal in order to protect those that have a weakness in that area....
We have to wear seatbelts when we drive, so i think that some rules on behaviour wouldn't be a bad idea... It use to be illegal to commit sodomy in all 50 states, and still is in many countries.
godspeed,
freedom
Ridiculous! You are actually advocating laws against gays? There is a reason gays have a very hard struggle in life. First of all it is NOT a choice or a weakness, but the biggest reason is religious bigotry and ignorance such as you are displaying here.
Ridiculous! You are actually advocating laws against gays? There is a reason gays have a very hard struggle in life. First of all it is NOT a choice or a weakness, but the biggest reason is religious bigotry and ignorance such as you are displaying here.
Your the only one that has brought religion into this argument...
Regardless of belief, it is a dangerous and harmful lifestyle, schools are teaching young children about it being good and normal and it is self destructive and dangerous...
Who is biased, who is the fanatics? Why promote a life choice with such a high rate of early death and disease. The numbers don't lie... There is no other group of people that have more young death and disease than Homosexuals.
So no matter what one thinks, the choice to be gay is self destructive and should be illegal in order to protect those that have a weakness in that area....
Freedom, you're calling it a choice but it clearly isn't. I happen to be heterosexual but I didn't sit down one day and make a choice to be one. It's an attraction to the opposite sex that happens whether I like it or not (actually I do like it) and it's not something I could just make disappear if someone told me it was sinful. It's exactly the same thing with homosexuals, why on earth would someone choose to be part of a group that is probably the most despised group somewhere after murderers and child molestors?
Freedom, you're calling it a choice but it clearly isn't. I happen to be heterosexual but I didn't sit down one day and make a choice to be one. It's an attraction to the opposite sex that happens whether I like it or not (actually I do like it) and it's not something I could just make disappear if someone told me it was sinful. It's exactly the same thing with homosexuals, why on earth would someone choose to be part of a group that is probably the most despised group somewhere after murderers and child molestors?
That's your opinion, there are examples of people choosing not to be gay... and choosing to be gay...
The argument that people wouldn't choose a behaviour that is condemned is hollow... Drug addicts, Alchoholics, Prostitute's, Porno actors, choose to do things that are despised by society as well.
I'm not saying that people don't have a challenge with the urge to act out homosexuality, i just know it's not something that a person has to be sealed to, it can be overcome, and has been by many people, and now they live happily ever after.
Just like the recovering sex addict, drug addict, alchoholic, prostitute etc...
Gay people have the highest death rate between 15 and 40 of anyother group in society.
They have the highest rates of disease and depression of anyother group.
At a minimum the life choice is not one that leads to happiness, or long life.
So no matter what one thinks, the choice to be gay is self destructive and should be illegal in order to protect those that have a weakness in that area....
We have to wear seatbelts when we drive, so i think that some rules on behaviour wouldn't be a bad idea... It use to be illegal to commit sodomy in all 50 states, and still is in many countries.
godspeed,
freedom
FREEDOM you call yourself? A touch ironic that, wouldn't you say?
Firstly then, please supply the exact data about gay deaths before you start brandishing unqualified statistics in support of your argument. (if you want to be taken remotely seriously).
And secondly, remember to include the figures for suicides among young gay men, as well as the deaths from direct assault from bigots.
And relax, sodomy is unlikely to be made compulsory for all, although I doubt you would find it too easy to find a willing partner anywhere, given the harshness of your views.
Now I have realised you are serious in advocating the making of homosexuality illegal, I have managed to stop laughing. Do you ever think through your ideas or consider the implications of what you say?
Please get used to the basic facts. Nature, for whatever reason, has ALWAYS produced gay people at a fairly standard percentage of the population, and not just in the human species. Furthermore, Nature is very likely to go on doing the same thing, regardless of your personal inability to handle this fact.
Have you heard of the old British legend of King Canute trying to order the tide not to come in, thinking the ocean should obey his command? As you can guess, the Ocean took no notice whatever of Canute, much to his annoyance.
That is exactly your position!
According to you, then, a large number of babies would be born criminals from the womb - because gay people are born, and not converted to their orientation. All modern research tends to this view, so again, Sir, GET USED TO IT.
So at what age would you start arresting these children? Hitler and his henchmen are long dead by now, so you can't apply to him for advice. He, too, displayed a hatred of gays, as well as other minorities, and filled the concentration camps with as many as he could round up.
PLEASE let not this horrific and inhumane chapter in History repeat itself in modern day America, because you are already opening the doors to such barbarities by even suggesting re-criminalisation of homosexuality. Have you no compassion at all for what you don't understand?
I'm sure the average American tax-payer would be delighted to fork out a huge increase in taxation to build the hundreds of extra prisons that would be needed. I guess the public would be overjoyed to see so many of their favourite entertainers sent behind bars? And how about the economy, as you would have to arrest about 10% of all employees in every profession, including the medical profession. Who'd miss a few million doctors, specialists and nurses? Are any of these the destructive people you talk about?
And best not even mention the defence forces...
Good idea? - think again, Mr. Freedom, Sir.
As for seatbelts, I fail to see the connection. The Gay lifestyle is NOT, as you would have us believe, a car crash. When gay people are accorded the same courtesy as everyone else when it comes to live-and-let-live, you will find that we represent a valuable, happy and uniquely colourful branch of society, and in no way inferior to you.
It used to be the case that black Americans were the target of this sort of negative discrimination, but we now, fortunately, live in more enlightened times. Feel free to come on-board.
Why Oh Why can't you find it in your heart to turn your condemnation into love? -- it is the ONLY possible way forward in this crazy world. (Ask Jesus)...
Last edited by brianrees; 10-25-2008 at 09:44 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
