Emory Misrepresents Data for Rankings (Atlanta: buy, top schools, university)

[PeteATL41]

Seems as though Emory is in the same league as the APS...makes me proud to be an alum...

Emory University misrepresented student data *| ajc.com

[Mishap]

Although Emory's cheating scandal is a bit more concentrated inside the Office of Admissions, it's still pretty egregious given the level of changes they made since it could shift them as far as 5-10 spots down the list and have massive implications on the # of students that apply which could further ding the school's selectivity.

2/3 of students that get into Emory don't attend (yield is 33%) suggesting it's very much a safety school for top schools (Harvard's yield is 81%). This suggests that a whole lot of those SAT/ACT stats were for people that wound up attending Ivies rather than the actual student body.

At the minimum it'll ding the school in short term stats when it gets dropped out of the top 20 (along w/ that inevitable asterisk). So all you alumni will soon be asked to belly up to the bar and donate heavily so they can bribe some top tier students to choose Emory over other schools. Wonder if you'll be able to see them dumping Coke stock to fund more scholarships.

[pignchick]

OK, first of all I think that these rankings are of limited value. These rankings may be used as a guide or for bragging rights, but not too many prospective students probably use these rankings as their sole factor. A degree is a degree, and in my opinion professional degrees (doctor, lawyer, CPA, actuary, engineer, etc.) are the ones with the most intrinsic value. So, if you can get a scholarship go to Emory. If you are like most people, you should seek out the best bang for the buck, which would probably be a public school (Georgia State or GA Tech in Atlanta), because most employers just want you to have the degree/license. And then once you get the job, you still have to prove that you are worth keeping around. So, a degree from Emory might help you incrementally get in the door, but I am not sure it is worth the huge price, especially if you are getting some type of liberal art degree.

That being said... Emory has created this image of exclusivity to justify their absurd and ever rising tuition, even though wages have been stagnant for a decade. So, there is probably more pressure for them to stay at the top to protect their image as only having the best and the brightest. Now it appears that they have actually lowered their standards. What does that mean? Are they lowering their standards because they cannot attract enough students at the higher standard?

Also, this is not as bad at the APS scandal. That was systemic cheating on tests. If that happened Emory’s reputation and Emory alumni’s reputation would be trashed.

[Mishap]

^Tell that to the 30% of Emory law grads that wind up working in fields that don't require law degrees.

I'm sure Emory's not the only school juicing it's #s. My alma mater had a selectivity in the low mid 20's when I went and now it's fallen into the teens. Either these schools are all getting super picky (Harvard's probably going to fall below 5%) or kids are shotgunning applications in a hail mary attempt to get into a school w/ tuition covered for the middle class.

[FromGA]

I have seen Emory referenced as a near Ivy (by random city-data posters in other city forums). I was amazed, and mildly amused because of the potential that we had a near Ivy in our backyard!

For those in the know, was Emory deserving previously of this term?

And how about now, after this news?

[FromGA]

Originally Posted by pignchick

Now it appears that they have actually lowered their standards. What does that mean? Are they lowering their standards because they cannot attract enough students at the higher standard?

What do you mean they lowered their standard? They potentially inflated their SAT score by including all applicants (possibly Harvard material applicants).

Originally Posted by pignchick

Also, this is not as bad at the APS scandal. That was systemic cheating on tests. If that happened Emory’s reputation and Emory alumni’s reputation would be trashed.

Systemic cheating. Done in different ways, based on level of education, and what they needed to see happen. They are apples and oranges, but both bad.

[Mishap]

Originally Posted by FromGA

I have seen Emory referenced as a near Ivy (by random city-data posters in other city forums). I was amazed, and mildly amused because of the potential that we had a near Ivy in our backyard!

For those in the know, was Emory deserving previously of this term?

And how about now, after this news?

It's by no means a bad school but it plays in a highly competitive field. Even w/o its inflated #s, it remains far more selective than UGA for liberal arts degrees (among the toughest in the South) and it's not like we have a lot of alternatives for very good med schools in state.

The problem is its attempts to move further up the rankings (and attract more top applicants) has stalled out due to its high tuition and inability to offer free tuition for all middle class students. No matter how many high priced rock star professors you buy or beautiful facilities you build, free tuition from the Ivies (crazy expensive to offer) walls off the truly choice students.

In the past if you were the consummate overachiever, you'd get free rides at places like UGA and maybe a partial to Emory. Now, get your foot in the door at UPenn and you're guaranteed no tuition if you're family isn't wealthy. What happens now is every kid in the world w/ a 3.0 or higher applies to Harvard w/ pipe dreams of getting in. Those schools get to claim they reject 90% of applicants and reinforce their prestige.

[AcidSnake]

When some folks try to explain away & justify the actions of true racism such as what was posted in the thread I've revealed below, I am actually quite happy when I am the recipient of ad hominem attacks by those same folks.

It means that my truth is more than what some people can bear to read, hear, and acknowledge. Thanks for making my errant and oh-so harmless statement more than what it is.

I shall await the eventually slapdown from the God of City-data.


//www.city-data.com/forum/atlan...l#post19635837

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by Mishap

2/3 of students that get into Emory don't attend (yield is 33%) suggesting it's very much a safety school for top schools (Harvard's yield is 81%). This suggests that a whole lot of those SAT/ACT stats were for people that wound up attending Ivies rather than the actual student body.
.

Not exactly. I'm not saying that isn't a plausible solution in some cases and even many cases, but there are dynamics going on too.

One of the things about more expensive private schools is many people apply and then choose not to go upon realization of cost. This is especially true for people who applied for a scholarship via religious groups (it is a methodist school) or academic standing, got accepted without the scholarship award.

Now some of the absolute highest demand schools ask specific questions as to whether people -need- the scholarship in order to attend, which can be used in consideration in accepting someone.

We can't really analyze the situation without more data. (and perhaps the data is questionable, even if it is given! yikes!)

[plessthanpointohfive]

I can say this applies to me. Back in 199X I applied to a college that resembles Emory in that it's vaguely religious (Emory is soooooo not actually Methodist) and highly regarded. I got a partial scholarship (academic based) but the tuition was still going to be about $25,000/year. So I didn't go. I ended up at the University of Southwestern Louisiana, which is not University of Louisiana at Lafayette.

It's all good because I met the love of my life there. And HE is a professor at Emory. But in the medical school, which is not connected to this report academically.