No HOA in my Heighborhood, but One wants to Start: What to Watch Out for? (Lawrenceville: how much, townhomes)

[Snowplow guy]

Regarding HOAs, We live in a private development in Pa. where contributing to the road fund is voluntary. The money is used for snow plowing and the surplus goes to road repairs. On an average 16 property owners out of 30 pay each year. As a result the roads stay in a bad state of repair and the freeloaders get a free ride.

[Thulsa]

The biggest thing to watch out for with HOA agreements is how the agreement is amended.

I previously lived in a community (near Alpharetta) that originally had strict but not too unreasonable restrictions. The catch was that it was too easy to amend and add new rules.
We eventually wound up with a no home-business rule that was later amended to allow the HOA officers to hire locksmiths and a sheriff's deputy to enter anyone's house at any time to search for and remove any equipment that may be suspected of being used for home businesses.
And yes, it was just that vague. They had hired an attorney to send us all a letter explaining how this was legal and enforceable in Georgia.
We no longer live there, but I would not be surprised if they now have a rule that underwear must be changed every day.

[Snowplow guy]

Here in this part of Pa, the townships and boroughs enforce zoning laws. Also the law can't enter your house without a warrant. Any level of governing bodies from HOAs to the Feds will try to do an end run around the constitution to expedite order. Years ago, the Dog Law Enforcement Office, part of the Pa. Dept of Ag. decided dog wardens could enter a house on a complaint without a warrant. It didn't happen. If an HOA gets that out of control I would tell them to come back with a cop and a warrant and then vote the bums out or sue. If your "Protective covenants" are amended to allow warrantless searches I would hire a lawyer. If this is the HOA rule before the buyer moves in, too bad for the buyer. That would be like joining a cult.

[IC_deLight]

Originally Posted by Snowplow guy

Here in this part of Pa, the townships and boroughs enforce zoning laws. Also the law can't enter your house without a warrant. Any level of governing bodies from HOAs to the Feds will try to do an end run around the constitution to expedite order. Years ago, the Dog Law Enforcement Office, part of the Pa. Dept of Ag. decided dog wardens could enter a house on a complaint without a warrant. It didn't happen. If an HOA gets that out of control I would tell them to come back with a cop and a warrant and then vote the bums out or sue. If your "Protective covenants" are amended to allow warrantless searches I would hire a lawyer. If this is the HOA rule before the buyer moves in, too bad for the buyer. That would be like joining a cult.

HOA corporations are not governments. Proponents want to circumvent the restraints against government imposed by state and federal constitutions.

[AnsleyPark]

HOAs can certainly serve good. In my hood, they maintain the community swimming pool and tennis courts. They manage private security patrols and insure that the local streets are well maintained. Yes, they do go overboard with building codes and what you can and cannot do with your yard. And, yes, some of the folks on the HOA board are there to "impose their will." But, all in all, I think it preserves the attractiveness and amenities of the neighborhood.

[IC_deLight]

Originally Posted by AnsleyPark

HOAs can certainly serve good. In my hood, they maintain the community swimming pool and tennis courts. They manage private security patrols and insure that the local streets are well maintained. Yes, they do go overboard with building codes and what you can and cannot do with your yard. And, yes, some of the folks on the HOA board are there to "impose their will." But, all in all, I think it preserves the attractiveness and amenities of the neighborhood.

More often than not "aesthetics" is just a pretext for extorting money from or causing harm to other homeowners. Board members always think their place is just fine but along with vendors that profit from findings of "non-compliance" will have no problem finding fault with other people's property. It reaches the point where fundamental hallmarks of "ownership" become non-existent and the use and enjoyment of your own property is significantly impaired.

The folks proposing an HOA corp are doing so because they want to control everyone else. In terms of "what to look out for" the answer would be the very objective of these folks: an involuntary membership HOA corporation with assessment, borrowing, and foreclosure power whose debts and operations are secured using your home through perpetual liens that can never be paid off.

[AnsleyPark]

Originally Posted by IC_deLight

More often than not "aesthetics" is just a pretext for extorting money from or causing harm to other homeowners. Board members always think their place is just fine but along with vendors that profit from findings of "non-compliance" will have no problem finding fault with other people's property. It reaches the point where fundamental hallmarks of "ownership" become non-existent and the use and enjoyment of your own property is significantly impaired.

The folks proposing an HOA corp are doing so because they want to control everyone else. In terms of "what to look out for" the answer would be the very objective of these folks: an involuntary membership HOA corporation with assessment, borrowing, and foreclosure power whose debts and operations are secured using your home through perpetual liens that can never be paid off.

I have not experienced these things. Where did you experience them?

[IC_deLight]

Originally Posted by AnsleyPark

I have not experienced these things. Where did you experience them?

What things have you not experienced?

Have you been an "owner" of property burdened by an involuntary membership HOA corporation? The marketing folks like to euphemistically call them "mandatory associations". Involuntary membership is imposed by restrictive covenant.

If you have, then the restrictive covenants that imposed involuntary membership likely also granted the HOA corporation a perpetual lien against your property that could never be paid off. This isn't unique to some area of the country.

The perpetual lien gives the HOA corporation the ability to foreclose on the property. It goes downhill from there. The vendors latch onto involuntary membership, perpetual liens, and foreclosure powers. They will entangle their junk fees and "fines" with assessments in order to extort the homeowners using the HOA's foreclosure power.

Involuntary membership and perpetual liens also means that whatever debt the HOA corp board racks up - is your responsibility and your house is security for the debt they racked up.

It continues going downhill from there.

Where do you want to start?

[Joe_S]

It all depends on who is running the HOA. If you get control freaks or power mongers (such as the ones running the Cedars I HOA in Clark County, Washington), then you will have nothing but headaches!

[seashell55]

Originally Posted by Joe_S

It all depends on who is running the HOA. If you get control freaks or power mongers (such as the ones running the Cedars I HOA in Clark County, Washington), then you will have nothing but headaches!

This is an old thread. But as long as you're here, let me give you rule #1 for HOAs. Even if you have good people running your HOA now, you're still only one election away from disaster. The control freaks manage to get on the Board of Directors and stay there.