Atlanta traffic (Commerce, Dallas, Buckhead: how much, light rail, budget)

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by neil0311

There's a huge difference between dealing with the reality and "burying your head in the sand." My comments specifically are pointing out that this false narrative about the severity and relative level of traffic in Atlanta is just that, a false narrative.

Please link to one study, list, or survey, from private or government sources that shows Atlanta even reaching the top 10 in severity of traffic congestion. Fact is we're not. Most such lists have us in the high teens or twenties. Again, that's not to say that when you're personally in traffic that it's not annoying, but that's just stating the obvious.

Time and again on this board the scare mongers and those with a specific point of view tell us how dire things are and will be, unless we ban cars and spend billions on their pet projects. The failure to pass the TSPLOST a few years ago was supposed to spell the death nell for the Atlanta area. Businesses were going to leave or fail to come. Individuals were going to leave the area or fail to come. The suburbs would be vacant and desolate as everyone moved back to the inner city to escape the horrors of the suburbs.

It was a great narrative, and might make a great series on AMC, but the inconvenient truth is none of it happened.

I agree. If folks get on the super Slab at peak times then of course they will encounter heavy traffic. That's true in all cities and we are by no means the worst.

Most of the time, however, traffic in the ATL is not bad. These doomsday scenarios are greatly exaggerated.

[JoeP]

I agree. If folks get on the super Slab at peak times then of course they will encounter heavy traffic. That's true in all cities and we are by no means the worst.

Most of the time, however, traffic in the ATL is not bad. These doomsday scenarios are greatly exaggerated

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This is exactly what's wrong with the mentality of many here. It's "normal" traffic for cities etc etc.
Those who call out what is beyond normal are "ranting" and just pushing "doomsday" narratives...

[bu2]

Originally Posted by JoeP

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This is exactly what's wrong with the mentality of many here. It's "normal" traffic for cities etc etc.
Those who call out what is beyond normal are "ranting" and just pushing "doomsday" narratives...

No, its those of us who have a lot of experience in other cities. Atlanta is bad for its size. Its not as bad as larger cities like NY, Chicago and LA. Its not bad compared to DC who is horrible. But the real issue is that Atlanta seems to lack an interest in doing anything about it and the denial by many that there actually is a problem. And unlike DC, it doesn't have a captive industry like the federal government. Most likely, Atlanta is going to start growing again faster than cities like NY, Chicago and LA.

As the economy and growth pick back up again its going to get worse real fast. Traffic got lighter from 2008-2011 while there was a lot of unemployment. When you already have heavy traffic, it only takes a little more to make a lot bigger problem (note the difference when school is out). At that point then you start to lose employers to competitors. It is already discouraging firms. That table Born2roll linked showed Atlanta as 4th worst in 2000 and 2005 when Atlanta was booming. Atlanta slipped to 7th after being harder hit by the recession than other cities.

And Atlanta would rank even worse on those surveys if it had traffic in every direction like many other cities. As it is, south and west really aren't nearly as bad as the north and east. But few people are moving there.

[JoeP]

Its not as bad as larger cities like NY, Chicago and LA. Its not bad compared to DC who is horrible

Who was comparing?? How Atlanta compares is irrelevant.

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by JoeP

Who was comparing?? How Atlanta compares is irrelevant.

It is completely relevant as to how Atlanta traffic compares with peer cities. It's awfully convenient for you to blast Atlanta on traffic issues then discount how it stacks up against other cities of similar size. You make it sound like Atlanta is unique with its horrible traffic, when it is actually much like any other city of 5-6 million.

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by bu2

No, its those of us who have a lot of experience in other cities. Atlanta is bad for its size. Its not as bad as larger cities like NY, Chicago and LA. Its not bad compared to DC who is horrible. But the real issue is that Atlanta seems to lack an interest in doing anything about it and the denial by many that there actually is a problem. And unlike DC, it doesn't have a captive industry like the federal government. Most likely, Atlanta is going to start growing again faster than cities like NY, Chicago and LA.

As the economy and growth pick back up again its going to get worse real fast. Traffic got lighter from 2008-2011 while there was a lot of unemployment. When you already have heavy traffic, it only takes a little more to make a lot bigger problem (note the difference when school is out). At that point then you start to lose employers to competitors. It is already discouraging firms. That table Born2roll linked showed Atlanta as 4th worst in 2000 and 2005 when Atlanta was booming. Atlanta slipped to 7th after being harder hit by the recession than other cities.

And Atlanta would rank even worse on those surveys if it had traffic in every direction like many other cities. As it is, south and west really aren't nearly as bad as the north and east. But few people are moving there.

Atlanta's traffic is a constant issue and is constantly being discussed in the media and in local governments. I'm not sure where you're getting that there is a lack of interest in improving traffic here, because remedies are always being considered and contemplated. These are very costly and the money has to come from somewhere, so it will not be happening overnight - unlike the massive population growth that did seemingly happen overnight. Changes are coming, and you only have to pay minimal attention to the news on the subject to know this.

It's hilarious that you seem to imply that the rest of us don't have experience with other cities just because we don't see things the way you do. How condescending can you be?

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by JoeP

..and there you have it. Unless its blind chamber of commerce cheerleading, this is what immature posters will respond with. Notice that the content is ignored in favor of straw men and juvenile attacks against me.

We have real problems that go beyond "well it's a big city etc"

Instead of people being so immature or dense to call that "sour grapes" maybe they should grow up.

You're funny...getting your feelings hurt and claiming personal attacks when you are calling people dense and immature. That really hurts your credibility.

Longtime members here are used to people bashing Atlanta for things like this that are common in other cities too. You act as if this is an Atlanta problem when it is commonly found in every city on Earth. Traffic problems have been around for decades, and it will take decades of work to fix them.

If you pay attention to the news at all you can easily know about improvements that are in the works and possible plans for the future - but digging up centuries-old roads and changing to a grid are not really options. We have to work with what we have in some cases because there aren't billions of dollars laying around to make such radical changes. I don't quite understand all the complaining about things like this...if you don't like the way things are then work to change them or move to a city that better meets your needs. There are options.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by arjay57

I agree. If folks get on the super Slab at peak times then of course they will encounter heavy traffic. That's true in all cities and we are by no means the worst.

Most of the time, however, traffic in the ATL is not bad. These doomsday scenarios are greatly exaggerated.

"Peak" time here is pretty long. It lasts past 9 and starts about the time school lets out and runs past 7. And of course, if there is a problem as happens fairly regularly, it really gets messy.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by JoeTarheel

Atlanta's traffic is a constant issue and is constantly being discussed in the media and in local governments. I'm not sure where you're getting that there is a lack of interest in improving traffic here, because remedies are always being considered and contemplated. These are very costly and the money has to come from somewhere, so it will not be happening overnight - unlike the massive population growth that did seemingly happen overnight. Changes are coming, and you only have to pay minimal attention to the news on the subject to know this.

It's hilarious that you seem to imply that the rest of us don't have experience with other cities just because we don't see things the way you do. How condescending can you be?

As opposed to those who see those who disagree with them as being part of some hidden conspiratorial agenda?

When you hear people claim (as someone did on here) Atlanta isn't in the top 20 worst, they are clearly demonstrating they aren't familiar with other cities or any studies of traffic.

When Atlanta actually starts doing things, then I will say there is interest. Talking doesn't indicate serious interest. When you compare what Atlanta has done since the Olympics to Charlotte, Dallas or Houston, Atlanta has zero interest.

[JoeP]

The Chamber of Commerce posters refuse to go off script.