GDOT proposing Atlanta rail? (Columbus, Savannah: school, university, professionals)

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

So you're going to hold fourthwarden to his set of assumptions while completely excusing yours.

Nice double standard you got going there.

Shhhh, you'll just give them more reasons to ignore actually doing any work, distracting from their burden of proof to find flaw with the professionally produced, multi-year, multi-state study examining in depth the topic of which we're discussing.

[toll_booth]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

Shhhh, you'll just give them more reasons to ignore actually doing any work, distracting from their burden of proof to find flaw with the professionally produced, multi-year, multi-state study examining in depth the topic of which we're discussing.

Haha, basically!

[toll_booth]

Originally Posted by MattCW

Yep

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_Highway_System

That's 356% over budget! See, that's GOVERNMENT WASTE and they should have never BUILT the thing!!!1!!

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

Because they are not as insanely individualistic as white Americans are. They also believe, to varying extents, in supporting the common good.

Wow. You need to check yourself with this reckless and divisive crap. I'm about as pro HSR as they come, but spewing this sort of venom lowers you to Trumps level.

[krogerDisco]

Originally Posted by MattCW

Yep

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_Highway_System

That's for the entire system. The difficulties we see in California is just between San Francisco and LA, nevermind a system.

[MikeHonchoATL]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

Exactly. You're also looking at more than just the air market. You're looking at competitive to driving, removing travel share from the interstate as well.

With the air market reduction, you've also opened up room for additional air service without needing to straight-up expand the airports. The airlines will have physical room to shift flights to places that HSR doesn't actually fit.

I didn't ignore the drivers. I made a ridiculously high assumption of essentially 100% of air travel converting to the train. This obviously isn't realistic and covers up for the drivers who might switch to rail. I don't think that number will be that high though, since if they are driving they probably need a car at the tail end of the trip or don't want to spend the $100+ to fly/ride the 1 way trip.

What number would you want to use in the analysis? I'm still waiting.

[MikeHonchoATL]

Originally Posted by MattCW

You're ignoring the intermediate stops. Unlike an airline which goes A-B, rail goes A-C-D-E-F-G-H-B (same endpoints, hence the ordering). For instance, Greenville-Charlotte has 122k per year. You're also ignoring that Atlanta to Charlotte is really just an extension of the SEHSR which will come south from DC through Richmond to Raleigh. A 220mph HSR route would put people in downtown DC in about 4 hours. Given flight time is already 2 hours, and most flights are to BWI or IAD, you're already at time-competitiveness with the airlines. That's before you factor in the intermediate markets, Athens, Greenville, etc.

Not ignoring the intermediate stops. I just don't think they will be that high. Look at the math I used. There is a significant extra built in for these. I just don't think that Athens - Greenville or Athens to Charlotte market is that strong.

So you what number should I add for these intermediate stops? Give me a number.

The point is, unless the number is even if you add an additional 6 million riders (absolutely unrealistic) to the 3 million I was using, you still have at least $120 of debt per ride to add on top of the $100 of operating costs.

This puts a floor price of $220 minimum one way average ride. This is not competitive.

[MikeHonchoATL]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

That's 356% over budget! See, that's GOVERNMENT WASTE and they should have never BUILT the thing!!!1!!

How does that justify investing in rail? If anything, it is an argument against it.

The money invested in roads 60 years ago is irrelevant to a decision on investment today.

[toll_booth]

Originally Posted by JMatl

Wow. You need to check yourself with this reckless and divisive crap. I'm about as pro HSR as they come, but spewing this sort of venom lowers you to Trumps level.

^ Triggered!

[MikeHonchoATL]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

Shhhh, you'll just give them more reasons to ignore actually doing any work, distracting from their burden of proof to find flaw with the professionally produced, multi-year, multi-state study examining in depth the topic of which we're discussing.

If this would operate at such a huge surplus, why not just get private business to fund the entire thing?

The fact that private industry won't build it is the first clue that it won't be profitable.