Two stadiums, two wildly different political outcomes (Atlanta, Smyrna: hotels, restaurants)

[green_mariner]

For me, this is about what it will do to rents in the adjancent areas. Rents are already rising in the Cumberland area. Once the stadium gets build, things will get crazier from there. Right now, the only reliably cheap areas to rent in Cobb County are kind of sketchy.

[chiatldal]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

It isn't a strawman. The city money for the Falcons Stadium came frome the Hotel-Motel tax, NOT the general tax payers or the general fund. Period.


The county money for the Braves Stadium came from the Geral fund, collected from general tax payers, and a previously voter-approved tax for a completely separate use.

It's straw man because that not issue yall care about, yall care about The Braves moving out of the city proper.

Yall CoA pro urban Progressive cheerleading Cobb conservative voters to reject this project for urban growth praising the same demographic that would also reject transit and other progressive issue in Cobb.

[netdragon]

Originally Posted by green_mariner

For me, this is about what it will do to rents in the adjancent areas. Rents are already rising in the Cumberland area. Once the stadium gets build, things will get crazier from there. Right now, the only reliably cheap areas to rent in Cobb County are kind of sketchy.

Cumberland / Vinings is cheap compared to comparable areas in the North perimeter.

If you move to a brand new "all the bells and whistles" type apartment then it's going to be at a huge premium, but if you move to Post Spring, for instance, which is a decently nice older apartment, then it's not going to be much worse than it was when I first moved down here over a decade ago.

Also, private rentals tend to be even better deals for their size (often because they have been owned much longer) and many of them are in HOA communities w/ swim/tennis.

[chiatldal]

Originally Posted by ATLTJL

I just think it's short-sighted. "Hey, let's spur economic development with a ball park!"

It may work in the short-term, but show me a suburban ball park or stadium that has a net positive long-term impact on its surrounding area. Do they exist?

For starts "suburban ball park or stadium" this is being built with a mix use components it's will be more urban than Tuner field.

I mention this in another thread, Cumberland is no where, it literally bolder the CoA, which is already consider small, base on distance for size LA, Dallas, Houston, Phoenix, New York, Chicago, San Diego, San Jose, Nashville, Charlotte, Columbus, Indianapolis, Denver and etc this would still be in the city. This is not remotely like putting a stadium in Arlington. Yall act like the Stadium is moving to Cherokee County or something. Or they are planing this with a completely suburban lay out.

It's important for the region as a whole that Cumberland and other districts does develop more urban and have economic success.

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by chiatldal

For starts "suburban ball park or stadium" this is being built with a mix use components it's will be more urban than Tuner field.

I mention this in another thread, Cumberland is no where, it literally bolder the CoA, which is already consider small, base on distance for size LA, Dallas, Houston, Phoenix, New York, Chicago, San Diego, San Jose, Nashville, Charlotte, Columbus, Indianapolis, Denver and etc this would still be in the city. This is not remotely like putting a stadium in Arlington. Yall act like the Stadium is moving to Cherokee County or something. Or they are planing this with a completely suburban lay out.

It's important for the region as a whole that Cumberland and other districts does develop more urban and have economic success.

I think the problem people have is the non-urban location, and they seem to forget that it's just outside the city limits. I do love the feel of going to a game downtown in any city...it's a more complete experience to me than in a less dynamic and more suburban area. But to each his own. Some people don't like going downtown at all and will love the new location.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by netdragon

Cumberland / Vinings is cheap compared to comparable areas in the North perimeter.

If you move to a brand new "all the bells and whistles" type apartment then it's going to be at a huge premium, but if you move to Post Spring, for instance, which is a decently nice older apartment, then it's not going to be much worse than it was when I first moved down here over a decade ago.

Also, private rentals tend to be even better deals for their size (often because they have been owned much longer) and many of them are in HOA communities w/ swim/tennis.

I checked Post Spring. A one bedroom goes for $1100/month. And that's the cheapest. I checked other communities as well. $1200/month and up for a one bedroom. The most I want to pay for a one bedroom is about $750/month. $800/month is pushing it. 1K per month for a one bedroom is ridiculous, period.

[MikeHonchoATL]

One is on time and on budget.

One is delayed and massively over budget.

Very different indeed.

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by netdragon

The biggest thing for home values right now (aside from townhomes and those that can benefit from an endless supply of new private schools) are Cobb needs to take back leadership for schools in the metro area. Now, don't get me wrong, Cobb schools are still good (e.g. my father just got statistics from his ivy league frat that shows Cobb public schools lead metro Atlanta in admissions from public schools in metro Atlanta) but there's some things they can do to decrease the discrepancy in number of distractions between high income schools versus schools with more income diversity like Smyrna.

Those are excellent points about the importance of the quality of public schools to home values and that Cobb schools are still good.

Though with the schools of East Cobb (led by the schools of Walton and its cluster) and West Cobb being recognized as some of the absolute best in not just only the state of Georgia but the entire Southeastern U.S., it's difficult to say that Cobb County Schools have retreated from a role of leadership in the Atlanta metro area.

Outside of the exceptional school clusters of East and West Cobb, it may be difficult for many schools to return to the high levels of achievement that the entire Cobb County school system may have experienced and enjoyed in the past just simply because of ongoing massive demographic changes that continue to happen throughout many parts of the county, particularly in and through the northern and southern parts of Cobb County.

Education is a much easier undertaking for a mostly white (95% white) and affluent county of only 300,000 people than it is for a much more racially, ethnically and socioeconomically diverse county of nearly three-quarters of a million people that is quickly approaching "majority-minority" status.

(...Nine of the 17 public high schools Cobb County (including Marietta High School) have student bodies in which racial and ethnic minorities are majority of the student population.)

With many students coming from disadvantaged households (single-parent households, households below the poverty level, households where very little if any English may be spoken, etc), it is extremely difficult to decrease the types of outside distractions that are known to have a direct impact on the educational environment and academic outcomes.

Considering that the demographics of the county are much different and much more challenging than they were 30-plus years ago when the county's population was over 90% white and overwhelmingly affluent, the Cobb County school system seems to do a really good job under the circumstances.

Cobb County is still considered by far to have one of the best school systems in both the state of Georgia and the Southeastern U.S. and still considered to be a leader at providing public education to school-aged children. Cobb County is just struggling with the same demographic changes and socioeconomic challenges that other top-flight school systems around the Atlanta metro region are dealing with.

[toll_booth]

Originally Posted by brownhornet

The funny part is, people are pissed about what he did in making the deal but celebrating about all of the development that came as a result of it.

Cumberland could have helped build that development without a new ballpark for a fraction of the cost. New stadiums are friggin' expensive.

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by brownhornet

The funny part is, people are pissed about what he did in making the deal but celebrating about all of the development that came as a result of it.

Originally Posted by toll_booth

Cumberland could have helped build that development without a new ballpark for a fraction of the cost. New stadiums are friggin' expensive.

I agree that Cumberland possibly could have helped build that new mixed-use development without an expensive new ballpark largely paid for with public funds.

The problem is that Cumberland likely would not have been able to attract the high number of new tenants it currently seems to be attracting to the area without a massive new draw such as an MLB (Major League Baseball) ballpark.

Cumberland likely would not have been able to attract the number of tenants it seems to be attracting to the area without a massive new draw like an MLB ballpark because the Cumberland area does not enjoy the high-capacity/Heavy Rail Transit link to Central Atlanta and the world-leading Atlanta Airport that competing satellite business districts like Perimeter and Buckhead do.

Like has been noted, without the new MLB stadium, Cumberland would continue to be at an increasing disadvantage to Perimeter and Buckhead because of the lack of a rail transit connection to Central Atlanta and the Airport.


Having a new MLB stadium in the district accomplishes two major objectives for the Cumberland district:

1) It enables the Cumberland district to attract a significantly higher number of commercial tenants to the area than it otherwise likely would have been able to do...

2) It increases the probability that the Cumberland district will receive rail transit service in the not-too-terribly-distant future (...because the increased traffic that will be generated by the new stadium and adjoining and surrounding development will likely help to reduce the voter opposition to rail transit in Cobb County and force the state to move on funding and building high-capacity transit up the I-75 Northwest corridor which is something that the Cobb County business community desperately wants).