Mind Blown! (airport, renewal, rating)

[citydwelling]

Originally Posted by markjames68

What I’d like to know is when he made that brief trip abroad, and what document was used to exit and re-enter the US.

If he did it as an adult, it’s on him. If he did it as a teenager, he would have known it wasn’t a US Passport.

According to the article that 80s_kid cited, he came to Atlanta in 1999 at the age of 7. He visited the UK for a month in 2005, when he would've been 12 or 13 years old. He lost legal status in 2006 at 13-14 years old, probably because of his parent overstaying their visa. He didn't know about the lack of legal status until sometime in 2017 when he was 24 or 25.

This is not exactly the behavior of someone who's conspired to immigrate illegally. He came here as a kid, lost his status because of his parents' poor choices, and despite doing exactly what he's supposed to do (apply for legal resident status) he's now locked in a cage for 23 hours a day.

[markjames68]

Originally Posted by citydwelling

According to the article that 80s_kid cited, he came to Atlanta in 1999 at the age of 7. He visited the UK for a month in 2005, when he would've been 12 or 13 years old. He lost legal status in 2006 at 13-14 years old, probably because of his parent overstaying their visa. He didn't know about the lack of legal status until sometime in 2017 when he was 24 or 25.

This is not exactly the behavior of someone who's conspired to immigrate illegally. He came here as a kid, lost his status because of his parents' poor choices, and despite doing exactly what he's supposed to do (apply for legal resident status) he's now locked in a cage for 23 hours a day.

So if he visited the UK in 2005, he would have no doubt known he was a UK citizen by the passport he held.

My guess (only a guess) is that his mother had some sort of status in 1999 which expired in 2005. It couldn’t be renewed in the US so she went to the UK and then re-entered with her son as a visitor.

He would have had derivative status as a visitor under her.

Here’s where the parenting part comes in. I have a 12 year old son. I would know that exiting and then re-entering as a temporary visitor was wrong and could backfire on him later in life. I would know that under Bush there was a lot of immigration talk. My son would ask me why he had a UK passport and not a US one.

As per an earlier message, he has siblings who have green cards. Why not him? What’s the missing piece here?

[chiatldal]

Originally Posted by Gulch

The "he was just a child" excuse dies when that person turns 18 and does nothing to fix their citizenship status.

Actually it makes worst....... "When they was just a child" that means this would be sending them away from the country, the culture, that they know and identify with and to a place they don't, and would be foreign to them.

And no, most child to adult don't apply because it's become a trap into itself that many children to adults fear. If theirs a hold political side trying fight them to have a political path to citizenship in the first place. A example is Trump not extending DACA and using the Dreamers as political hostage. currently their is no path to amnesty for illegal children or adults to come out the dark and go about it the correct way. Which is the issues itself. There is no way to " fix their citizenship status" after living years illegal. Again that is the issue itself.

As I stated before I agree that illegals that are caught on early it make sense to deport them, but on the right the no logical or mature reasonable thinking on how to handle illegals that have been American for decades, raised in America or have started families and etc. This created a dilemma that it doesn't make sense to deport them.

[Chevalier de Saint-George]

Originally Posted by markjames68

FYI, for anyone interested, this is a good video to watch to get a sense of him. It dates from 2016 so before all the hoopla (i.e. not just a PR stunt that some people put on when they are in trouble)


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BJkFaFi2fFk

I came away with the following impressions:

1) lack of good role models and grew up in a tough, violent environment

2) owns up to what he did, but is trying to do better now

3) realizes his lyrics are inflammatory but that’s what sells

I can totally see why his attorney is going for a U visa, and why this attorney is involved. At face value this kid appears to be nothing but a street gangster that should be deported.

On the other hand, he’s become successful despite his environment, upbringing and lack of good parenting (I’m sorry, but what kind of a mother lets their child sell drugs at 12 or 13?)

If it was up to me I would let him stay on a valid visa, ensure he understands the tightrope he walks and encourage him to channel his energies in a positive way. And in a number of years, assuming he doesn’t do anything stupid, grant him permanent residency.

He and I couldn’t be more different. But I see why he has his supporters. Good luck to him.

Here was a good article from Vulture.com that answers many questions surrounding this bizarre ordeal.

https://www.vulture.com/2019/02/all-...-answered.html

[markjames68]

Originally Posted by 80s_kid

Here was a good article from Vulture.com that answers many questions surrounding this bizarre ordeal.

https://www.vulture.com/2019/02/all-...-answered.html

Interesting, some bad editing but good content.

“21 Savage's legal team say that he arrived in the US from the UK in 1999, aged seven.
But the USA's Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) service says the musician arrived in 2005 aged 12 and went on to overstay his visa.”

ICE is correct in this case. If someone enters on a temporary visa and then leaves it doesn’t count as residency. They look at his last entry - which was in 2005.

“He also denied claims from ICE that the rapper has a criminal record.
Immigration authorities said on Sunday he was charged with drug offences in 2014, but his legal team say they were subsequently removed from his record.”

ICE is correct from an immigration perspective. Expungement doesn’t wipe it out for ICE.

“Mr Spiro added: "What we have here is someone who overstayed their visa with an application pending for four years - not a convicted criminal that needs to be detained and removed but, by all accounts a wonderful person, father, and entertainer who has a marijuana offence which was vacated and sealed."”

Lawyer talk - I would have preferred it had he stated all his good works recently, because his teen years don’t reflect him being a “wonderful person”. He has admitted shooting people and doing other violent acts. ICE looks at all of this.


As I stated earlier, I think he should get a chance. One. With no excuses later.

[markjames68]

Originally Posted by chiatldal

Actually it makes worst....... "When they was just a child" that means this would be sending them away from the country, the culture, that they know and identify with and to a place they don't, and would be foreign to them.

And no, most child to adult don't apply because it's become a trap into itself that many children to adults fear. If theirs a hold political side trying fight them to have a political path to citizenship in the first place. A example is Trump not extending DACA and using the Dreamers as political hostage. currently their is no path to amnesty for illegal children or adults to come out the dark and go about it the correct way. Which is the issues itself. There is no way to " fix their citizenship status" after living years illegal. Again that is the issue itself.

As I stated before I agree that illegals that are caught on early it make sense to deport them, but on the right the no logical or mature reasonable thinking on how to handle illegals that have been American for decades, raised in America or have started families and etc. This created a dilemma that it doesn't make sense to deport them.

It’s a tough situation. The best solution is a longer and more difficult path to citizenship than for “legal” applicants. Add an extra step with the understanding that you absolutely need to be law abiding going forward.

We can’t reward jumping the line - intentional or accidental - but we can’t ignore millions either.

[Chevalier de Saint-George]

Markjames68, new information gives the reason why he was pulled over....loaded glock. It's looking kind of bleak if what you say about ICE looking at everything.

Regarding his children, they'd be duel citizens then, I guess.

[markjames68]

Originally Posted by 80s_kid

Markjames68, new information gives the reason why he was pulled over....loaded glock. It's looking kind of bleak if what you say about ICE looking at everything.

Regarding his children, they'd be duel citizens then, I guess.

ICE should look at everything. It’s possible they can waive it, but it also explains why his lawyer is going for a U visa - the talk track is that he’s so traumatized and screwed up from seeing all these crimes that he should be excused for his behavior.

It’s an interesting legal trick. Had Obama been President it probably would have worked. With Trump? Dubious.

So, another question. If this was in play for 4 years - since 2015 - why didn’t President Obama intervene? He was pretty close to Jay-Z, no?

And why am I also seeing the U visa was filed in 2017? That implies something else was tried before that which didn’t work. Or people can’t seem to report the dates correctly.


And yes, his children are automatically British citizens and American citizens. It’s not a bad thing to have.

[citydwelling]

Originally Posted by markjames68

Here’s where the parenting part comes in. I have a 12 year old son. I would know that exiting and then re-entering as a temporary visitor was wrong and could backfire on him later in life. I would know that under Bush there was a lot of immigration talk. My son would ask me why he had a UK passport and not a US one.

As per an earlier message, he has siblings who have green cards. Why not him? What’s the missing piece here?

As previously stated, his trip to the UK was when he was 12 years old. I think we can safely assume his children had not been born yet. Are you just looking for reasons to have a problem with this dude?

[markjames68]

Originally Posted by citydwelling

As previously stated, his trip to the UK was when he was 12 years old. I think we can safely assume his children had not been born yet. Are you just looking for reasons to have a problem with this dude?

I am taking an objective view of the situation. There is a lot of “he’s changed, he’s a good man now, his kids are here, he needs to stay” without any logic being applied. Every day there seems to be more pertinent information released that at a minimum shows poor judgment on his part - now, today, not a decade ago.

And I was looking at this from his parent’s perspective - the “12 year old” is 21 Savage himself during his trip to the UK. Apologies if that wasn’t clear, but I would have thought it to be fairly obvious. Many state that at 12 he wouldn’t have been accountable for his actions (correct) but you’d think he would have been aware and asked questions of his mother?

I don’t know 21 Savage. I will likely never meet him. But I do know the immigration process quite well.