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Old 01-09-2011, 09:55 AM
 
1,157 posts, read 2,652,589 times
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We are getting fleeced because we've allowed it. We act life serfs and vote in our own worst interest (I use "we" loosely). Take the tax cut for the "wealthy"-- people below the $250k actually vote to support this, which is amazing, yet are the ones getting screwed. This is all so frustrating to me because the majority doesn't seem to be able to understand cause and effect. Look at third world countries that operate on this type of system- the wealthy take care of themselves and everyone else is left to their own devices. They can't compete, they have extremely high crime rates and are in a constant state of instability. I also get equally frustrated when someone starts ringing the Communist bell. Really? Why do we have to go to extremes instead of having a logical, reasonable discussion?
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Old 01-09-2011, 10:11 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
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At the end of the day it comes down to "NO MONEY".
Texas lasted pretty long compared to other states who are in their 3rd/4th year of these types of cuts.
This is the first budget year that schools are included with across the board cuts.

They haven't announced eliminating complete programs yet..just closing and consolidating schools.
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Old 01-09-2011, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Fairfax, VA
1,449 posts, read 3,171,824 times
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Are your teachers already in a pay freeze there? The ones up here haven't had a raise in two years. They already closed and consolidated schools as well as redistricted to alleviate the numbers (over and under crowding).

I'm just glad this year's budget doesn't include the threat to eliminate full-day kindergarten in schools that already had it (it was supposed to be in all our county schools by 2010, but it is at around 75% implementation because of the recession/budget problems and we're currently stuck in a half-day district). Talk about screwing with people's schedules and finances in an already tough time.
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Old 01-09-2011, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Round Rock, Texas
13,448 posts, read 15,484,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h886 View Post
Well, we agree that they need to sell the property on 5th street. Private school can do more with less because they weed out the kids who need more resources. You can't go to private school unless you are rich enough to afford it, or deemed worthy of the few scholarships they give out. Public school is forced to take everyone, the kids no one wants, the kids who actually need to be taught. If you took a school that only got the "elite" (LASA, for example), they would outperform the others, but I think most people are intelligent enough to realize that those kids were going to be successful no matter what building you put them in.

To some extent, it's every man for himself, which you clearly advocate. But on some level, we also try to create an equal playing field for the poor, or at least give less fortunate families a chance. We have welfare, medicaid, free lunch for kids who would otherwise starve.

Public education should attempt to provide the same for every kid, not allow the richest kids to be given advantage after advantage while the poorer children have bare bones. Your argument is flawed because what it will mean is kids who go to an AISD school on the west side of town will have their choice of dozens of music and art classes, while a child who goes to an east Austin school will have nothing. During the school day, everyone within the school district should be given the same, every child in a classroom afforded the same opportunities. They have enough disparity to deal with once they go home.

You are very naive if you are suggesting their PTA's have the means to subsidize those programs... those families don't have the expendable funds that you do. They don't have mommies with nothing better to do than come up to the school to volunteer. They don't have daddies who can write a big fat check for $1,000 like it's nothing. When you worry about where your next meal will come from, the idea of donating to the wrapping paper sale is ludicrous.
You are right - a kid who is going to be successful will be successful regardless of where they go. I went to a dumpy high school rife with gang violence, drugs, teachers handing out passing grades just to get the kids out of their classes, etc. The set up I had is probably similar to LASA...though I think my old high school was far worse than LBJ. We didn't have any of those extras. But I made it into some pretty good colleges, NYU and Bucknell being two of them...on partial scholarships. I used the resources that were given to me and made the best of them.
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Old 01-09-2011, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h886 View Post
Public education should attempt to provide the same for every kid, not allow the richest kids to be given advantage after advantage while the poorer children have bare bones. Your argument is flawed because what it will mean is kids who go to an AISD school on the west side of town will have their choice of dozens of music and art classes, while a child who goes to an east Austin school will have nothing. During the school day, everyone within the school district should be given the same, every child in a classroom afforded the same opportunities. They have enough disparity to deal with once they go home.
I don't think the PTA can subsidize teacher salaries/pensions/benefits/expenses to be able to offer dozens of music/art classes.

IF and I say IF music/art is cut back, whatever is done by the parents/PTA will have to happen outside of the normal school day.

But I have not read that AISD are dropping any music/art programs; they have only school closing/consolidations on the table and in their discussion packets. There is NOT ONE mention of program cuts.
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Old 01-09-2011, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Hutto, Tx
9,249 posts, read 26,697,972 times
Reputation: 2851
As a board member on the PTC at my daughter's school, our meeting next week should be really interesting. It's a little tough to get volunteers for things, but luckily we've had a very involved parent community the last few years. We have kids in this district who are pretty poor (most from immigrant families) on up to parents who are small business owners who donate decent amounts of money and stay at home moms who are at school every day helping out wherever necessary. I'm sure funding will be one of our longer running topics at the next meeting.

We've gotten some good response from local businesses who donate things to us for school events. HEB, Papa Johns, McDonalds....have donated food for performance nights and treats for class rewards for contests like Boxtops, etc...McDonald's hosts McTeacher nights, with a portion of the sales going to the school. It's a big draw. Boxtops are a good way to bring money to the school. Local merchants donate items for the Silent Auction at the Christmas Bazaar and we have parents who own businesses and they will provide items for teacher appreciation days, student appreciation events, etc... We also took an idea from a neighboring school district and have a card that people donate a cash amount to obtain. The money goes to the PTC to use for things for the students (education oriented/not treats and such). The card has a list of local businesses that offer discounts on things that the purchaser can use during the year (oil changes, haircuts, food discounts). Also when they come to a school event like a performance night where the Ptc sells food, they can get a free meal for each family member listed on the card..

I have no idea yet how a PTC would fund sports programs, arts programs, auto shop, etc....except by very wealthy families or some seriously dedicated volunteers who had the time in their day to come up to the school to hold a class once a week or even every day. I've heard of programs where church or community groups will make sack lunches or care packs of food that will fit in a backpack and children who don't get to eat anything at home can discreetly have these put in their backpacks to take home, and no other kids are aware so it. Guess I'll find out what new ideas everyone has this week
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Old 01-09-2011, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Fairfax, VA
1,449 posts, read 3,171,824 times
Reputation: 471
Quote:
Originally Posted by love roses View Post
As a board member on the PTC at my daughter's school, our meeting next week should be really interesting. It's a little tough to get volunteers for things, but luckily we've had a very involved parent community the last few years. We have kids in this district who are pretty poor (most from immigrant families) on up to parents who are small business owners who donate decent amounts of money and stay at home moms who are at school every day helping out wherever necessary. I'm sure funding will be one of our longer running topics at the next meeting.

We've gotten some good response from local businesses who donate things to us for school events. HEB, Papa Johns, McDonalds....have donated food for performance nights and treats for class rewards for contests like Boxtops, etc...McDonald's hosts McTeacher nights, with a portion of the sales going to the school. It's a big draw. Boxtops are a good way to bring money to the school. Local merchants donate items for the Silent Auction at the Christmas Bazaar and we have parents who own businesses and they will provide items for teacher appreciation days, student appreciation events, etc... We also took an idea from a neighboring school district and have a card that people donate a cash amount to obtain. The money goes to the PTC to use for things for the students (education oriented/not treats and such). The card has a list of local businesses that offer discounts on things that the purchaser can use during the year (oil changes, haircuts, food discounts). Also when they come to a school event like a performance night where the Ptc sells food, they can get a free meal for each family member listed on the card..

I have no idea yet how a PTC would fund sports programs, arts programs, auto shop, etc....except by very wealthy families or some seriously dedicated volunteers who had the time in their day to come up to the school to hold a class once a week or even every day. I've heard of programs where church or community groups will make sack lunches or care packs of food that will fit in a backpack and children who don't get to eat anything at home can discreetly have these put in their backpacks to take home, and no other kids are aware so it. Guess I'll find out what new ideas everyone has this week
I don't know anyone in your area's Junior League, but the one up here in Northern Virginia does a lot of work with schools and homeless shelters providing things (food, school supllies, homework help, etc) for school students. You might want to contact them for help. I know I pulled up the Junior League of Austin page at one point just to figure out how a transfer would work when we do make our move.
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:00 PM
 
2,596 posts, read 5,582,871 times
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No, I haven't heard that they're taking out any music/art programs entirely. There will certainly be cuts in those teaching positions, much as there will be in other areas.

"It's a little tough to get volunteers for things, but luckily we've had a very involved parent community the last few years."

Yes. The key is that some areas have an easier time getting parent volunteers. Some parents have to work multiple minimum wage jobs just to put food on the table. They don't have cars and have to take the bus to work. They scrub toilets and do the filthiest jobs and don't have the luxury of paying for a babysitter so they can come down and put up decorations for the PTA when they are living one month at a time. I won't pretend that Hutto is anywhere near Eanes, but it's also not in as dire circumstances as some of the poorest schools on the east side of Austin. When we start to rely on the PTA to provide the basics, it creates a very wide gap between the schools on the rich side of town and the schools on the poor side of town--even more than is already in place.

In response to other comments, I agree that parents need to provide for their kids, but at some level it's unfair to suggest that the kids be punished for their parents' poverty and that's really what we're talking about when we suggest that art/music be removed from the schools unless the PTA pays for it. No one asked the kids if they wanted to be born into a wealthy family in a rich neighborhood or a poor family on the other side of town. Public school owes it to all the kids to provide an equal opportunity for success, at least to what extent they can while they have the kids in their care.
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,958 posts, read 45,410,702 times
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You know, elementary schools once didn't have art and music (except for band) as separate classes, and we managed to learn them nonetheless. Partly through our parents, and partly through including those in other subjects so that they seemed more a part of every day life rather than something completely separate from them.

Did we get extensive instruction just in art, or just in music? No, but we were exposed to them enough so that those who were interested could find ways to pursue them.

Believe it or not, neither art nor music are "the basics". The basics is really, beyond reading and writing and arithmetic, is about HOW to learn and a hint of what is out there in the realm of possibilities to learn. That's what's going to serve the children, rich or poor, later on in life. Without that, none of the rest of it means anything.
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:17 PM
 
2,596 posts, read 5,582,871 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady View Post
You know, elementary schools once didn't have art and music (except for band) as separate classes, and we managed to learn them nonetheless. Partly through our parents, and partly through including those in other subjects so that they seemed more a part of every day life rather than something completely separate from them.

Did we get extensive instruction just in art, or just in music? No, but we were exposed to them enough so that those who were interested could find ways to pursue them.

Believe it or not, neither art nor music are "the basics". The basics is really, beyond reading and writing and arithmetic, is about HOW to learn and a hint of what is out there in the realm of possibilities to learn. That's what's going to serve the children, rich or poor, later on in life. Without that, none of the rest of it means anything.
That's true. And in fact, we once didn't have computers, or electricity, or lots of other things that we enjoy now. Kids with special needs or disabilities were simply locked in cages and kept at home... it was considered a foolish notion to try to educate them. Perhaps we should all go back to the one-room schoolhouse method and stop these silly attempts to nurture children and their interests... why use a computer when you could just scratch on a slate with a pencil? It worked for the pioneers, so there should be no issue.
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