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Uh, no....to all of the above. If you want ceramic pads you need to know that the brakes work by taking forward energy and turning it into heat- that's how brakes work. Ceramic pads forces ALL of the heat into the rotor. Standard rotors will NOT take the heat. You desperately need drilled and slotted rotors or expect to replace the rotors often. Otherwise, one of these times when you hit the brakes, the rotors will pretty much explode leaving you zero brakes. You need to research this before you really screw something up. Frankly, no street legal car needs ceramic pads. Ceramic are great for racing as there is little to no fade but at the cost of damaged rotors. Here's a pic of a street legal car with ceramic pads and drilled only rotors.
You do not need drilled rotors when you install ceramic pads. And most, if not all, vehicles come with slotted rotors up front, because the front brakes provide most of your braking action. I would never put drilled rotors on an everyday vehicle. They crack and don't last very long and are totally unnecessary.
so appreciate the varying feedback Each posters responses have good reasonings with them. (and experience too boot!)
Shop 2 seemed to be the more balanced/reasonable way to go. But appreciate folks clarifying some of the information that I was being told. Shop1 may have been hyper cautionary.
Will say that ceramic brakes haven't left me down yet. Yes I have the correct rotor styles to accomodate the ceramic pads. I don't replace them near as much as I did with the standard brake pads....
So to be clear its okay then to tell Shop 2 that just bleed the front brakes then?
I would bleed all four brakes. And you might consider replacing your brake fluid depending on age and mileage. I pretty much agree with Shop 2's assessment.
The OEM pads on the majority of vehicles today are Ceramic. They are great for a street car.
The caliper manufacturers (and re-manufacturers) recommend replacing both at the same time (and of course they get double the money) and so a shop (also getting the double the money) repeats that often. It's a fine practice, but not really needed. The biggest downside of doing 1 is that you'll be mad if you have to do the second one in 6 months and are throwing out perfectly great new pads. 1 is fine. That said, you can buy calipers "loaded" with hardware and brake pads as well as unloaded, as just the calipers. The cost to buy 2 loaded manufactured calipers might be pretty close to the cost of one unloaded and a new set of pads. It's worth asking about, but no safety reason to change both.
The rotors don't need to be change simply because you have new pads, although many shops will always tell you they do. That said, changing to a different kind of pad compound (even if going from one ceramic to another brand's) will provide slightly less optimal braking conditions if you don't get the film of old pad material off the rotor. Shops like to turn the rotors to accomplish this, but if the rotor is otherwise fine, scuffing them up with some sandpaper to get the old pad residue off is quick and cheap, will not remove significant material from the rotor like resurfacing, and will due the trick just fine. The shop may not be willing to do this if it isn't their normal procedure, but since you asked a DIY question, that's what just about everyone I know does.
Bleed all 4 brakes. While there is a decent chance that opening the front of the line will not cause air to get to the back, as @ukrkoz stated, the line you open will be connected to one other corner, at that one, at a minimum (and may be a back one) should be bled as well. At the track with no lift, no power tools, or anything other than my hand tools and floor jack, I can do all 4 corners in about 15 minutes if I try. There is 0 reason to not do the job the right way and get all 4 done.
As an example of Ceramic OEM pads, here is what Honda says (and again, most vehicles do the same):
Edit: I should add that contrary to what is posted here. ceramic pads are not good for racing, as you need a high temp resistant pad to avoid fading. Regular street semi-metallics aren't good either. That said, carbon ceramic rotors (note the word carbon in there) are considered good for racing as they dissipate heat well.
uh, no....to all of the above. If you want ceramic pads you need to know that the brakes work by taking forward energy and turning it into heat- that's how brakes work. Ceramic pads forces all of the heat into the rotor. Standard rotors will not take the heat. You desperately need drilled and slotted rotors or expect to replace the rotors often. Otherwise, one of these times when you hit the brakes, the rotors will pretty much explode leaving you zero brakes. You need to research this before you really screw something up. Frankly, no street legal car needs ceramic pads. Ceramic are great for racing as there is little to no fade but at the cost of damaged rotors. Here's a pic of a street legal car with ceramic pads and drilled only rotors.
Wanted to give the results and some words of wisdom from going thru this repair saga:
(1): the caliper pin/bolt was technically the only part needing changed out. ($17 for 2 and proper grease) would have done the trick. But I had already bought the two new calipers (fronts). Correct that it's not necessary to change both if one is operatable . If it ain't broke don't replace it .
2: the quik struts .was the challenge. Rusted bolt ..ended up using a heat torch..then knocking it off. Otherwise it was a 20 min,each side.
3: shop said rotors measured fine. Then when doing a test run..the one rotor created shuttering. Sure enough ..it needs replaced. So given I'm in for a penny in for a pound. It's best I just get the four rotors replaced and be done with this repair portion. All four lines got bled(free! Since they goofed)
I go this week to my exhaust shop to have the leak welded. Fingers crossed they don't find more problems. Otherwise I'm glad you posters shared some sage advice. It's good to get objective opinions.
I'm pretty dumb, but I managed to rebuild my own calipers........the kits was cheap and easy. Remove the crud and corrosion, install new parts provided in the kits, put back on vehicle.
You do not need drilled rotors when you install ceramic pads. And most, if not all, vehicles come with slotted rotors up front, because the front brakes provide most of your braking action. I would never put drilled rotors on an everyday vehicle. They crack and don't last very long and are totally unnecessary.
They are not neccessary, like you say, but they do provide better braking. They give more "bite". I have them on two of my vehicles and love them. There is a reason they come on higher end cars, like vettes.
They are not neccessary, like you say, but they do provide better braking. They give more "bite". I have them on two of my vehicles and love them. There is a reason they come on higher end cars, like vettes.
Yeah, to look racy. Remember, on higher end cars like that, the rotors are also much larger, to compensate for removing a bit of mass from them. They still crack on track days. Never drill stock sized rotors on normal cars. Removing mass means less material to absorb heat away from the pads, meaning the rotors get hotter, and the drilled areas, even if they were cast into the rotor from the factory, will create stress risers and crack under heavy use.
Race cars replace rotors every event and race teams check the rotors constantly, Street drivers never do this. Even so, race teams are moving away from drilled rotors and going to larger vented rotors instead. F1 and NASCAR no longer use drilled rotors.
real race car brakes:
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