Sustainability vs Sprawl - UGB (Bend, West Slope: lawyers, townhouse, quality of life)

[Carlyee3]

We have been gone from Bend for three+ years and returned for a few days this week. Your traffic has gotten markedly worse and the 6 houses per acre packing is awful looking. The road surfaces are more potholed and alligatored. Downtown traffic is now constant, not periodic.

The plan for third will make those blocks look like a tunnel with out any widening. The new Walgreen on Third and Franklin looks out of scale and solid blocks of that will be awful.

The UGB infill edict is making Bend more like "Escape From New York", only without the physical wall.

[Snownut]

Statistics show you have mostly posted mostly in Boise forum with this only your 2nd post in Bend? Showing up for a few days during peak tourist season after 3+ years seems a stretch to make such sweeping judgements about Bend?

Originally Posted by Carlyee3

We have been gone from Bend for three+ years and returned for a few days this week. Your traffic has gotten markedly worse and the 6 houses per acre packing is awful looking. The road surfaces are more potholed and alligatored. Downtown traffic is now constant, not periodic.

The plan for third will make those blocks look like a tunnel with out any widening. The new Walgreen on Third and Franklin looks out of scale and solid blocks of that will be awful.

The UGB infill edict is making Bend more like "Escape From New York", only without the physical wall.

[BendLocal]

Originally Posted by Snownut

Statistics show you have mostly posted mostly in Boise forum with this only your 2nd post in Bend? Showing up for a few days during peak tourist season after 3+ years seems a stretch to make such sweeping judgements about Bend?

Do you disagree with the observations that were shared? I don't see anything that is a stretch in that post.

[kapetrich]

Yes. What was posted was hyperbolic considering there hasn't been a new UGB accepted so nothing has really changed in the way Bend uses its land over the last 3 years. The thing that has changed over the last 3 years is the economy picking up which has lead to more tourists visiting and more people relocating.

See, now the fact that not much has changed in terms how we use our lands is the very reason we're actually in a extremely tight rental/housing market. There is a lot of demand and not much supply even though there is a decent bit of BLI left in the current UGB.

No, no, but you're right, comparing Bend to a science fiction movie based on the premise that Manhatten is turned into a prison where a wall is constructed around it so no one can get out....Not at all hyperbolic.

Here, let me respond in a meaningful way:

1) 1/6th per acre are not that small, to be perfectly honest. There is plenty of larger lots in Bend. In fact, most lots are larger than this.

2) I was downtown tonight from 7-10pm. Not any traffic to really speak of.

3) Within the 3rd street development there will be a step back premise used for buildings built up against sidewalks which limits the feeling, or rather perception, of being in a tunnel - you don't know what you speak.

Hey, riddle me this...when you're walking around downtown Bend with all those 'tall' buildings...do you feel like you're in a tunnel too? No, you don't. There's a reason for that

4) I actually agree that the Walgreens is an ugly build, but Walgreens bought the land and as long as they check all the boxes, are free to build on the land they own. The ironic thing? The redevelopment project will actually make it harder, if not impossible, for another horrible one story brick box built right up against the street that has more parking space than retail space to be built in that section, so you're kinda arguing against your own point here, aren't you?

5) Yes, our roads are more crowded than they were 3+ years ago when we had negative population growth and much less tourists in town due to an overall bad US economy.

6) Boise.

[BendLocal]

I am often asked by visitors why the lots are so small and I thought the same thing when I first visited Bend. Now when I see a 1/2 acre lot it looks huge. No doubt the perception of lot size depends on where you are coming from but I understand when someone says many of Bend's lots look tiny for a small town located in the middle of Oregon. If I'm not mistaken the smaller lots are closer to 5000 sq/ft.

As far as roads go I'm pretty sure I need to get yet another alignment.

Traffic is definitely getting worse and not just when compared to the bust. It seems worse when compared to the prior boom period too. Unfortunately I don't see a solution for that and expect it to get much worse with the increasing popularity of Bend and OSU's arrival.

Initiatives like the proposed Cottage Code that lead to higher density (infill) are new and driven by the need to get the new UGB approved by the state and the need for more housing.

[Coniferian]

Denver was notorious for pop-tops and mini-mansions in desirable neighborhoods with small lots. You could make a lot of money if you owned a little 1940s cottage in Washington park. I don't see many likely to make that kind of profit in Bend, but it will be weird to watch mother-in-law cottages shoe-horned into already tiny lots.

[Snownut]

I know people's needs and likes can be very different. There are pro's and con's to nearly everything.

For me, I like the tiny lots and infill efforts in Bend. We will be moving into a single family home on a small (7,600sq ft) lot very soon. We will have a nice covered porch, mostly private fenced area that we plan to add a small water feature, hottub, container/ small box gardens, flowers and minimal other landscaping with little or no grass.

Bend has so many parks and outdoor options very close by, that is my new backyard. As I mentioned before I have cared and maintained various sized properties over the years. I am looking forward to the small area and low maintenance home that will not consume hours of my nights and weekends to care or maintain.

As for traffic, I find 3rd street and immediate down town blocks to be "busy" certain times of the day. Parking and left turns are challenging at certain times of the day. However, compared to northern Virginia region where I moved from where it could often take 45 minutes or an hour to go a few miles! The traffic here is slightly inconvenient compared to my history. I do understand for people who have lived here a long time it is much worse than the "good ole days". That is understandable as Bend has grown so much in past decades.

If someone is looking for quiet rural areas in tiny towns there are plenty of those places in America.

Bend is growing and attractive for many people and I do not see that changing anytime soon. If any thing as the water issues get worse in CA and other SW states I imagine even more people migrating this way! Thankfully jobs (good paying once) are hard to find or this place would be growing even faster!

As for the roads, yes many of them are in bad shape and in need of repairs and upgrades. Welcome to America!

Having recently driven 2,765 miles across the US in a moving truck I can tell you first hand huge areas of the interstates and the towns I stopped in for the night have roads that are in serious need of upgrades and repairs. There are "Bend" roads all over!

Certainly people have different opinions and perceptions but we have no regrets moving to Bend, we love it here. It far exceeds the lifestyle, weather, traffic, outdoor beauty and opportunities we had where we lived in VA.

Thankfully we live in a country with choices on where to live, if you don't like where you live or what is has become then I can tell you first hand with research, patience and planning you can find a place that better suits your needs.

Remember almost everyone moved here from somewhere else and has contributed by that move and their choices or lack of choices since moving to collectively make Bend what is is today. If you have moved away to a better place, good for you enjoy your new place and don't come back complaining. LOL

[Steve Pickering]

Bend is not the only town where UGB's are shrinking lot sizes. The UGB makes the land value rise, so builders put more sticks on a piece of land to keep their profits up.

And Snownut, I am feeling crowded on my 20,000 square foot city lot. I don't know how people live in those "0" lot line townhouses.

[kapetrich]

Snownut, I completely agree with everything you've written. Boise is a fine place to live. More power to anyone who moves to a place that makes them happy.

Originally Posted by BendLocal

I am often asked by visitors why the lots are so small and I thought the same thing when I first visited Bend. Now when I see a 1/2 acre lot it looks huge. No doubt the perception of lot size depends on where you are coming from but I understand when someone says many of Bend's lots look tiny for a small town located in the middle of Oregon. If I'm not mistaken the smaller lots are closer to 5000 sq/ft.

As far as roads go I'm pretty sure I need to get yet another alignment.

Traffic is definitely getting worse and not just when compared to the bust. It seems worse when compared to the prior boom period too. Unfortunately I don't see a solution for that and expect it to get much worse with the increasing popularity of Bend and OSU's arrival.

Initiatives like the proposed Cottage Code that lead to higher density (infill) are new and driven by the need to get the new UGB approved by the state and the need for more housing.

There are many reasons the city is proposing a Cottage Code change. Increasing density is one of them. Another one would be the attempt to address affordable rents/housing.

Bend will continue to grow at a rapid pace. If you want larger lots then we'll have to do more suburban sprawl. We either address the growth or allow the growth to address us.

We can either (1) extend our UGB a lot to accommodate this growth with single family suburban sprawl (the State has already shot this idea down so lets live in reality), (2)not extend the UGB in any way and focus on infill and upping our density or (3) take the reasonable approach and methodically increase our density inside our current city limits all while slightly increasing our UGB.

The city is choosing the third approach.

One of the reasons I moved to Bend was for Oregons strict land use laws. I like being able to leave my house and within 5 mins access untouched lands all while living in an 80-100k town. This is extremely unique in my experience.


Steve Pickering: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Social_Contract

[Steve Pickering]

Originally Posted by kapetrich

... ... (3) take the reasonable approach and methodically increase our density inside our current city limits all while slightly increasing our UGB.

The city is choosing the third approach. ... ...

Sounds reasonable to me on the surface, but I am a believer in if you own the land you should be able to do what you want as long as it is on your land and doesn't interfere with the quality of life of a reasonable neighbor. What is reasonable is often negotiable.