The transformation of South Buffalo continues (New York, Amherst: taxes, living, professionals)

[TonyNC]

Originally Posted by Snapper_head

You should see what happens when cities “race to the bottom” to lure factories by having low taxes and low regulation in today’s global economy. The environment suffers, the schools suffer, public services suffer, economic inequality grows, a few get richer, and the desperate masses get only dangerous, minimum-wage jobs with few worker protections. The result is crowding, smoggy air, traffic congestion, underperforming schools, bad health, and overall low quality of life.

For example, Houston is a manufacturing boomtown right now as well. I live there. Come see hundreds of square miles of ghetto just beyond the shiny skyscrapers downtown. This mega-ghetto is where all the factory workers live. Most of the workers come from other countries where they were facing starvation on their farms, where they never had the chance to attend a school like Buf State or UB. Now in America, they earn slightly more than minimum wage to work in a factory in Houston, at least until they get injured, long before retirement age. They cram large families into small houses, so that the middle-aged parents who can no longer work can be cared for by the kids. The kids who grow up in these areas are like Tony in NC - eager to get an education and move to someplace less toxic and brutal, to have more of a middle-class, white-collar life.

You want to bring those conditions back to Buffalo? And without labor unions or modern regulations? Just so you can say that Buffalo is booming again?

Count me out of that. I remember when downtown Buffalo was covered in black soot. Buffalo is just now starting to earn accolades for clean air and clean water, recovering from decades of exploitative industrialization. I’d rather Buffalonians work as medical lab assistants than in auto factories. I’d rather state and nonprofit and small businesses form the bulk of employers, rather than big global corporations that maximize profits as they trade workers for robotics, and lobby to kill minimum wage laws and environmental protections.

Buffalo may not have Bethlehem Steel or the days of the smoggy industrial boomtown. It’s way better now. Buffalo is rightsizing, detoxing, and transitioning to a modern, decent place to live, or as best it can in a fundamentally unfair global economy.

Snapper, don’t worry about Buffalo luring dirty mfg companies to Buffalo! Ain’t gonna happen! Why would ANY company, especially mfg companies move to Buffalo?! - high taxes, unions (probably). There are many better options in the U.S.!

Also, mfg is shrinking - it’s now ~10% of economy now. It’s now in recession. The U.S. has essentially outsourced most mfg to Mexico or overseas.

The issue for mfg workers in Buff and elsewhere is that they have (generally) low skills and reasonable wages. Not easy/quick for them to change careers and earn a decent wage. My welder UAW father, had he lived longer, was NOT gonna become a computer programmer at age 50

[Snapper_head]

Originally Posted by Niagarapurple

Buffalo & Cheektowaga have extremely high cancer rates Buffalo is a toxic dump and the whole region is one big love canal from hickory woods Buffalo River even the suburbs out to Transit & Sheridan, Google it

And you want to make it worse? You want to bring back those big polluting factories from Buffalo’s heyday? We’re still trying to clean up their waste, decades later. And you want to be like Houston and roll back environmental regulations and worker protections...just so you can boast that Buffalo is booming?

No thank you.

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by VA Yankee

I'm sure your not surprised and hope the current resident feels they have value for what they pay. As you can see from how people post some are outraged, some are accepting as this is the price to live in Buffalo, and others concoct mixes of variables that if you stand on one leg and look to the east during the equinox the costs are on par with the rest of the country.

The problem is that the “outraged” aren’t around to be “outraged” anymore. So, that isn’t even an aspect in the Buffalo forum, which seems to get overlooked. Let alone that aspect will vary by location.

Again, taxes are one variable in costs. So, it is something that has to be viewed comprehensively.

Also, there are companies in the area that aren’t in manufacturing or strictly so and are looking for employees. So, there are jobs available for those with the appropriate skills. This doesn’t even get into the training programs available and that some use to get skills for the positions that are available. That is how the mismatch in skills in relation to openings get addressed.

Now, back to the actual topic of South Buffalo development...Given that the neighborhoods around Cazenovia Park are relatively stable, lower to solidly middle class, the guy in the segment in the original post may be on to something in regards to the Seneca Street Corridor. Moderator cut: link removed, competitor site

Moderator cut: links removed, competitor site

[Niagarapurple]

Originally Posted by VA Yankee

I'm sure your not surprised and hope the current resident feels they have value for what they pay. As you can see from how people post some are outraged, some are accepting as this is the price to live in Buffalo, and others concoct mixes of variables that if you stand on one leg and look to the east during the equinox the costs are on par with the rest of the country.

The rest of the country has better services, In the Buffalo suburbs you have unmanned Fire Station's that are still the 1950's Volunteer FD's with very little training and no national certifications and it takes 20+ minutes for a fire engine to show up and its staffed with 2 or 3 Senior Citizens volunteers and the City Of Buffalo FD is paid but their not even Paramedics which is the national standard everywhere else and is available everywhere else. When you watch or read the Buffalo News notice every fire & car accident people always die. funny how people really think that Buffalo & WNY is par with the rest of country lol

[VA Yankee]

Originally Posted by ckhthankgod

The problem is that the “outraged” aren’t around to be “outraged” anymore. So, that isn’t even an aspect in the Buffalo forum, which seems to get overlooked. Let alone that aspect will vary by location.

Again, taxes are one variable in costs. So, it is something that has to be viewed comprehensively.

Also, there are companies in the area that aren’t in manufacturing or strictly so and are looking for employees. So, there are jobs available for those with the appropriate skills. This doesn’t even get into the training programs available and that some use to get skills for the positions that are available. That is how the mismatch in skills in relation to openings get addressed.

Now, back to the actual topic of South Buffalo development...Given that the neighborhoods around Cazenovia Park are relatively stable, lower to solidly middle class, the guy in the segment in the original post may be on to something in regards to the Seneca Street Corridor. Moderator cut: link removed, competitor site

Moderator cut: links removed, competitor site

And again you go off some tangent with enough links to choke a horse because someone provided a statement in response to someone else. The taxes are high not a variable everyone but you will accept that...

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by VA Yankee

And again you go off some tangent with enough links to choke a horse because someone provided a statement in response to someone else. The taxes are high not a variable everyone but you will accept that...

This isn't a thread about taxes and manufacturing in the first place. So, under usual circumstances, most of the posts would be deemed irrelevant and off topic in relation to the actual thread.

Keep in mind that you are on the city-data forum. So, presenting data relevant to the thread is the point of said forum. Shrug.

[VA Yankee]

Originally Posted by ckhthankgod

This isn't a thread about taxes and manufacturing in the first place. So, under usual circumstances, most of the posts would be deemed irrelevant and off topic in relation to the actual thread.

Keep in mind that you are on the city-data forum. So, presenting data relevant to the thread is the point of said forum. Shrug.

Keep in mind that posting excessive links many requiring a subscription is about as informative as an unfiltered Google Search....

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by VA Yankee

Keep in mind that posting excessive links many requiring a subscription is about as informative as an unfiltered Google Search....

Not true and this still isn't on the topic of South Buffalo development.

Those whole 5 sets of data were at least relevant to the thread.

[Thundarr457]

Originally Posted by ckhthankgod

This isn't a thread about taxes and manufacturing in the first place. So, under usual circumstances, most of the posts would be deemed irrelevant and off topic in relation to the actual thread.

Keep in mind that you are on the city-data forum. So, presenting data relevant to the thread is the point of said forum. Shrug.

South Buffalo does not exist in a vacuum. So saying taxes, manufacturing and associated employment are irrelevant is not correct IMHO.

[RocketSci]

Originally Posted by TellYoMommaStopCallingMe

Seems a Minister of Propaganda.

The Nabobs of Negativity are threatened whenever their near monopoly on this thread is challenged. No one is allowed to get a good word in unchallenged.