Interacial in Burlington Vermont (Rutland, Colchester: extended stay, home, employment)

[rodowski]

I am looking to relocate, me and my family. I am a American, who happens to be black. I live in North Carolina now. My wife has fallen in love with Vermont , from the outside in and wants to move there. I read indeepth on many social issues in Vermont to educate me on making a wise choice. Honestly, the number thing I could find was the brutal weather. How brutal is the weather in the winter. Also, if anysight, I would like to know how biracial couples are viewed there. The south is bad, however the south has been the south forever and it does have its progressive parts. My wife is blonde , blue eyes and always stand out, not to mention she is drop dead gorgeous. So she always turns heads good and bad. I am 43 so am used to it, meaning , I dont get upset as life is to short to let ignorance invade your happiness. I am a former wrestler and current wrestling coach, soccer coach, football coach and basketball coach . So I engage with a variety of people on a daily basis who are not black and have no issues. However, are there social stimgas there that are dogmatticaly , overly exaggerated racially since their are few blacks. My wife hates,, hates North Carolina, however I would really hate to move where it would be even worse. I have heard that people in Vermont are liberal however ,I am just trying to get a real prospective . My wife is an artist (paints)mixed media, so her artist expression is conveyed in all walks of her life. She thinks Vermont is the most beautiful part of our Country. Thanks for any insight.

Ron

[jackmccullough]

Naturally I can't know what life would be like for someone in your position, but I can make some observations.

First, winters are very cold in Vermont. Even in Burlington, which tends to be milder than the rest of the state, you can expect average temperatures below freezing from December through March, with an average daily low temperature in January of ten degrees. Even setting aside the snow not everyone is willing to tolerate such extreme conditions. It helps if you enjoy outdoor activities.

Vermont has the demographic distinction of being one of the whitest states in the country, with Burlington having a far greater racial and cultural diversity than the rest of the state. You'll be a minority and you'll probably notice it, but you won't be the only black person you see.

On the plus side, Vermont, and especially Burlington, is very politically liberal, and a lot of people here are committed to diversity, equality, and accepting differences. As I said, I can't live in your skin, but I would predict that Vermont is more accepting than many other places. On the other hand, I have heard of pretty serious incidents of discrimination, such as minorities being followed by store security and stuff like that.

I hope this is helpful. If you can swing it I would encourage you to visit and check things out for yourself, especially in winter. I've lived in Vermont for over thirty years and I think it's a great place to live. Aside from Burlington I would suggest taking a look at Montpelier, where I live, and which I think is the best place in Vermont to live.

Finally, it's not clear what you and your wife will be doing for work. Unless you have a coaching job at the college level I doubt you can support yourself that way. Your field of employment can make a difference in what the best part of the state to live is.

[Oriz]

Well here's my two cents. My wife and I relocated to Burlington just over 4 months ago after months of research. Vermont in general and especially the Burlington area is indeed very liberal. My wife is a Christian Caucasian American citizen, I am a Jewish former Israeli citizen, my wife has a 21 year old daughter who is half black from a previous marriage. All 3 of us are now in Vermont, no issues whatsoever, everyone accepting and friendly. Doesn't mean you won't encounter the occasional person or situation that might be the exception but those are everywhere. All in all, I think you'd like it better here in that sense than in North Carolina. Another thing I noticed is that being it's not as diverse as other places, the diversity is more from within for lack of a better way to put it.

As far as winter goes well...I happen to like winter so I am biased. Even though I come from a very warm country where it rarely goes below freezing even in the winter, and have lived there most of my life, I have spent a total of about 5 years in the US(in Boston, Milwaukee, and now Burlington - all cold places) and I can say for me it is really not bad and not an issue, but it all depends on how sensitive to cold you are. Today it's right around freezing but sometimes I swear it feels much warmer than 50 feels in Israel for whatever reason.

[lanhvtnymd]

I lived in Vermont for almost two years. I am African American. I left to go to grad school and because there was not enough diversity for me. I drove to Montreal and Boston regularly (i.e., monthly). I would make up reasons to go. Once I drove to Boston to get my brows done and then turned around and drove back to Burlington. Honestly, if UVM had a public health program and I had been accepted to it, I would have gone to school in Vermont. But they don't, so I left. I loved it there. It's so isolated, but because of this people find some cool things to do.

I think an interracial couple would be comfortable there for the most part....you just won't see many other interracial couples or people of color because Vermont does not have them. The entire state has a population slightly larger than the city of Boston, and it's largely populated by lifer New Englanders, many flatlanders and still mostly Vermonters.

I know I said there was not a lot of diversity, but....I miss Vermont. I am originally from the Gulf Coast, and it was refreshing to be around more liberal-minded people. Plus it is devastatingly beautiful in Vermont. Plus I had a decently paying job (although I rented a room and later before I left lived in an extended stay studio just outside the UVM campus), and I made really good friends. I gained valuable experiences there: first land border crossing(s), getting to see all of New England in one weekend once (everything is so close, it's kind of awesome), my first real snow (not just the dusting that shuts down the southeast and parts of the mid-atlantic sometimes), and what it's like to be the literal token ethnic minority in every sense of the word.

A few days could pass without me seeing one person of color but that was mostly because of my job. You could see maybe 3 people of color per day if you live in the right area. I happened to work with two people of color: one was adopted from Haiti and the other was biracial. There are many people of color who happen to be black but not African American (people who were adopted from places like Ethiopia and Haiti, refugees from Sudan, Congo, etc.). Many people of color live in the Old North End, if they're refugees. You will hear people refer to the Old North End in Burlington as "the hood". Quite obviously, they have never been to a truly dangerous neighborhood. It's definitely an area where many poor people live, but I didn't think it was that scary. It's more depressing than anything.

Anyway, back on topic. I figured it out once, and there were like 600 African Americans in Burlington during the summer compared to like 1600 between from September to May, because of all the students. So let's say 1600 most of the year. That's about 25 white people for every black person, even a more lopsided comparison when you include other races except when you consider people of Asian races. I think there are as many Asians in Burlington as there are African Americans.

Loooooong story short (because I could really go on), I love Vermont. It is expensive as hell and there is little to no diversity. If I were you, I'd live in Burlington. Something like 1/3 of the population of the entire state is in the greater Burlington area, and most of the diversity is there also. My job had me traveling all over Vermont, and some areas weren't as hospitable. You know, stares and stuff. I only had a couple of people (on the older end) act like they were going to catch a disease when I touched them and that was between Middlebury and Rutland. I met someone from my home state during work once who happened to be a white male and we hugged and talked to each other like were old friends: we were so surprised to find someone from our state in Vermont! Middlebury is pretty liberal, Rutland leans more conservative. Burlington is ultra liberal, and Montpelier is, too. Montpelier is beautiful and just a cool town, but has much less diversity. Something like 2% total (all non-white races, including people who are biracial). But if you don't care about that, go for it. Middlebury is also appealing, as is Brattleboro.

Make sure you have a job that pays you decently or very well, and it should be cool. I made ok money: I was making something like 2k more than I made when I lived in Louisiana....and I was making a lot of money for a single woman in Louisiana. But that's Louisiana, so not saying much. Sounds like your wife will fit right in if she's very artsy. A lot of Vermont has that vibe, it's one of the charms. The isolation is what gets to you (only something like 600,000 people in the entire state), but if you can drive or fly yourself out of there now and then, you can tolerate it. The only place in Vermont I don't think I could live is Rutland (I hate Rutland with a passion) and maybe the North East Kingdom (but the latter only because it's so isolated, the people were nice enough).

The winter is COLD AND LONG. But I prefer winter and the cold over the southern perpetual summer, heat, and humidity. I agree with the person who said sometimes if feels warmer in Vermont than the thermometer says. One thing I learned is it feels warmer right after a big snow, probably because the snow has an insulating effect.

North Carolina is a cool state, and it is one of the more liberal southern states. I think you will find Vermont to be more liberal than North Carolina. I live in Maryland now, and I miss the out-of-the-rat-race feel of Vermont. But that only works if you can, you know, be out of the rat race. And at 26-28, I was nowhere near close. If you have money or a good paying job, you will be straight.

I hope it works out for you! Kind of jealous!

[lanhvtnymd]

Ok, let me just say one more thing: greater Burlington area includes South Burlington, Shelburne, Essex, Essex Junction, Colchester, Williston, and Winooski, in my opinion.

[rodowski]

Great post and specific insight. It gives me a lot to work with now as making a educated judgement. I do not mind if I dont see others like me. I just want to be comfortable the majority of the time. Keep in touch, you seem to be an open minded folk who would have great insigt on various topics. We have now decided not to move to Vermont. We are planning on vacationing there next year however.

[darky]

You'd probably have less of a hard time being in an interracial relationship in Vermont than anywhere else in the U.S. Where d'y'all decide to move?

[rodowski]

We decided to moved to DMV dc area,