Stockton Today - California Tomorrow? (house, wages, cost)

[BlackShoe]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

And what do you propose to do with the 12 million or so illegals currently in the country?

Send them all over to your place and tell them that they can get work in your cabbage patch. Speaking of which, how many illegals do you now, and in the past, have you employed? Or would you rather decline to state?

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

Now Chief, those charts speak louder than "blocking tactics" arguments.
And what is particularly interesting to note that is not shown on those charts is that illegal immigration from Mexico has been reversing strongly since and continually throughout the recession all on its own as well. Thus the numbers are WAY down, yet enforcement is WAY up. The "aggregate" () effect is huge.

Note the increase in deportations has increased overall, but especially in "criminal" deportations ... demonstrating a very wisely focused policy on cutting the threat factors. Farm/field workers are in short supply now ... it is hurting the farm industry which relies on immigrant labor ... likewise the criminal element crossing the borders is shrinking -- and at an even greater rate. Hard to argue against this.

Impossible to ignore the need for immigrant workers ... yet no action from government to solve an easily solved problem in that regard ... one must wonder "why"?

Actually, Nully, all that very much depends upon from which bin you pull your facts. God knows there are plenty enough to choose from.

The issue de jour was the possibility of CA, by statute, becoming effectively a sanctuary state. That would more involve those already here and in other states than it would the trickle that is now coming from abroad.

Hmm! For the life of me I don't remember ever saying that there wasn't a need for migrant workers. Obviously there is. But by all means feel free to continue to tag-team and pile-on! We are amused!

[nullgeo]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

Actually, Nully, all that very much depends upon from which bin you pull your facts. God knows there are plenty enough to choose from.

The issue de jour was the possibility of CA, by statute, becoming effectively a sanctuary state. That would more involve those already here and in other states than it would the trickle that is now coming from abroad.

Hmm! For the life of me I don't remember ever saying that there wasn't a need for migrant workers. Obviously there is. But by all means feel free to continue to tag-team and pile-on! We are amused!

There is truth to the "bin" observation ... and there certainly are plenty of "bins" ... but in this case I see all the factual "bins" pointing to the same reality: illegals are leaving on their own in substantial numbers, general enforcement is way up, and criminal enforcement is especially targeted. There has been much written to confirm these things for the past couple years from many sources.

And I didn't accuse you of saying there wasn't a need for migrant workers. You've got your back up and are getting defensive toward me when I have been supporting a view without attacking you in any real sense. I differ from your point of view. But I haven't dog-piled at all.

As for the "sanctuary state", 'tis a strange issue ... because "sanctuary" in this case really amounts to a city or state recognizing that the issue is federal responsibility at root -- and that state and cities really aren't supposed to participate in the enforcement process -- unless specifically requested by federal authority. And, the federal authorities have clearly stated they don't want states and cities to load the federal system by acting to weed out illegals and report and detain / turn them over to federal enforcement.

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

As for the "sanctuary state", 'tis a strange issue ... because "sanctuary" in this case really amounts to a city or state recognizing that the issue is federal responsibility at root -- and that state and cities really aren't supposed to participate in the enforcement process -- unless specifically requested by federal authority. And, the federal authorities have clearly stated they don't want states and cities to load the federal system by acting to weed out illegals and report and detain / turn them over to federal enforcement.

Most unfortunaty. However, remember that the Supreme Court did make allowances in the AZ case for identification and referral. What the Feds do with it thereafter is a whole other matter and outside the purview of the referring state.

However, for a state to take a bare minimum approach to a retained right when it comes to lawlessness I find absurd. They might as well hand out roadmaps; not to the already declared "sanctuary cities" but to the state as a whole. I'm sure that will be helpful.

As with most things its not so much a matter of action and outcome as it is a matter of intent, by both Washington and Sacramento.

[.highnlite]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

No, only if twisted to meet preconceived ideas. Laughable! Actually it's merely proof that when they want to (a rare occasion), Independents can be just as patronizing as Liberals, whatever they call themselves.

Argue with facts, I find that funny.

Send them all over to your place and tell them that they can get work in your cabbage patch. Speaking of which, how many illegals do you now, and in the past, have you employed? Or would you rather decline to state?

Conservatives crack me up, complete lack of knowledge on a subject does not stop them from posting. If you understood California Agriculture at all, you would know that growers do not employ field labor. If you paid any attention to my posts, you would know that I do not farm.

But go ahead and post away.. You and curmie are equally accurate this fine AM.

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

Argue with facts, I find that funny.



Conservatives crack me up, complete lack of knowledge on a subject does not stop them from posting. If you understood California Agriculture at all, you would know that growers do not employ field labor. If you paid any attention to my posts, you would know that I do not farm.

But go ahead and post away.. You and curmie are equally accurate this fine AM.

That's all. Just

[.highnlite]

I have a theory about ya curmie. When sober your posts are rational, apparently this is not one of those days.

[BlackShoe]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

If you paid any attention to my posts, you would know that I do not farm.

Oh? Seem to recall some time ago your comment that you supplied most of the coleslaw that the fast food places in the Coastal Central California area used. If you do not farm how did that come about? Could pay to be more careful what you post, some of us do have pretty good memories.

[Curmudgeon]

Futile!

[.highnlite]

Originally Posted by BlackShoe

Oh? Seem to recall some time ago your comment that you supplied most of the coleslaw that the fast food places in the Coastal Central California area used. If you do not farm how did that come about? Could pay to be more careful what you post, some of us do have pretty good memories.

Ah Blackshoe, I rather doubt I said I supplied most of the coleslaw ..... In fact, I have never seen a crop of coleslaw.

I probably said that the family ag business did supply most of the cabbage that KFC makes their coleslaw from.