What city is the best alternative to California?

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by ExeterMedia

It's fallen on its "tookus". High speed rail is a failed experiment that California was never ready for. The NIMBYs have effectively killed the project in its infancy. King County residents have sued to block it. Fresno residents have sued to block it, and a judge has blocked $9 billion in bond sales that would have funded the project. By the time all of this gets out of the courts, we will have already invented Star Trek matter-to-matter transporters.

Time to kill it.

I would be happy to kill it. I'd be happy to kill anything that facilitates more growth or ease of use of the state thus encouraging more people coming here. But "lawsuits" don't mean squat other than confirming we are still in America de-rigueur. Like invasive species, these things don't die easily.

Anyway, in spite of my own reasons for not wanting the damn train, it might prove to be successful by its own definition in the end. Hope not.

[ExeterMedia]

It's has always been a good idea on paper, like a lot of things.

But this has always been an easy target for NIMBY lawyers. It has to pass through 8-9 counties, several cities/towns, and through several large swaths of farming area. The lawyers are literally salivating at the thought of tying up High Speed Rail for years and collecting fees for doing so. This project is going to put a lot of NIMBY lawyer children through college, and buy a lot of top-down Porsches.

[ExeterMedia]

Originally Posted by LuvSouthOC

I agree on the NIMBY problem, but what is so wrong with planning such a train? Sure, you can argue huge costs, ridership, subsidies, yada yada, but it is something that many of us long for; a European style high speed train. It makes sense on many levels. And having it would be an enormous boast to our infrastructure.

Rather than declare defeat, why not fight the NIMBYS and finally (if not now, when we can afford it) build something world class?

I never said anything was "wrong" with planning a high speed rail line. Just like there is nothing wrong with planning a manned mission to Mars. Doesn't mean it will happen within our lifetimes.

Fighting the NIMBYs always seems noble in thought, then you realize that all the fighting does is enrich lawyers, and put their kids through expensive private university.

[psr13]

We left CA and didn't want to go to somewhere like CA (hence why we left) are are currently in the Salt Lake City area. We like it more than CA but really don't expect to end up here. We want somewhere with more snow and that isn't so hot in the summer. However, this is where we could get jobs for the moment and that has a winter (our two requirements).

[bigdumbgod]

Originally Posted by psr13

We left CA and didn't want to go to somewhere like CA (hence why we left) are are currently in the Salt Lake City area.

Kind of like OC, except cheaper. Multiple wives can get expensive, though.

[nslander]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

I would be happy to kill it. I'd be happy to kill anything that facilitates more growth or ease of use of the state thus encouraging more people coming here. But "lawsuits" don't mean squat other than confirming we are still in America de-rigueur. Like invasive species, these things don't die easily.

Anyway, in spite of my own reasons for not wanting the damn train, it might prove to be successful by its own definition in the end. Hope not.

But the state's population IS going to increase. What you propose guarantees a significant, unit for unit, increase in more of the same of our existing transportation infrastructure. This is a question of "what type", and whose priorities are respected. And despite the rhetorical flogging and litigious blood-letting, it is going to get built. Anybody who did not anticipate this exact political ****-storm since even before prop 1A passed has not been paying attention to the state of our society. Fortunately for all of us, the Governor is playing the long game.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by nslander

But the state's population IS going to increase. What you propose guarantees a significant, unit for unit, increase in more of the same of our existing transportation infrastructure. This is a question of "what type", and whose priorities are respected. And despite the rhetorical flogging and litigious blood-letting, it is going to get built. Anybody who did not anticipate this exact political ****-storm since even before prop 1A passed has not been paying attention to the state of our society. Fortunately for all of us, the Governor is playing the long game.

Don't dispute a thing you've said. Yep. I believe it WILL be built. And I think it's possible that it will be a "success" by the plan's definition.

I just plain don't like anything that makes mobility easier. That only leads to more development. Unit increase on the existing, crumbling infrastructure dampens the growth. Also increases the frequency of road rage incidents that can lead to some early attrition from armed conflict.