Gov Brown Signs $15 CA min wage law RIP California Businesses (purchasing, university)

[tikkasf]

Originally Posted by expatCA

But the cost is passed on to everyone, including the majority who do not get an increase in wage so they are losers. Higher cost and no 0ffsetting wage increase.

well you can state for just about any increased business cost passed on to the customers. I don't see myself as a "loser" if the local cafe' raised the price of a cappuccino by $0.25 to help offset increase in labor costs. Maybe a modest wage increase gets somebody off food stamps.......

California’s food stamp recipients rise by 123% in last decade « Data Points

[candalf]

Everyone working 40+ hours a week should be able to live with dignity. That is barely possible even on $15, let alone less. Is that not what America is all about, the promise that if one contributes to economy, they will not live in poverty?

As a professional, I am more than willing to pay a couple extra bucks for a meal, knowing that I am lifting my fellow citizens up. I do not want to live in a Third World country, understand that there are costs and am willing to help pay them.

The very existence of working poor is a shame for us as a society. I just cannot understand how anyone can be against living wage. There is plenty of wealth to go around in this country.

[Electrician4you]

Originally Posted by candalf

Everyone working 40+ hours a week should be able to live with dignity. That is barely possible even on $15, let alone less. Is that not what America is all about, the promise that if one contributes to economy, they will not live in poverty?

As a professional, I am more than willing to pay a couple extra bucks for a meal, knowing that I am lifting my fellow citizens up. I do not want to live in a Third World country, understand that there are costs and am willing to help pay them.

The very existence of working poor is a shame for us as a society. I just cannot understand how anyone can be against living wage. There is plenty of wealth to go around in this country.

And America is also about self made. How many of those people working crappy jobs try to do more than just go to work like a robot? I remember when I got my first real paycheck at 15 (not just cash from working on the field or helping neighbors) I looked at it and said no way I'm doing this for that money. (Min wage was 3.25)
So I actually went and did a few things about it. That was my only min wage job.

Any of these people can go to a college or trade school. Yet they don't. I want more money for doing a menial job. Pay me more. My job isn't worth that but I want more money. Sorry it's not my job to lift someone out of the poverty they are in. Especially if they aren't willing to do anything about it themselves.

[BRinSM]

Originally Posted by Electrician4you

And America is also about self made. How many of those people working crappy jobs try to do more than just go to work like a robot? I remember when I got my first real paycheck at 15 (not just cash from working on the field or helping neighbors) I looked at it and said no way I'm doing this for that money. (Min wage was 3.25)
So I actually went and did a few things about it. That was my only min wage job.

Any of these people can go to a college or trade school. Yet they don't. I want more money for doing a menial job. Pay me more. My job isn't worth that but I want more money. Sorry it's not my job to lift someone out of the poverty they are in. Especially if they aren't willing to do anything about it themselves.

The problem with your argument is that society still needs people to do these low paying jobs even if everyone went to college or trade school. The need for this type of labor will never dissapear completely and I also don't think it's fair for a person to work 80+ hours a week to afford to house and feed themselves and their families.

[candalf]

Originally Posted by Electrician4you

...
Any of these people can go to a college or trade school. Yet they don't. I want more money for doing a menial job. Pay me more. My job isn't worth that but I want more money. Sorry it's not my job to lift someone out of the poverty they are in. Especially if they aren't willing to do anything about it themselves.

First, not all people are equally smart. There are a lot of us who just can't handle school. One can be hard working, have integrity but not be cut out for learning something complex. It is wrong to leave such people behind if they are contributing to the fullest of their abilities.

Second, the go to college route is feasible for a single person. But if one has children and earns a minimum wage, they need to work 60-70 hours a week just to not end up living on the streets. There is just no time to learn anything new, one is basically doing forced labor with extreme privation being the whip.

[jm1982]

Originally Posted by candalf

First, not all people are equally smart. There are a lot of us who just can't handle school. One can be hard working, have integrity but not be cut out for learning something complex. It is wrong to leave such people behind if they are contributing to the fullest of their abilities.

Second, the go to college route is feasible for a single person. But if one has children and earns a minimum wage, they need to work 60-70 hours a week just to not end up living on the streets. There is just no time to learn anything new, one is basically doing forced labor with extreme privation being the whip.

On your first point . I do agree not everyone should go to college , but I don't think we should have the attitude that some are just destined to do low pay work. There are different types of intelligence .
Someone might not be "book smart" or good at math but they might be really good with people and they could be a good salesperson for example .
A big part of the problem is that we want to limit or label people too much and box them in .
Mindset is a very big part of what keeps people down financially . Also negative connections to money . People that think it's greedy to make too much money etc .

On the second point . Is there anyone in America today forced to have a child? There is something called birth control there isn't a good excuse for having children before one is able to afford them .
I saw someone on tv at one of these protests saying if she made $15 hr she could afford to support her 4 kids .

Additionally it's not true that someone has to be destined to minimum wage work if have a kid and no college degree . They also do find time to take classes either at night or online .

It's much easier to find excuses versus solutions to our problems.

[jm1982]

Originally Posted by Electrician4you

And America is also about self made. How many of those people working crappy jobs try to do more than just go to work like a robot? I remember when I got my first real paycheck at 15 (not just cash from working on the field or helping neighbors) I looked at it and said no way I'm doing this for that money. (Min wage was 3.25)
So I actually went and did a few things about it. That was my only min wage job.

Any of these people can go to a college or trade school. Yet they don't. I want more money for doing a menial job. Pay me more. My job isn't worth that but I want more money. Sorry it's not my job to lift someone out of the poverty they are in. Especially if they aren't willing to do anything about it themselves.

I totally agree . Government should not be telling people what to pay their employees . There are millions of people working these minimum jobs that signed up for them . They knew the pay and agreed to it . Now they are complaining it's not enough ? That's not how it works or at least not how it should work in a capitalist society.
Laws like this push us more towards a socialist society .
You are right that if someone wants to make more they need to find a way to be more valuable . You either find a way to make more money for a business as an employee or you create your own business .

The jobs with the lowest barrier to entry will always be the lowest paying .
I just don't buy that all minimum wage workers are too busy to learn new skills or have zero time for other income producing opportunities when they are off work .

They don't watch tv? They don't go on Facebook or instagram ? They don't hang out with friends ?

Are they really putting in some effort everyday to improve their situation ?
Some of them are but definitely not all of them .
Whose fault is that ?

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by jm1982

I totally agree . Government should not be telling people what to pay their employees . There are millions of people working these minimum jobs that signed up for them . They knew the pay and agreed to it . Now they are complaining it's not enough ? That's not how it works or at least not how it should work in a capitalist society.
Laws like this push us more towards a socialist society .
You are right that if someone wants to make more they need to find a way to be more valuable . You either find a way to make more money for a business as an employee or you create your own business .

The jobs with the lowest barrier to entry will always be the lowest paying .
I just don't buy that all minimum wage workers are too busy to learn new skills or have zero time for other income producing opportunities when they are off work .

They don't watch tv? They don't go on Facebook or instagram ? They don't hang out with friends ?

Are they really putting in some effort everyday to improve their situation ?
Some of them are but definitely not all of them .
Whose fault is that ?

It is a feel good law that will ultimately make no difference in the long run.

[RaymondChandlerLives]

Originally Posted by expatCA

It is a feel good law that will ultimately make no difference in the long run.

How does a law thst ultimately pays minimum wage workers more male no difference?

Those that currently make $15 now have leverage to negotiate for higher wages themselves, and so forth.

If the precious job creators don't like it, screw them. They've been getting by underpaying Americans for far too long - - McDonald's practically told its employees for years to go on welfare because their pay was so pathetic, while they raked in countless billions in profits. Enough is enough

[jm1982]

Originally Posted by RaymondChandlerLives

How does a law thst ultimately pays minimum wage workers more male no difference?

Those that currently make $15 now have leverage to negotiate for higher wages themselves, and so forth.

If the precious job creators don't like it, screw them. They've been getting by underpaying Americans for far too long - - McDonald's practically told its employees for years to go on welfare because their pay was so pathetic, while they raked in countless billions in profits. Enough is enough

So screw the private employer job creators and what ? Have the government create jobs for all these workers ?
A dangerous attitude to have .
Also this is bigger than McDonald's . Many Many many small businesses in CA will be affected and many are immigrant owned . Doesn't the left care or pretend to care about immigrants ?

I guess not when they are small business owners .