Explain Why I shouldn't Vote "NO" on Proposition 5

[Tulemutt]

All I know is I’m leaving one of my boats to my sons, tax-free ... it’s not worth anything much to anybody.

The other boat I plan to drift offshore in when my time comes ... can of gasoline rigged to a timer ... a nice apple pie ... some good drugs ... tunes. Get high, eat pie, set timer, listen to Pink Floyd, go to sleep ... viking funeral ... no tax transfers.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe

This isn't about whether or not they can afford to leave them to their kids, or should leave them to their kids. It's about their right to do it.

Right, should, ought. Same thing, Snow.

You're talking about taking away the right to leave an inheritance to your kids.

What? I can't even follow your logic on this. Who on this thread has said anything like that?

If that inheritance is a paid-off property, then that paid-off property should not come with restrictions like - they MUST live in it or lose it.

Who said anything about them having to live in it or lose it? These people are already protected under current propositions.

It just seems like all of these discussions are based on jealousy of people who found a way to buy property in the 1970's after Prop 13 was passed - and - held on to those properties.

I have no idea where you came up with this. Most of us have benefited from Prop 13...not sure where the comment about jealousy comes in.

[NoMoreSnowForMe]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

Right, should, ought. Same thing, Snow.



What? I can't even follow your logic on this. Who on this thread has said anything like that?



Who said anything about them having to live in it or lose it? These people are already protected under current propositions.



I have no idea where you came up with this. Most of us have benefited from Prop 13...not sure where the comment about jealousy comes in.

If you think that people who have inherited property with Prop 13 benefits, and now rent them out at profits, is bad - which you have said so - then I disagree with you.

And if you think they shouldn't have the right to rent the property out, then, by logic, you are insinuating that you think they should have to live in the property to have Prop 13 benefits. That's just simple logic. And, I was referring to other posters who have said so.

And if you can't wrap your head around the fact that people who are opposed to the above are only opposed based on some jealousy factor, then I will never change your mind.

But, ask anyone who hates the Prop benefits - who is not currently benefiting from them - if they WERE benefiting from them - would they hate them, and see what they say.

In other words, do you know anyone who is benefiting from Prop 13 benefits complaining about them? No.

And anyone who isn't benefiting from them - would they complain if all of a sudden they discovered that they had inherited property on the coast of Malibu, under Prop 13 protections? And what if that same person had previously loudly protested about Prop 13 protections? Do you think they'd still complain?

Not likely.

I don't understand why you are being so obtuse. I make rational arguments. If you can't understand them, I'll have to assume you just don't want to.

[JJonesIII]

Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe

I don't understand why you are being so obtuse. I make rational arguments. If you can't understand them, I'll have to assume you just don't want to.

You nailed it with that closing comment. Well said.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe

If you think that people who have inherited property with Prop 13 benefits, and now rent them out at profits, is bad - which you have said so - then I disagree with you.

Please point out where I said this is "bad." I didn't. I posted a link that refuted another poster's claim that a certain number of "transfers are done between children and parents to transfer property tax basis. Most of which I believe are people living in their homes until they pass," which isn't true.

Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe

And if you can't wrap your head around the fact that people who are opposed to the above are only opposed based on some jealousy factor, then I will never change your mind.

Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe

I don't understand why you are being so obtuse. I make rational arguments.

Good lord. Give it a rest.

[realrelics]

Originally Posted by Sparrow_temp

I just purchased a home so am paying the maximum possible rate. The way I see it is that those who got the benefit of huge property value increases and didn't have to pay the taxes based on these new values didn't "pay their dues". What prop 13 did was push the tax burden on to new buyers and forced them to subsidize the tax burden of those that purchased earlier. It's in effect a huge pyramid scheme that depends upon ever increasing property values to maintain. Prop 13 should be amended to keep the rate fixed but eliminate the protection of the assessment values so that it's like most other states. If the taxes get too high, sell your property and move to a less costly area of the country and be VERY happy that you made so much money on your sale.

I'll never believe that prop 13 is good for everybody. It's just great for everybody that's had huge property value increases. That's why the average property tax rate is .79% and I'm paying around 1.12%. Everybody should be paying the same rate and that rate should be VERY VERY difficult to change. A property tax system not based on current property values is inherently unfair because it means that one segment of the population has to subsidize another. Subsidies normally would just go to the poor but in California, they are just going to those that have gained the most.

Prop 5 just compounds the original Prop 13 problem by letting those getting the subsidies to continue to get them even if they sell their property. If you want the situation to be fair then you would want accurate property assessments and a lower property tax rate that everybody pays.

Your property taxes are basically fixed, like everyone else's in Ca. If you bought your house for $500,000 today and pay about $6200 per year in taxes, in 20 years if your house is worth $1,000,000, you will still be paying about $6200 per year in property tax. Maybe a better system would be that everyone pays on the market value of homes, but no over the age of 62 or collecting Social Security pays no income tax, no school bond tax, nothing.