Will we ever reach a time in California when everybody says, enough taxes... (San Diego: vacation home, tech job)

[Mikala43]

Originally Posted by Pyramidsurf

I think it evens out that California's taxes and Hawaii's taxes are similar. What's not similar is the higher cost of living in Hawaii. Food and utilities are much much more expensive when compared to coastal California.

Our electricity is the highest in the nation. We're number 1! We're number 1!

You want AC? That will be $400 a month or more.


CA is so big that all the areas are so different, I'm not sure how you can "hate" the whole thing. Small rural towns, politically correct San Fran, shallow SoCal.... I mean it really has everything.

I intensely dislike SoCal, just not my scene, but who cares and why would I post that everywhere? It's GOOD that there are a variety of places and lifestyles we can choose from.

Tulemutt is right, the more desirable, the more expensive.

And I don't know about other boards.... I spend to much time here, I'm not going to add other boards.

BTW, we have been here for 30 years, and will move to CONUS this year or early next. We would rather see our money go further and be able to travel without a 5 hour plane ride minimum.

[Finper]

Originally Posted by Mikala43

Our electricity is the highest in the nation. We're number 1! We're number 1!

You want AC? That will be $400 a month or more.


CA is so big that all the areas are so different, I'm not sure how you can "hate" the whole thing. Small rural towns, politically correct San Fran, shallow SoCal.... I mean it really has everything.

I intensely dislike SoCal, just not my scene, but who cares and why would I post that everywhere? It's GOOD that there are a variety of places and lifestyles we can choose from.

Tulemutt is right, the more desirable, the more expensive.

And I don't know about other boards.... I spend to much time here, I'm not going to add other boards.

BTW, we have been here for 30 years, and will move to CONUS this year or early next. We would rather see our money go further and be able to travel without a 5 hour plane ride minimum.

what's CONUS ? You made it way longer then most. Everyone I know that moved to Hawaii barely makes 2 years. I hear the homeless problem is out of control there too. I've been to Hawaii lots of times but it's never been a place I considered moving to. Downtown Honolulu is a trip! Hookers, Homeless, addicts, locals hating tourists, Hey kinda like LA...

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by Mikala43

...
Tulemutt is right, the more desirable, the more expensive.

And I don't know about other boards.... I spend to much time here, I'm not going to add other boards.

BTW, we have been here for 30 years, and will move to CONUS this year or early next. We would rather see our money go further and be able to travel without a 5 hour plane ride minimum.

Ok. I’ll just say that, having lived in Minnesota, California, Hawaii, military schooling in Florida and the south, lots of time up in Washington, and lots of youth in Michigan ... when I drop in on threads from other states, I read whining and complaining ... but rarely, if ever, people from one state posting in another state’s forum just to denigrate without any apparent reason ........... except attacks against California. Sheesh!

[JGC97]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Ok. I’ll just say that, having lived in Minnesota, California, Hawaii, military schooling in Florida and the south, lots of time up in Washington, and lots of youth in Michigan ... when I drop in on threads from other states, I read whining and complaining ... but rarely, if ever, people from one state posting in another state’s forum just to denigrate without any apparent reason ........... except attacks against California. Sheesh!

You're right. They do and I've "visited" several of the other states' threads here and never do I see people from a different state tear into it the way non-residents do here. Although, to our credit, the threads here are a lot more active than in other states. I don't know if that's good or bad. Maybe those in other states are staying busy "off the net" with real lives and we're the ones with no life offline.

The answer to the problem is simple. Do not respond. Don't reply when a new thread is started by an outsider. Don't respond to posts made by outsiders. Just don't. If you ignore them, it'll tick 'em off and they'll eventually leave. And, if they don't leave, they'll get to frustrated with it, they say something really nasty and then BOOM, they're banned. Give it a shot and see how it works. You never know.

[janellen]

Aren't some or a lot of those out of state posters former Californians? Anyway, it's an open forum. Anyone is free to post as long as they're within the TOS. I like hearing from folks who used to live here but have found contentment elsewhere.


I have full confidence that you guys can handle the really obnoxious ones.

[Taksan]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

It’s not? Whoa! In what universe? The 1% universe? Even the 10% universe? 1% and 10% are, by definition, pretty small universes compared to the rest of us who don’t have anything close to that kind of annual taxation. The majority of state residents don’t even earn that gross, pre-tax.

And, news flash, people who DO earn to pay those numbers aren’t the ones leaving the state at all. You can look that one up.

Over and out.

The 1% are important to the 99% because they pay 48% of the state income tax.

As for leaving....Yes they are ... net loss of 14k top bracket tax residents in CA last year.

[Mikala43]

For many years, more people have been leaving California for other states than have been moving here. According to data from the American Community Survey, from 2007 to 2016, about 5 million people moved to California from other states, while about 6 million left California. On net, the state lost 1 million residents to domestic migration—about 2.5 percent of its total population. These population losses are low in historical terms. The graph below shows data from the Internal Revenue Service on the movement of income tax filers in and out of California since 1990. (Data on tax filers does not cover the entire population because some people do not earn enough income to necessitate filing taxes.) As the graph shows, net out-migration from 1990 to 2006 was, on average, more than double what is was in the most recent ten years.

Migration among certain demographic groups also differs from the state’s general pattern. Although California has had net out-migration among most demographic groups, it has gained among those with higher incomes ($110,000 per year or more) and higher levels of education (graduate degrees). This can be seen in the three graphics below, which display migration between California and other states broken out by income, age, and education. Orange indicates net out-migration from California to the other state, while blue indicates net in-migration to California. Brighter colors indicate higher amounts of migration.

https://lao.ca.gov/laoecontax/article/detail/265

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by Taksan

The 1% are important to the 99% because they pay 48% of the state income tax.

As for leaving....Yes they are ... net loss of 14k top bracket tax residents in CA last year.

I didn’t respond to whether they were more important than the 99% ... or whether they are important in any way at all. I responded to your suggestion that lots of people pay $100k a year in taxes. That is false hyperbole by definition. 1% is not “many”. Regardless of your feelings of value.

As for leaving, no, they aren’t. Aside from the fact that California has a much higher population of super wealthy than the rest of the nation .... um, just using the 1% figure for conversation, you’ll note that 1% of 40 million is 400,000 ... of which, if we accept your unsupported claim of 14,000 net loss (got link?), that 14,000 is 3.5%.

Now then, if we were to want to be meaningful in throwing around suspiciously specious stats, we’d want to substantiate WHO, exactly, among those purported 14,000, were the ones that left how much revenue lacking. Because, the wealth being taxed from those theoretical 400,000 varies a YUGE amount even within that demographic.

Etc.

Take away: without some very solid analysis based on verifiable, credible, professional research - your declarations are pretty much hogwash.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by Mikala43

For many years, more people have been leaving California for other states than have been moving here. According to data from the American Community Survey, from 2007 to 2016, about 5 million people moved to California from other states, while about 6 million left California. On net, the state lost 1 million residents to domestic migration—about 2.5 percent of its total population. These population losses are low in historical terms. The graph below shows data from the Internal Revenue Service on the movement of income tax filers in and out of California since 1990. (Data on tax filers does not cover the entire population because some people do not earn enough income to necessitate filing taxes.) As the graph shows, net out-migration from 1990 to 2006 was, on average, more than double what is was in the most recent ten years.

Migration among certain demographic groups also differs from the state’s general pattern. Although California has had net out-migration among most demographic groups, it has gained among those with higher incomes ($110,000 per year or more) and higher levels of education (graduate degrees). This can be seen in the three graphics below, which display migration between California and other states broken out by income, age, and education. Orange indicates net out-migration from California to the other state, while blue indicates net in-migration to California. Brighter colors indicate higher amounts of migration.

https://lao.ca.gov/laoecontax/article/detail/265

... and Mikala strikes again, providing solid, factual, verifiable research to debunk the hyperbole ...

[Taksan]

Take out Silicon Valley and see how your stats look ...