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Well, take it as you will, but, while American immigration to Canada has been on the rise the past couple of years, and Canadian immigration to the United States has been declining (most likely reflecting Bush dissatisfaction on both ends)... there are STILL over 23,000 Canadians that moved South to America last year and 11000 Americans that moved north to Canada.
America has 10X the population of Canada, so that's a significant difference per capita!
Find your own paradise. The United States is so much "larger" than Canada in every way except landmass. You really can't compare the two fairly anymore than it's fair to compare California to New Hampshire, or big city living to the suburbs. I prefer Canadian politics for the most part, but there's something really special and kinda interesting about living in the tumultuous, raucous, conflicted center of the Empire.
Both countries have good areas and bad. The United States has every geographical and climatic option to choose from. You'd be wise to research the various and distinct areas of the United States, as there's 1000 different ways to get a typical "American" life!
if you give Toronto the same area as greater Chicagoland both Toronto's GDP and population is almost exactly the same. With about 8 million people in the golden horseshoe area and a rate of population growth greater than Houston, Texas, comparing Canada to the US isn't the same as comparing California to New Hampshire. Both countries have very large fast growing rich cities and both countries are in the G8.
Vancouver is closer to 3.5 million people if you want to give it a fair comparison to US cities whose populations are quoted in areas 8-10 times larger.
using the consolidated metro urban area method that the US uses to compare cities, Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver would be about the same size as Chicago, Boston, and Seattle respectively.
Canada is more like California adding adding Alaska and Greenland and putting more distance between their cities except for LA and San Francisco (Toronto and Montreal are not that far apart and there's about 20 million people in the Windsor Quebec corridoor.)
If you like high taxes and living off the gov't, go to Canada, If you want to make your own way in the world and keep more of your own money, go to the US. If you come from Europe, or probably anywhere else in the world, Canada's social system will be more familiar.
canadas tax rate is almost just as high as the USAs
that article made no mention of cost of living. Incomes have risen but so has cost of living in almost all major metro areas. The question is, has this rise in income kept pace with the increasing cost of living.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fastninja500 I chose the USA over Australia or Canada because of my perception of more opportunities in the USA. And I made the right bet !
that article made no mention of cost of living. Incomes have risen but so has cost of living in almost all major metro areas. The question is, has this rise in income kept pace with the increasing cost of living.
You're right. No mention of the rising cost of living. But to me, cost of living tend to always rise over time, wherever in the world you live. So the key to me is rise in income.
The article's main point was about "income mobility", which is why I love living in the USA. I've personally experienced this income mobility. From being a fresh immigrant, with less than $100 in my pocket and no place to stay, I've managed to live more "comfortably" every year.
"The Millionaire Next Door" is definiitely true. My wife and I don't just live within our means, we live below our means. We're fiscally conservative. Fully invested. We can buy anything we need. But don't buy anyting we "want" (i.e. we may want the Ipods, Iphone, flat panel tv, bmw, lexus, etc.... but we don't buy them. Well, we did buy the Macs because they were really good investments). And when a good investment opportunity comes along, we usually can afford to buy in, because we've been fiscally conservative.
"Has this rise in income kept pace with the increasing cost of living?". For us, yes, definitely. Rising cost of living can be managed. We focus on working smarter to increase our income to easily cover any rise in cost of living. And if the cost of living rises to the point where it becomes un-affordable? Well, then simply move to another place that has a better cost of living. We've done this too.
Our friends that immigrated to Canada have done okay too (there were 4 of us best friends that immigrated at the same time: 2 to Canada and 2 to the USA). But they still tell us that they wish they were able to migrate to the USA with us. In fact, their oldest kid (in college) plans to move to the USA. They frequently come down from Mississauga, Ontario to visit us and love shopping here in NJ.
Looking at it objectively from the financial side of things, the 2 of us that immigrated to the USA have done quite a bit better than the 2 that immigrated to Canada.
Last edited by fastninja500; 12-06-2007 at 02:18 PM..
I think the US is more dynamic and offers more in the way of opportunity. Canada, however, is 'kinder' somewhat and treats it's less fortunate moderately better. In Canada, there is at least, the feeling or idea that we owe each other something other that what is stipulated by contract law. I think it might be the difference between a nation born out of violent revolution and one born out of negotiation.
Two major questions. Where in the US and what is your economic outlook. The US has some spectacular places that are way better than Canada if you have the means. Think about the SF Bay Area or DC. In the Bay Area no one is going to teach your kids intelligent design. You will not feel as a foreigner (neither in DC) simply because such a huge portion of us come from abroad. Very progressive, democrat, innovative and creative area (think about the hippie movement, the anti-Vietnam movement, the Internet revolution). Jobs are as good as it gets anywhere in the world, job market is very dynamic (not just technology), geography is stunning (you feel like if you were in vacation all-year round) and San Francisco is a world-class Tier I city. Yes, if you have the means the Bay Area beats any time any place in Canada, including beautiful Vancouver (my top choice in Canada). Washington DC may not have the same access to geography, but all my Canadian friends who lived in DC would like to return. I agree... our health care system sucks and education is extremely expensive, and... no maternity leave (yes, believe it, we don't have maternity leave in the US, it's up to the employer!!!)... that's why I said "if you have the means", to for example have you or your spouse out of the labor force for some months, afford health care and pay our super expensive education.
Also, I wouldn't live in more than 10 areas in the ENTIRE US. And the same goes for Canada. SF, DC, Chicago, Boston, Seattle, San Diego and Denver are places where I'd live. In Canada Vancouver or Toronto. If I'm forced to go to other places, I'd rather go back to my country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fastninja500 I chose the USA over Australia or Canada because of my perception of more opportunities in the USA. And I made the right bet !
You're right. No mention of the rising cost of living. But to me, cost of living tend to always rise over time, wherever in the world you live. So the key to me is rise in income.
The article's main point was about "income mobility", which is why I love living in the USA. I've personally experienced this income mobility. From being a fresh immigrant, with less than $100 in my pocket and no place to stay, I've managed to live more "comfortably" every year.
"The Millionaire Next Door" is definiitely true. My wife and I don't just live within our means, we live below our means. We're fiscally conservative. Fully invested. We can buy anything we need. But don't buy anyting we "want" (i.e. we may want the Ipods, Iphone, flat panel tv, bmw, lexus, etc.... but we don't buy them. Well, we did buy the Macs because they were really good investments). And when a good investment opportunity comes along, we usually can afford to buy in, because we've been fiscally conservative.
"Has this rise in income kept pace with the increasing cost of living?". For us, yes, definitely. Rising cost of living can be managed. We focus on working smarter to increase our income to easily cover any rise in cost of living. And if the cost of living rises to the point where it becomes un-affordable? Well, then simply move to another place that has a better cost of living. We've done this too.
Our friends that immigrated to Canada have done okay too (there were 4 of us best friends that immigrated at the same time: 2 to Canada and 2 to the USA). But they still tell us that they wish they were able to migrate to the USA with us. In fact, their oldest kid (in college) plans to move to the USA. They frequently come down from Mississauga, Ontario to visit us and love shopping here in NJ.
Looking at it objectively from the financial side of things, the 2 of us that immigrated to the USA have done quite a bit better than the 2 that immigrated to Canada.
while your situation is nice I was speaking about the average American not a single case. I know in Florida the cost of living has not kept pace with the average pay which has led to more people leaving the state than coming in (florida chamber of commerce just issued a report on this). The same is true for NYC (working middle class adults are leaving, population has remained steady because of births, you can find that information in the NYC forum). Can't speak for other places.
In the US, you have the world's most powerful nuclear arsenal with most citizens reading on the 6th grade level.
That is the most absurd thing I have ever read.
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Canada or US
