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Well, the Hebrew here is אלילים, which really means "worthless" and is just a play on the word אלהים, "god/s." This is rhetoric, and it's just saying the other gods are so much less powerful than YHWH that they're basically worthless. It's not insisting that the other gods are really only inanimate idols that the other nations pretend are gods. The ancient Israelites absolutely believed the gods of the nations were real. The original version of Deut 32:8–9 actually insists that Elyon set up the gods over their respective nations, calling them his sons. He gave Israel to YHWH. )
I disagree, there are no gods period, people make them up. or misunderstand nature
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But if we go to 1 Cor 10:20, the author insists that what is sacrificed to idols is really sacrificed to demons. Here he's quoting Deut 32:17, which calls the gods of the other nations demons. "Demon" is really just "a god I don't like." The early Christians also believed other divine beings existed, they just, similarly, marginalized their influence and power. Modern notions of philosophical and ontological monotheism are completely and absolutely absent from the Bible. All peoples from the biblical eras believed that other gods existed, they just rejected their influence and rejected their worship (at least, after around 700 BCE).
I disagree again, just like you said they are demons. and nothing else. just like you give satain more credit than he deserves, you make him a god, in your own mind. this is what is called darkness, and blindness.
let me say it again,“we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one”. if church folk, believe in others gods, and just don’t worship them, then they need to be re-educated in the knowledge of God's word. this is why God made the ten Judgments, or plagues on Egypt. what did the apostle Paul tell us. what was written afore time was for our learning. when our God brought our forefathers out of Egypt with a mighty hand this proved that any, or other so called gods are just that, so called, idols, meaning nothing. just your imagination. fooled by the double tongued, the devil, and his demons.
I disagree, there are no gods period, people make them up. or misunderstand nature.
Then the Bible misunderstands nature an awful lot, because it absolutely acknowledges the existence of other gods.
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Originally Posted by 101c
I disagree again, just like you said they are demons. and nothing else.
No, only a couple verses say that, and as I said, "demon" just means a god you don't like. There are many texts in the Bible, however, that acknowledge other gods as benevolent and even necessary.
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Originally Posted by 101c
just like you give satain more credit than he deserves, you make him a god, in your own mind. this is what is called darkness, and blindness.
No, the Bible does that when it say Satan is among the "sons of God," or, to appropriately interpret that construction according to ancient Israelite literary conventions, Satan is among the gods.
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Originally Posted by 101c
but thank for the response.
I wish I could say the same, but you didn't really respond to much of what I said. You just said, more or less, "Nu-uh!"
Then the Bible misunderstands nature an awful lot, because it absolutely acknowledges the existence of other gods.
they are called gods, but are not. 1 Corinthians 8:5 "For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
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No, only a couple verses say that, and as I said, "demon" just means a god you don't like. There are many texts in the Bible, however, that acknowledge other gods as benevolent and even necessary.
error, get this through you head, THERE IS NO gods AT ALL, natta.
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No, the Bible does that when it say Satan is among the "sons of God," or, to appropriately interpret that construction according to ancient Israelite literary conventions, Satan is among the gods!
LOL, gods are man made, do you understand, MAN MADE,
1 Chronicles 16:26 "For all the gods of the people are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.
did you hear what the verse said, “gods of the people”
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I wish I could say the same, but you didn't really respond to much of what I said. You just said, more or less, "Nu-uh!"
no need to respond, there is no gods. PERIOD. now end of that conversation. if there is something that you would to discuss concerning this topic fine, but there is NO gods.
Shana, that's fine to disagree on the subject part, it will come to you in time. but there is no denying that the Lord Jesus is God, that is proved without a doubt. now if the Lord Jesus is God the Father in Spirit, and he is, how can he be subject, to his OWN ]self?. the bible teaches, that a man cannot hate his own wife because she is of
his flesh, Ephesians 5:28 "So ought men to love their wives
as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. 29
For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and
cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church”. see the
bible principle. just as in power, 1 Corinthians 7:4
"The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the
husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife".
these are
bible principles Spiritually speaking. and God is a Spirit, and we're to be
"partaker" of this divine nature, but not in our present carnal state.
Hi 101c,
I believe that Adam came before Eve and that Eve was taken out of Adam. My belief is that Jesus came out of the Father. The Father was first and He is the head of all things, including Jesus. Just as our words come out from us, Jesus came forth from the Father, who is the source of all things, including His Word. The wife is to be subject to her husband just as the church is subject to the Lord, even though it is spiritually his body. Jesus is also subject to the Father. This is the arrangement-The Father is first- (the source of all things) Then there is the Son (the means through which God created all things) -and then we are all placed under the both of them. God bless.
Last edited by ShanaBrown; 10-01-2014 at 03:42 PM..
let me say it again,“we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one”.
And I'll say again that he insists two chapters later that what is sacrificed to idols is sacrificed to demons, which he absolutely believes exist. The Bible is not univocal. Tension and even downright contradiction exist from beginning to end.
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Originally Posted by 101c
if church folk, believe in others gods, and just don’t worship them, then they need to be re-educated in the knowledge of God's word.
This is a statement of dogma, not an informed reading of the biblical text.
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Originally Posted by 101c
this is why God made the ten Judgments, or plagues on Egypt. what did the apostle Paul tell us. what was written afore time was for our learning. when our God brought our forefathers out of Egypt with a mighty hand this proved that any, or other so called gods are just that, so called, idols, meaning nothing. just your imagination. fooled by the double tongued, the devil, and his demons.
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Originally Posted by 101c
there is only ONE God, and there is none other.
The biblical text itself repeatedly refutes that notion.
they are called gods, but are not. 1 Corinthians 8:5 "For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
Just picking one verse and interpreting all other verses through the interpretive lens you've developed from that verse is a fallacy called the hermeneutic circle. Why not pick a verse that explains there are innumerable gods and use that to interpret all other verses? You have to presuppose a dogma and then elevate the verses that support that dogma over all other verses.
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Originally Posted by 101c
error, get this through you head, THERE IS NO gods AT ALL, natta.
Then the Bible is lying when it says God made man a little lower than the gods? It's lying when it says God divided up the nations according to the number of the gods? It's lying when it says not to revile the gods? It's lying when it says that the gods came down and married human women and they gave birth to sons? It's lying when God tells the other gods to help him accomplish tasks in the primeval history? It's lying when it says to bring an accused person before the gods if their guilt or innocence cannot be determined? It's lying when it says the gods shouted for joy at the creation of the world? It's lying when it says the gods stood before YHWH's throne with Satan among them? It's lying when it says that the Moabite's god drove the Israelite forces away, despite YHWH having promised victory? It's lying when it says there are angels and demons? It's lying when it refers to a Satan who has his own angels and divine servants, just like God? It's lying in all these instances, or do you just misinterpret them to agree with the verses you've decided are more important?
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Originally Posted by 101c
LOL, gods are man made, do you understand, MAN MADE,
Deut 32:8–9 says they are God's children, and that he put them in their places as gods over the nations. Oh, you're probably not aware of the original version of Deut 32:8–9, though. You probably still think the one in your English translation is the right one.
[quote=101c;36711111]1 Chronicles 16:26 "For all the gods of the people are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.
did you hear what the verse said, “gods of the people”
Actually the Hebrew עמים here means "nations," and the verse is just a rhetorical way to insist that YHWH is so much more powerful than the other gods of the other nations.
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Originally Posted by 101c
no need to respond, there is no gods. PERIOD. now end of that conversation.
Just barking "Nu-uh!" doesn't make all those biblical verses disappear.
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Originally Posted by 101c
if there is something that you would to discuss concerning this topic fine, but there is NO gods.
I take it English is not your first language, but I've shown you numerous verses where the Bible unquestionably acknowledges the existence of other gods as actual real and powerful entities. You can say whatever you want about what you believe about the existence of gods today, but the Bible repeatedly and emphatically acknowledges the existence of innumerable other gods.
Shana, that's fine to disagree on the subject part, it will come to you in time. but there is no denying that the Lord Jesus is God, that is proved without a doubt. now if the Lord Jesus is God the Father in Spirit, and he is, how can he be subject, to his OWN
Hi 101c,
I believe that Adam came before Eve and that Eve was taken out of Adam. My belief is that Jesus came out of the Father. The Father was first and He is the head of all things, including Jesus. Just as our words come out from us, Jesus came forth from the Father, who is the source of all things, including His Word. The wife is to be subject to her husband just as the church is subject to the Lord, even though it is spiritually his body. Jesus is also subject to the Father. This is the arrangement-The Father is first- (the source of all things) Then there is the Son (the means through which God created all things) -and then we are all placed under them. God bless.
greeting Shana, I understand where you're coming from, but there is just one problem. Adam is a creation of God, and not God. and two, Adam only manifested before Eve, they were both made on the same day, scripture, Genesis 5:1 "This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him; 2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam,in the day when they were created”.
and three, the man was to "HAVE" the rule over the woman, and not to "RULE" her, big difference. rule here is about responsibility. for in Christ there is neither male nor female.
believe me, I understand where you're coming from. but Eve and Adam are creations. and Eve was manifested after her husband, with her own shape, here own fashion, and her own figure. but I did take note of one thing, when Eve came out of Adam, one thing was not mention, blood. she is flesh of his flesh, and bone of his bone, but no mention of blood, we can assume all we want. I have my reason why. but I not yet fully furnish in that area as of now. maybe a future discussion?. but take note our Lord Jesus after his resurrection is "Flesh" and "Bone", but no blood, (smile). but that another topic to discuss also in the future. but as for spirit I was just using a carnal object lesion for the spirit, that's all.
1 Chronicles 16:26 "For all the gods of the people are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.
1 Corinthians 8:4 "As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.
So God is a God of Idols or a God of nothing?
Scripture does not contradict Scripture.
Plus Paul went on to say:
KJV 1 Corinthians 8:6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
Here Jesus is clearly distinguished from God, and is is NOT God to believers and ... the Holy Spirit is not even mentioned as God to believers. Paul said this long after Jesus was raised to heaven and was ... with God (Note Greek for alongside, not within John 1:1)
Why did God have the words about His being a God of gods recorded? And using the same word for God, elohim as for the gods He IS God of? The LXX reads the same, so same word used (except for the plural for gods).
The verses you quote in context have very specific applications, not all encompassing. Context is critical.
Last edited by expatCA; 10-01-2014 at 06:54 PM..
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