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We'd have to go back to the original Greek (or whatever it was) for a precise definition of "kill," as in "Thou shalt not kill."
I was hoping there would be some Bible scholars here who would already have done that?
I'm not saying you can't make a good argument for killing. But to do so is to interfere with the divine plan for the life of that person as designed by the author of life itself. Just as suicide is wrong for that reason (not that you can't also make a good case for suicide on occasion), so even "justified" killing of another is wrong, IMHO. Better to lose your life on this earth than to lose your eternal life in heaven.
We'd have to go back to the original Greek (or whatever it was) for a precise definition of "kill," as in "Thou shalt not kill."
I was hoping there would be some Bible scholars here who would already have done that?
I'm not saying you can't make a good argument for killing. But to do so is to interfere with the divine plan for the life of that person as designed by the author of life itself. Just as suicide is wrong for that reason (not that you can't also make a good case for suicide on occasion), so even "justified" killing of another is wrong, IMHO. Better to lose your life on this earth than to lose your eternal life in heaven.
As far as the follower of Christ, that may be one of the tough choices love offers: to be concerned for the well-being of everyone in any situation would include the perpetrator of the crime you would clearly like to prevent, and THAT means that you have to consider the whole situation, sometimes including the interest of society as a whole. Recognize that the balance may require complete abrogation of the best interests of the one acting to harm, but that would mean that no other course seemed possible. Often that would have to be a snap judgement, so it doesn't hurt to feel that you will be able to live with the consequences of your action or inaction.
Last edited by nateswift; 08-04-2017 at 07:01 AM..
No. The 10 Commandments say not to murder. That is different from killing, as God even commanded the Israelites to kill for reasons of justice, and to take possession of the promised land.
So killing to take what others have is good if one uses God to justify it?
I do not care to join the discussion here of what is permissible in self-defense (others are doing just fine without my help), but on the subject of the ten commandments, I would like to contribute the following.
Some folks think that the Biblical command says, "Thou shalt not murder."
This is false, and its falsehood can be proved from the Bible itself. Exodus 20:13 says, "Lo tirtzach." Don't kill. The word "kill" (or, some contend, "murder") is spelled Resh Tsadhe Ches. Can we find this word elsewhere in the Bible where it will be perfectly clear whether it means "kill" or "murder?" In this particular case, yes! In Numbers 35:26-8, after extensive discussion of intentional vs. accidental killing and its relation to the cities of refuge, the Bible uses the word "rotzeach" (killer), spelled with the same root letters, to refer to an INNOCENT killer while describing the rules applying to him and those who would avenge his accidental victim's death. It also uses the same word, "ratzach," to describe the PERMISSIBLE killing of the accidental killer if the avenger of the blood finds him outside the city of refuge.
Without any doubt whatsoever, the proper translation of "Lo tirtzach" is "Don't kill." There are certainly exceptions to this commandment, as listed in the Bible itself, but that is what the words mean.
If you wish to study this further and do not read Hebrew, you should consult an orthodox rabbi with the references, or perhaps take a look at an interlinear translation [Zondervan?] of the Bible in a Christian bookstore. Obviously, if you read Hebrew, you need only look at those verses in any Chumash.
"Without any doubt whatsoever, the proper translation of 'Lo tirtzach' is 'Don't kill.' There are certainly exceptions to this commandment, as listed in the Bible itself, but that is what the words mean."
I do not care to join the discussion here of what is permissible in self-defense (others are doing just fine without my help), but on the subject of the ten commandments, I would like to contribute the following.
Some folks think that the Biblical command says, "Thou shalt not murder."
This is false, and its falsehood can be proved from the Bible itself. Exodus 20:13 says, "Lo tirtzach." Don't kill. The word "kill" (or, some contend, "murder") is spelled Resh Tsadhe Ches. Can we find this word elsewhere in the Bible where it will be perfectly clear whether it means "kill" or "murder?" In this particular case, yes! In Numbers 35:26-8, after extensive discussion of intentional vs. accidental killing and its relation to the cities of refuge, the Bible uses the word "rotzeach" (killer), spelled with the same root letters, to refer to an INNOCENT killer while describing the rules applying to him and those who would avenge his accidental victim's death. It also uses the same word, "ratzach," to describe the PERMISSIBLE killing of the accidental killer if the avenger of the blood finds him outside the city of refuge.
Without any doubt whatsoever, the proper translation of "Lo tirtzach" is "Don't kill." There are certainly exceptions to this commandment, as listed in the Bible itself, but that is what the words mean.
If you wish to study this further and do not read Hebrew, you should consult an orthodox rabbi with the references, or perhaps take a look at an interlinear translation [Zondervan?] of the Bible in a Christian bookstore. Obviously, if you read Hebrew, you need only look at those verses in any Chumash.
7523 [e] trə-ṣāḥ. תִּֿרְצָֽ֖ח׃ do murder Verb There appears to be some disagreement among Hebrew "experts."
I'm sorry, but your explanation of the difference between accidentally killing someone and the "execution" of the person who did so makes no sense to me whatsoever.
What does the Bible really say about this; is it a sin to take another's life to save one's own (or those of others) or not? Man's law makes provisions for it, but I'm not sure God's law does.
everyone has their opinions, but what did Jesus to Peter, who was ONLY defending his Master. when he sliced off the servant of the high priest's ear? ,(Matt. 26:52 Then Jesus said to him: “Return your sword to its place, for all those who take up the sword will perish by the sword").
a Christian can defend himself, but not kill anyone. though a Christian shouldn't take up arms. i would think, those who do, and feel the need to use it in protection. would used it in a way that wouldn't take away a life.
i personally don't trust myself with a gun, because I know I'm capable of using it, if i have to. therefore i don't have one. i KNOW i would have to rely on Jehovah God and Jesus to protect me from harm. but i also try to make sure i don't give anyone a reason to harm me.
sometimes, the way this wicked world is, we can do things, that might bring on harm to ourselves. NOT that I'm saying, one asked to be attacked. but again we are living in a wicked world. it's really hard now to trust even those who you thought loves you.
example, someone comes into a large amount of money. and feel the need to tell a few, you might just be telling someone who decides he wants it. MANY have died by those they loved, whether that person does it, or had someone do it. GREED is number one reason MANY act that way.
i can understand why Jesus said at Matt. 6:19 "Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal".
Anyone who wouldn't defend himself or someone else to save his or their life even if it meant taking the life of the attacker is an idiot. And the Bible does allow for justified killing. Capital punishment is a Biblical principle as stated in Genesis 9:6. And of course, under the Mosaic law (which the church is not under) the penalty for certain offenses was death. And Jesus Himself recognized this when He said the following.
Matthew 15:3 And He answered and said to them, "Why do you yourselves transgress the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? 4] For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and 'Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.'
Israel was commanded to kill its enemies in certain instances.
Certainly killing in self defense or in defense of another is justified as well.
I guess I'm more interested in what Jesus himself said about it versus the (later) apostles. That's where we get into the man-made rules (like it being a "sin" for women to cut their hair, etc.) that seem somewhat dubious to me.
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