Universalism revealed in radical forgiveness (abomination, Bible, worship, translation)
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An important principle (tenet) that you might want to consider is that of the Protestant Reformation, which states: "scriptural translations should be derived from the original Hebrew and Aramaic texts for the Old Testament and Greek for the New Testament, rather than upon the Septuagint and Jerome's Latin Vulgate." And of the four books of the Maccabees, none are in the Hebrew Bible, although all do appear in some of the manuscripts of the Septuagint. They are considered as Apocrypha or deuterocanonical and were not placed on the same level as other documents. In other words, it’s not really a reliable source in my humble opinion. And I have no doubt that they erred in their translation or perception. However, you do like to draw on them in order to support your false beliefs of eternal damnation, even though they are not what you refer to as being canonized or a good source.
In addition, the Septuagint has been passionately called "Egypt's greatest gift to Western civilization?" And we can see why. Apparently, whatever suits your agenda to propagate this false teaching is fair game, but anyone with a right moral center would NEVER consider it as anything other than the wicked imagination of religious men. Eternal punishment is a corrupt tree, a false teaching of man which brings forth evil fruit. It fosters a self-righteous and vindictive spirit within those professing to be Christian. Like the pagan gods, it rules by threat and intimidation for there is nothing good or loving about it.
An appeal to the reader, examine your own heart as to the nature of God's love and his judgments, which are corrective in nature.
2 Maccabees seems to have been written in Greek as there is no evidence of an earlier Hebrew version. And writing in Greek, the author obviously knew Greek, and he used the word kolasis for the slaying of a murderer, as did the author of 3 Maccabees, and as apparently Josephus did in Antiquities book 2, section 2. I don't have the Greek version of Antiquities, only the English, so I have to take the word of Dr. Larry Perkins who wrote the following concerning Josephus.
For example, Josephus speaks about Herod’s experience of being on trial and in danger of being sentenced to death, but through the intervention of Hyrcanus, the high priest, he was saved “from that danger and punishment (kolaseōs),”6 certainly not a reference to a temporary kind of punishment.
The Greek of 2 and 3 Maccabees is available, and I did provide the Greek of 2 Maccabees.
Clearly the Greek word kolasis is not limited to corrective or remedial punishment.
Furthermore, the four books of Maccabees not being a part of the Hebrew Bible is completely irrelevant to the point which concerns the use of Greek grammar, ie., how the word kolasis was used at the time that Maccabees was written.
As for the Septuagint, that is a translation from the Hebrew into the Greek and was the Bible of the Hellenistic Jews and of the early church. The New Testament writers, when quoting the Old Testament mostly used the Septuagint version of the Old Testament.
And forget about examining your own heart to learn about the nature of God's love and judgments. Your emotions, your feelings, your reasoning, can easily lead you astray. God has revealed certain things about Himself in His creation, but He has revealed far more about Himself through the Scriptures.
And forget about examining your own heart to learn about the nature of God's love and judgments. Your emotions, your feelings, your reasoning, can easily lead you astray. God has revealed certain things about Himself in His creation, but He has revealed far more about Himself through the Scriptures.
"He will glorify Me by taking from what is Mine and disclosing it to you. Everything that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said that the Spirit will take from what is Mine and disclose it to you.…"
"He will glorify Me by taking from what is Mine and disclosing it to you. Everything that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said that the Spirit will take from what is Mine and disclose it to you.…"
Disclose= apokalupto=
To uncover, unveil.
And the Holy Spirit did disclose to Jesus' apostles what He heard from the Father, and the apostles wrote about eternal punishment, as did Jesus Himself.
And the Holy Spirit did disclose to Jesus' apostles what He heard from the Father, and the apostles wrote about eternal punishment, as did Jesus Himself.
Dear Mikey: This is exciting news. It is wonderful to know the Christ wrote of "eternal punishment". Perhaps when you get a moment you can disclose what are the five qualifications for said punishment in Matt. 25. They are?
Dear Mikey: This is exciting news. It is wonderful to know the Christ wrote of "eternal punishment". Perhaps when you get a moment you can disclose what are the five qualifications for said punishment in Matt. 25. They are?
You've already asked this and I've already told you that there is only one reason why anyone is sent to the lake of fire, and that is because they did not receive Jesus as Savior. Period. There are no five qualifications.
You've already asked this and I've already told you that there is only one reason why anyone is sent to the lake of fire, and that is because they did not receive Jesus as Savior. Period. There are no five qualifications.
You want to think so because you want to depend on the exact wording of one or two passages, but ignore those that modify or qualify those assertions. You don't want to think that "receive" involves a commitment to the Way of life in community that Jesus taught. You will learn, as will the people you mislead. Better to find that community now, but you can only commit to what you can see. Find out what caring really means.
You've already asked this and I've already told you that there is only one reason why anyone is sent to the lake of fire, and that is because they did not receive Jesus as Savior. Period. There are no five qualifications.
Dear Mike: Step #1= put on your reading glasses. Step #2 focus.
According to the only text in Canon where the Saviour of the all speaks of aionios kolasis, please list all five qualifications for the same. They are??
You want to think so because you want to depend on the exact wording of one or two passages, but ignore those that modify or qualify those assertions. You don't want to think that "receive" involves a commitment to the Way of life in community that Jesus taught. You will learn, as will the people you mislead. Better to find that community now, but you can only commit to what you can see. Find out what caring really means.
The only requirement to receive eternal life is to trust in the redemptive work of Jesus. Commitment to the way of life that Jesus taught has nothing to do with eternal salvation from the penalty of sin, but has to do with the Christian way of life AFTER having first been saved by grace through faith in Christ alone. They are two different things.
Dear Mike: Step #1= put on your reading glasses. Step #2 focus.
According to the only text in Canon where the Saviour of the all speaks of aionios kolasis, please least all five qualifications for the same. They are??
Please note
Not the Limne of Theos, not theion: St. Matt. 25!
Again, and for the last time, there are not five 'qualifications' for being condemned. The details mentioned in Matthew 25:42-43 are indicative of unbelievers during the future Tribulation. The goats . . . the unbelievers are not condemned on the basis of those details which were paid for by Jesus on the cross, but because they are unbelievers.
Nerfball I really respect your integrity. You make an extremely compelling case...most of which I already agree with. Its so hard to for me to make a cohesive case while covering every caveat to avoid being misunderstood. So I will address your reply, which I am honored by incidentally, by section.
Well Im glad you find my argument plausible. That sounds like progress.
Something caught my attention, and I have to ask...
Quote:
For instance I am unaccepting of any LGBTQ moralities or spiritualities.
Radical forgiveness for all, except for us q----s? What exactly are "LGBTQ moralities and spiritualities"? Does this include LGBTQ Christians like myself?
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