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why oh why do you guys keep looking a fear instead of reverence/respect?
Which makes more sense to you guys
the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom
or
the reverence/respect of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom
Tell me why do you fear the Lord if you are covered by His blood and your sins have been cast into the lake of forgetfulness?
I can tell you what gives me fear and motivates me to keep my relationship in tact with Christ.
Heb. 3:14
"For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;"
"The beginning of our confidence" is faith in Christ, our salvation! If we don't hold on to that to the end, we will not make it!
One can backslide and still have faith and God will chastise him as the scripture says to bring him back, but if one completely gives up on Christ, no longer believing in Him, his candlestick will be removed from its place!
Paul gives us some examples of how this can happen and warns us to keep the faith.
This is always in the back of my mind and it motivates me to stay on tract with Christ and Satan will not gain a foothold to separate me from Christ. I see this as a healthy fear but nevertheless fear.
I can tell you what gives me fear and motivates me to keep my relationship in tact with Christ.
Heb. 3:14
"For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;"
"The beginning of our confidence" is faith in Christ, our salvation! If we don't hold on to that to the end, we will not make it!
One can backslide and still have faith and God will chastise him as the scripture says to bring him back, but if one completely gives up on Christ, no longer believing in Him, his candlestick will be removed from its place!
Paul gives us some examples of how this can happen and warns us to keep the faith.
This is always in the back of my mind and it motivates me to stay on tract with Christ and Satan will not gain a foothold to separate me from Christ. I see this as a healthy fear but nevertheless fear.
Charlie that would be fear of yourself, what does that have to do with being fearful of God?
You can't just pull a Scripture out and create a doctrine around it. That's a recipe for chaos and is not the intended use of Scripture.
Case in point: Denominationalism
Scripture has to be read and interpreted in light of the Tradition of the Church.
This is just as bad as the Sola Scriptura of Charlie and JBF. We are told to put our faith and trust in Jesus Christ, NOT the Bible, NOT the Church, NOT MEN. We have the Comforter (His Holy Spirit of agape love) to guide us to the Truth God has "written in our hearts." That is who we are to trust and follow and Jesus gave us an unambiguous demonstration of God's Holy Spirit of agape love and forgiveness on the Cross to use as our guide. There is NO wrath or vengeance in Him. He IS God. How can you believe in the wrathful and vengeful War God our primitive ancestors' believed in, especially the unforgiving endless torment of a Hell!???? It boggles the mind!
I assume you are talking about the catholic church? or do you refer to the Roman catholic church? or do you believe they are one and the same?
There is only One Church. It is Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic. There is One Faith and One Baptism. The Church is headed by the Successor of Peter, the Pope in Rome.
Yes, it is a fear of what I could do, but the fear of knowing what He will do if I do what He said not to do brings a healthy fear.
I have been bought with a price, that price was Christ's death on the Cross to set me free from Satan.
I gained what I did not deserve by choosing to believe God in Christ.
If I lose that faith, I have lost it all! That gets my attention!
that is your problem charlie you start with a fear of yourself and then transfer yourself fear to the Father as you think the Father will eternally torment you. You are running on fear charlie not on love.
The perfect love of the Father casteth out fear, and if you could only believe that then you would not fear this eternal tormenting doctrine you hold to.
There is only One Church. It is Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic. There is One Faith and One Baptism. The Church is headed by the Successor of Peter, the Pope in Rome.
so are you saying the catholic church and the Roman catholic church are one and the same?
This is just as bad as the Sola Scriptura of Charlie and JBF. We are told to put our faith and trust in Jesus Christ, NOT the Bible, NOT the Church, NOT MEN.
Jesus Christ, the Bible, and the Church (composed of men) are not mutually exclusive. Since Jesus Christ ascended into heaven, who do you think He works through??
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
We have the Comforter (His Holy Spirit of agape love) to guide us to the Truth God has "written in our hearts."
Every individual believer does not necessarily have the Holy Spirit in the sense you are meaning. The Holy Spirit was given to the Apostles at Pentecost in a special way - to guide them in all Truth. The Apostles passed that gift on to their Successors until the present day.
We, as individual believers, are not guaranteed protection from error by the Holy Spirit. That should be obvious enough by the empirical fact that genuine believers disagree on many important theological topics.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
That is who we are to trust and follow and Jesus gave us an unambiguous demonstration of God's Holy Spirit of agape love and forgiveness on the Cross to use as our guide. There is NO wrath or vengeance in Him. He IS God. How can you believe in the wrathful and vengeful War God our primitive ancestors' believed in, especially the unforgiving endless torment of a Hell!???? It boggles the mind!
I don't believe in your caricature of the Old Testament God. I disagree with your portrayal of Him. I see no contradiction in Scripture between the Old Testament God and Jesus. Remember this thread?
so are you saying the catholic church and the Roman catholic church are one and the same?
They can be, or not. It depends on what you mean.
Not every Catholic Church is "Roman", though they are all in Communion with the Pope in Rome.
For example, there is the Maronite Church and all of the other Eastern churches. They have their own non-Roman liturgies and their own non-Roman hierarchy, but they are all Catholic.
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