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Y'know...I take a tiny bit of offense at that. I am not a spoon-fed, ignorant, rich brat. I have attained an education on my own doing, raised my kids well, worked all my life and have never counted on our government to pay my way. To classify everyone who lives in America as a worthless, ignorant brat is just way out of line...there are many of us...MOST of us...who are good, decent and caring people. What our government does or does not do is not a direct reflection of who we, the American people, are any more than the rest of the world's governments are a reflection of their people. And by the way, we have some pretty extreme poverty in the USA as well...not just inner city, but have you travelled back into the Appalachians and the deep south?
If living in America nauseates you so much, perhaps you would feel better living in another country? I am not telling you to leave, I am simply concerned about your health
Esselcue, are you stalking me lol? The wisdom of this world is foolishness to God. I come here to talk to Believers who understand where I am coming from. You have made it clear you are not one.
My home is not this world, we are all in a space in eternity and right now is our choice to decide where we want to spend the rest of it. Take care.
Rev 3:16So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. Rev 3:17Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
((To all others, I apologize for taking this off topic, back to the mark))
Last edited by Asthedeer; 07-24-2008 at 02:35 PM..
Reason: Add verses
I'll have to agree more with "RDSLOTS". The book of Revelation/Apocalypse has many of its symbols taken from the Old Testament, btw.
Just look at this following chapter I came across a few years back --->
It's very interesting:
"And the weight of the gold that came to Solomon in one year amounted up to SIX HUNDRED and SIXTY-SIX talents of gold, apart from the men of travel and the profit from traders......"
I Kings 10:14
That certainly started me thinking, especially when you DON'T take things
literally. The "beast" for example cannot be an animal but only a symbolic reference. The same for the "number of a man".
THAT MAN, I take, as Solomon - who, as we know - disobeyed God's prime commandments, went astray, and finally lost his kingdom. The number of a man COULD BE Solomon......but then again.....it COULD BE a "kingdom" or empire in our last days. Or, even a "man" (human) in the position as Solomon was.
There seems to be some kind of wrong thinking about the US and that we are the only one's who believe the prophecies of Revelation and end times. There are millions of people around the world who believe this, and who will be gone after the rapture.
Oh, you're too good to pass up!
My belief of the "rapture" is that it has already occurred. Too many people are dying needlessly (at least the way discern it) - victims of horrible accidents, even dying of things unimagined, childern being whisked away, etc. etc _______, [ fill in the blanks ] I believe the RAPTURE IS WITH US.
That cuts down on the whole "too many to chip" theory. And who said it was going to be a chip, anyway? No one knows what the mark will actually be.
Read I Kings 10:14 maybe that'll give us a clue to who or what carries that famous number.
Then there's the weird idea that the US thinks we are supplying the AntiChrist. Huh??? The AntiChrist will be of European or Middle Eastern decent, most likely. He will rule the world with a one world government.
Funny, MOST of the population of the US ORIGINATED from Europe/Mid East.
The AntiChrist will not go out looking for people to "chip" or whatever.....people will be required to go to a destination to "receive" the mark. If they do not, they will not be able to buy or sell. When they attempt to buy or sell, that's when they will be found out. They will be given a choice.....take the mark or die.
Again, we need to think on a GRAND SCALE.....a little larger than our own personal lives.
There will be those in remote places who will manage to be self-sufficient for a time, but not long. The AntiChrist will have control of the world's food supply, and there will be earthquakes, plagues, famines, droughts, and destruction like has never been seen by mankind before. That's why it's called the tribulation.
Right on! And, of course, won't be limited to the U.S.
Accept it or reject it, doesn't matter. It's still going to happen.
We might be able to postphone it a bit if we know where to look......after all, NO ONE really knows the time/hour.
Just take a look at your poll...................It shows that MOST believe in another option as to who/what the "mark/beast" could be.
I personally am convinced this "mark" has some reference to the Old Testament as do many symbols in Revelation.
"And the weight of the gold that came to Solomon in one year amounted up to SIX HUNDRED and SIXTY-SIX talents of gold, apart from the men of travel and the profit from traders......" I Kings 10:14
This, unfortunately, is never discussed by our clergy (one of MANY). I often wonder why. So BEFORE someone decides to "modify" the Bible, I suggest you all take a look at that particular verse. But DO READ the Book from cover to cover! You may pick up things that I certainly missed.
Just take a look at your poll...................It shows that MOST believe in another option as to who/what the "mark/beast" could be.
I personally am convinced this "mark" has some reference to the Old Testament as do many symbols in Revelation.
"And the weight of the gold that came to Solomon in one year amounted up to SIX HUNDRED and SIXTY-SIX talents of gold, apart from the men of travel and the profit from traders......" I Kings 10:14
This, unfortunately, is never discussed by our clergy (one of MANY). I often wonder why. So BEFORE someone decides to "modify" the Bible, I suggest you all take a look at that particular verse. But DO READ the Book from cover to cover! You may pick up things that I certainly missed.
Since you have already defined what the physical mark is=money$$, where is the sign in the forehead and hand located in the bible? Right here!
Exd 13:16
"And it shall serve as a sign to you on your hand, and as a reminder on your forehead, that the law of the LORD may be in your mouth; for with a powerful hand the LORD brought you out of Egypt.
As we can see today, most peoples concerns and fears revolve around money in some way shape or form. It truly is what they live for, and work for, and think about.
God say to remember HIM, and His power that led the Israelites OUT of bondage, and they were "saved" through the red sea. As a new believer, I have passed through the red sea, and am in the wilderness of this life. I am being tested in my faith, so the last thing I should ever worry about is money. But we all do, don't we. We don't rely on the faith we should have for God to provide like the flowers and the birds. We NEED MONEY, we must have it, and we think we would starve without it. Buying and selling without it, would be next to impossible in stores. This had to have been something around for the entire 2000 years of Revelation history, otherwise it would seem to be a little unfair for those in the day of end times to be given such a horrible choice. This must have been a choice for ALL generations. I believe it has, for unless Christ is your King, and your provider, we ALL have the mark already.
Y'know...I take a tiny bit of offense at that. I am not a spoon-fed, ignorant, rich brat. I have attained an education on my own doing, raised my kids well, worked all my life and have never counted on our government to pay my way. To classify everyone who lives in America as a worthless, ignorant brat is just way out of line...there are many of us...MOST of us...who are good, decent and caring people. What our government does or does not do is not a direct reflection of who we, the American people, are any more than the rest of the world's governments are a reflection of their people. And by the way, we have some pretty extreme poverty in the USA as well...not just inner city, but have you travelled back into the Appalachians and the deep south?
If living in America nauseates you so much, perhaps you would feel better living in another country? I am not telling you to leave, I am simply concerned about your health
I agree with you, Esselcue. Just on these things that you said, though.
Now can we please get back to the topic of my OP!!!!????????
If you folks don't agree, don't post!!!!! That's the point of the poll.
I didn't say "Christians, if you believe fine, if you don't come in here and try to make us that do look crazy"........now did I!!
Just take a look at your poll...................It shows that MOST believe in another option as to who/what the "mark/beast" could be.
I personally am convinced this "mark" has some reference to the Old Testament as do many symbols in Revelation.
"And the weight of the gold that came to Solomon in one year amounted up to SIX HUNDRED and SIXTY-SIX talents of gold, apart from the men of travel and the profit from traders......"
I Kings 10:14
This, unfortunately, is never discussed by our clergy (one of MANY). I often wonder why. So BEFORE someone decides to "modify" the Bible, I suggest you all take a look at that particular verse. But DO READ the Book from cover to cover! You may pick up things that I certainly missed.
How then do you explain not being able to buy and sell? Are you saying that all currency will simply just be taken away? Hmmmmm.....now let's THINK about that one. The "beast" who IS the Antichrist will be a world leader. No more currency anyway. So, how do suppose people will be able to buy and sell, when there is NO MONEY? A "mark" of some sort, maybe???
I'm sorry, but your point is? How is money even relevant?
As we can see today, most peoples concerns and fears revolve around money in some way shape or form. It truly is what they live for, and work for, and think about.
I am being tested in my faith, so the last thing I should ever worry about is money. But we all do, don't we.
Right here!!!! YOU said it! When the AntiChrist arrives, he will appear to have the answer the entire world has been looking for. Need something? Want something? You don't NEED money anymore!!! Just get the "mark", and you can have anything that your heart desires!!!
FOR 3 1/2 YEARS, THAT IS.
IS 3 1/2 YEARS WORTH RISKING YOUR ETERNAL LIFE??? (FOREVER, AND EVER, AND EVER, AND EVER......)
I'm not going to be here anyway, so why should I be concerned what people do during the tribulation, right? Wrong. My duty as a Christian is to WARN......and be concerned for my fellow man's eternal destiny out of love, like Christ Jesus had for all of us when He died for us.
What better way to control the world than for Satan to offer relief from EVERYONE'S main concern!!! MONEY!
WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!! It's not here yet!!!! But it is coming soon to a world near you!!! Accept Jesus as your Savior, live like Christ and wait patiently and contently for His return, because we as Christians are secure and at peace in the knowledge that He is returning soon for His saints.
There is a lot of debate about the mark, the rapture, the tribulation, etc. and a lot of "scholars" and scholars have made many comments in the past and present about when and how this will all fall down. In the end, the important thing to take home from all this is simply: don't wait until the last moment to trust Jesus as your true and only Savior, for there will be a time when it won't be easy to make such a decision.
I urge you to read through the Book of Revelation, specifically chapters 7-16. In these chapters the Bible repeatedly tells us that those people who are around during the days of the plaques of God and the days of the beast will not be converting to Chirst. They will all succomb to the powers of the earth and will not repent, they will not declare God is the Holy One instead choosing to curse him, and they will choose to worship the beast in God's place.
I believe, in the end, the mark of the beast will not be for those who have already trusted Jesus Chirst as the true salvation; instead the mark of the beast will be for those who already are Damned according to the scriptures and if are still around during the days of the mark, we are not going to be proclaiming the God of Israel is the one and true God, instead we will be procaliming the beast is the savior of the world.
Just my thoughts, but it seems just a plausible (and I have thought this as well) that the Book of Revelation is written out of order, that the literal time table in the Book is not the way things will play out in the end times. But, you know what, for me, I trust the risen Lord as my Savior and that is all that matters in the end.
BTW, I don't think the mark of the beast will be any kind of electronic media, I think it will be something so uniquely clever by the devil but yet so obvious to those who should know better. I don't have a clue as to what that might be though, I am not smart enough. So I guess I will go with the last choice (other).
There is a lot of debate about the mark, the rapture, the tribulation, etc. and a lot of "scholars" and scholars have made many comments in the past and present about when and how this will all fall down. In the end, the important thing to take home from all this is simply: don't wait until the last moment to trust Jesus as your true and only Savior, for there will be a time when it won't be easy to make such a decision.
I urge you to read through the Book of Revelation, specifically chapters 7-16. In these chapters the Bible repeatedly tells us that those people who are around during the days of the plaques of God and the days of the beast will not be converting to Chirst. They will all succomb to the powers of the earth and will not repent, they will not declare God is the Holy One instead choosing to curse him, and they will choose to worship the beast in God's place.
I believe, in the end, the mark of the beast will not be for those who have already trusted Jesus Chirst as the true salvation; instead the mark of the beast will be for those who already are Damned according to the scriptures and if are still around during the days of the mark, we are not going to be proclaiming the God of Israel is the one and true God, instead we will be procaliming the beast is the savior of the world.
Just my thoughts, but it seems just a plausible (and I have thought this as well) that the Book of Revelation is written out of order, that the literal time table in the Book is not the way things will play out in the end times. But, you know what, for me, I trust the risen Lord as my Savior and that is all that matters in the end.
BTW, I don't think the mark of the beast will be any kind of electronic media, I think it will be something so uniquely clever by the devil but yet so obvious to those who should know better. I don't have a clue as to what that might be though, I am not smart enough. So I guess I will go with the last choice (other).
No one will ever understand this book until he places it in its proper historical setting. John was clearly shown those things that were in his day to shortly take place--the time was then near (Rev. 1:1, 3: 22:6, 10). Jesus said "Behold, I am coming quickly! Why do we ignore these time indicators?
Whatever the mark of the beast was, it had to do with something in that time in which John lived! If a little effort is made, it can be seen that Nero fits the beast. He is the sixth of a line of kings--five have fallen: Julius, Augustus, Tiberius, Caius (Caligula), Claudius. One is--NERO!
The failure to place this book in its proper historical setting leads to the fanciful speculations that have been offered on this thread!
Preterist
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The AntiChrist will be of European or Middle Eastern decent, most likely. He will rule the world with a one world government. 
. . . . Mark of the Beast?
