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Old 10-27-2009, 11:27 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 14,571,083 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post

Is God contradictory?!? Oh I know its just a paradox...
No the true paradox is if a universalist can answer a yes or no question with a yes or a no?
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:33 AM
 
6,657 posts, read 8,133,088 times
Reputation: 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
I have no idea what you are talking about, that says nothing. I asked a question about God's glory...IF hell was real. I asked nothing about commandments or God's will. it's either a yes or a no but instead I get opinions, emotional pleas, scripture that has absolutely nothing to do with the sovereignty of God. A yes or a no would have suffice.
You are not seeing the inherent contradiction in rejoicing because people are tormented in hell. (Its amazing I even have to explain this). God tells us to love our enemies... Yet you claim we should be rejoicing over our enemies eternal suffering because this brings God glory.

So which is it: should we love our enemies, or should we rejoice over our enemies suffering? We can't do both at the same time you know.

Your question:
If hell is real and it gives Him the glory because everything gives Him the glory then shouldn't we rejoice?

To answer your question: NO, and your question is invalid.

God doesn't need ANYTHING to "give him glory". He doesn't need hell to bring Him glory, He doesn't need us to bring Him glory. He is glorious for what He is.

If your question was valid, then we could just as easily "give Him the glory" by loving and trying to save those in hell (because everything gives Him the glory, right?). Saying "everything gives Him the glory" in this manner erases any boundries of right and wrong, and is simply used as justification to make eternal torment "OK".
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:35 AM
 
6,657 posts, read 8,133,088 times
Reputation: 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
No the true paradox is if a universalist can answer a yes or no question with a yes or a no?
Maybe if you had a valid question...
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:35 AM
 
Location: Germany
1,821 posts, read 2,335,664 times
Reputation: 1032
I didn't answer the question because it was a tricky question, you presume things that are contrary to scripture in my opinion, yet in both cases, either "yes" or "no" you would have used my answer against me to support your assumption.
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:36 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 14,571,083 times
Reputation: 754
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
You are not seeing the inherent contradiction in rejoicing because people are tormented in hell. (Its amazing I even have to explain this). God tells us to love our enemies... Yet you claim we should be rejoicing over our enemies eternal suffering because this brings God glory.

So which is it: should we love our enemies, or should we rejoice over our enemies suffering? We can't do both at the same time you know.

Your question:
If hell is real and it gives Him the glory because everything gives Him the glory then shouldn't we rejoice?

To answer your question: NO, and your question is invalid.

God doesn't need ANYTHING to "give him glory". He doesn't need hell to bring Him glory, He doesn't need us to bring Him glory. He is glorious for what He is.

If your question was valid, then we could just as easily "give Him the glory" by loving and trying to save those in hell (because everything gives Him the glory, right?).

Saying "everything gives Him the glory" in this manner erases any boundries of right and wrong.
NOTICE: I said, IF...IF...IF...IF....IF....IF....IF

LOL.....then if hell is real then it doesn't give Him the glory therefore not everything gives God the glory?
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:37 AM
 
6,657 posts, read 8,133,088 times
Reputation: 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
NOTICE: I said, IF...IF...IF...IF....IF....IF....IF

LOL.....then if hell is real then it doesn't give Him the glory therefore not everything gives God the glory?
Is it possible for you to address the points in my post Fundy? Otherwise I may as well be talking to a brick wall.
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Germany
1,821 posts, read 2,335,664 times
Reputation: 1032
please define what you mean with God's glory?
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:38 AM
 
6,657 posts, read 8,133,088 times
Reputation: 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
... if hell is real then it doesn't give Him the glory therefore not everything gives God the glory?

Bingo. You have just disproved hell.
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:40 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 14,571,083 times
Reputation: 754
Quote:
Originally Posted by svenM View Post
I didn't answer the question because it was a tricky question, you presume things that are contrary to scripture in my opinion, yet in both cases, either "yes" or "no" you would have used my answer against me to support your assumption.
No assumption. You see I believe everything gives God the glory no matter what it is and I see it in scripture. If Hell is real, then no different.

If hell isn't real will it give God the glory? Yes

If God allowed Hitler in heaven will it give Him the glory? Yes

If God said he would give Satan a second chance, would it give Him the glory? YES!
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:43 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 14,571,083 times
Reputation: 754
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
Bingo. You have just disproved hell.
Seriously give your head a shake.... No I just said a heresy......because scripture says, EVERYTHING gives God the glory
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