Why Cincinnati public transit sucks? (Columbus, Hamilton: section 8, crimes, townhouses)

[13th Alphabet]

Reading some of the posts in this thread exhibits some of the aspects I strongly disliked about Cincinnati. Frankly, public transit in Cincinnati sucks because of the bickering that goes on with Hamilton County residents, which also ties into the infamous city/suburb divide. Hell, even the east and west sides of the city can hardly agree on many issues. Net result; nothing gets accomplished.

[progmac]

Originally Posted by Chemistry_Guy

I see your point but I believe you are leaping to a logical conclusion that doesn't exist.

I have noticed that communities are most welcoming to people that share values. For example, there is the issue of lawn maintenance and landscaping. To many people, this is very important, They spend hours and hours working on their lawns, and stepping outside to a pastoral atmosphere is what they value in a neighborhood. If everyone in the community thinks lawn maintenance is important, everyone has well manicured lawns and everyone is happy. After a while people that love nice lawns will gravitate to that area specifically because they want to be surrounded by others that share their values. Someone that could care less about lawns would not be a good fit for that type of neighborhood.

Amberley is a neighborhood that values personal space and quiet. Public transit, while more efficient than personal transportation in many ways, encourages population density. Population density brings noise, traffic, and other changes that threaten the peace and quiet that the residents currently enjoy. A single large apartment complex could completely change the demographics of Amberley because the residents of an apartment building clearly don't put the same priority on space and quiet that current residents do and could out-vote the current zoning rules and regulations that keep the village the way it is today.

To say that the reason why Amberley residents would oppose increased public transit in the village is racially motivated or that it is because they are afraid the busloads of poor people will rob them and abduct their children is a bit simplistic and insulting.

This is an argument against an apartment complex, not a bus stop.

[t45209]

It's a fact that bus stops are often neighborhood cesspools, and I am not surprised that people don't want to live near them. Arguments about undesirable characters hanging out aside, an orange ring on a pole is not too bad, but stick a bench or a shelter there watch the graffiti and trash blossom. Metro should be responsible for cleaning and maintaining these sites. After all, it's their ridership that creates the mess. Metro might even be able to elevate it's own image as a clean and safe mode of transportation if it would do more to police this issue.

[TomJones123]

Originally Posted by t45209

It's a fact that bus stops are often neighborhood cesspools, and I am not surprised that people don't want to live near them. Arguments about undesirable characters hanging out aside, an orange ring on a pole is not too bad, but stick a bench or a shelter there watch the graffiti and trash blossom. Metro should be responsible for cleaning and maintaining these sites. After all, it's their ridership that creates the mess. Metro might even be able to elevate it's own image as a clean and safe mode of transportation if it would do more to police this issue.

You have got to be kidding, right?

[kjbrill]

Originally Posted by TomJones123

You have got to be kidding, right?

I don't think so. I believe they're deadly serious. Their sensibilities may be more acute than yours but I got the feeling it was what they thought. I do not have a personal opinion on this since I do not ride the bus today. But it is for reasons of the type mentioned I would refuse to ride the subway when I traveled to either NYC or Chicago. It was either rental car or cab, but I refused to consider the subway.

[progmac]

Originally Posted by TomJones123

You have got to be kidding, right?

I actually like the idea of metro cleaning up some of the busier bus stops. It is absolutely true that the highly-trafficked stops tend to have losers and bums hanging around and litter strewn about. Nothing dangerous, just annoying and off-putting. I suppose this is what amberleyites fear, although no way would that happen there, there aren't even sidewalks and there is no density.

[Ohiogirl81]

Originally Posted by TomJones123

You have got to be kidding, right?

Not really. Even in the event that Metro chains a trash can to the bus stop pole, people throw their trash everywhere but in the trash can. I used to while away the minutes waiting for the bus on Bramble Avenue by picking up cans and bottles and depositing them in the trash can.

Not all bus stops are like that, of course, but enough are. Stops that serve multiple routes or that are at a transfer point can be particularly nasty.

[TomJones123]

Originally Posted by progmac

I actually like the idea of metro cleaning up some of the busier bus stops. It is absolutely true that the highly-trafficked stops tend to have losers and bums hanging around and litter strewn about. Nothing dangerous, just annoying and off-putting. I suppose this is what amberleyites fear, although no way would that happen there, there aren't even sidewalks and there is no density.

Wouldn't this reflect the neighborhood more than metro service? What stops particularly are you talking about? How do we define losers and bums in this case? Panhandlers? Are the terms synonymous?

Originally Posted by Ohiogirl81

Not really. Even in the event that Metro chains a trash can to the bus stop pole, people throw their trash everywhere but in the trash can. I used to while away the minutes waiting for the bus on Bramble Avenue by picking up cans and bottles and depositing them in the trash can.

Not all bus stops are like that, of course, but enough are. Stops that serve multiple routes or that are at a transfer point can be particularly nasty.

I have to say you were a good citizen. I have a stop across the street from my house that serves multiple routes and is very busy. I have yet to see any of the problems you guys describe. So given the dichotomy of my experience with my neighborhood stops and what is being described I would have to say it's a neighborhood problem. Rougher neighborhood where people could care less then you have the problems described. That's my theory anyway.

But on to the idea that having metro service will import these social ills. Why in the world would anyone travel to Amberly Village just to litter? I think it's a baseless fear that has it's roots in racism and prejudiced fears.

[unusualfire]

Amberly is not a high density place. There is bus stops near Amberly. If someone choose to cause mayhem they can easily walk a few blocks to this village. There was a car jacking earlier this year in Amberly. They can't blame that on a bus stop.

[TomJones123]

Originally Posted by unusualfire

Amberly is not a high density place. There is bus stops near Amberly. If someone choose to cause mayhem they can easily walk a few blocks to this village. There was a car jacking earlier this year in Amberly. They can't blame that on a bus stop.

I just can't figure out who would go someplace to do crimes and take the bus. So places not wanting metro service would seem to have other reasons for not allowing service. Race / class seems to be the issue.