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I always thought Knoxville punched below its weight. For a 1.1 million CSA, Knoxville lacks the amenities of similar sized metros such as Little Rock, Birmingham, Richmond, etc. Adding Gatlinburg helps round things out a bit more, but the city should do more to build up its downtown. The city is slowly progressing, however.
When was the last time you were in Knoxville? The downtown is so built-up that they are rapidly running out of room and expanding outwards.
Louisville has a great neighborhood commercial district, one of the best I've seen. Knoxville has a better downtown, with historic office buildings converted to lofts, lots of activity evening/weekends. Market square is a unique pedestrian plaza, Gay st is filling up with shops, bars & restaurants.
I imagine you'd find great produce both places. Knoxville has several farmers markets, a food co-op, and natural food chains. Louisville has more & better restaurants.
Knoxville is near the Smokies. And a bit closer to the beach.
I assume the "district" you speak of is Bardstown Rd and the Highlands.
What many do not realize is Louisville has MULTIPLE of these impressive urban districts.
This is honestly no contest. While downtown Knoxville has improved, Louisville blows it out of the water. Its the same way Nashville blows it out.
The mountains and a bit more temperate climate are the main advantages of Knoxville over Louisville. Both are nice cities but probably could not be more different other than both having big universities with good sports.
While downtown Knoxville has improved, Louisville blows it out of the water.
Excuse me, I was comparing DT Knoxville to DT Louisville.
You can look no further than the current "old Louisville" thread in your forum for comments about how dead your downtown is outside of festival times. So it's not like it has exploded with development in the last 3 years since my visit. I'll challenge you to a downtown smackdown any day. If you'd like you can do a virtual tour on one of the mapping sites for restaurants, bars boutiques, etc. There were 57 downtown restaurants and bars on a list put forth by the visitor's bureau.
Granted, most people prefer "walkable" neighborhood commercial districts and L'ville is the clear winner. No argument there.
Excuse me, I was comparing DT Knoxville to DT Louisville.
You can look no further than the current "old Louisville" thread in your forum for comments about how dead your downtown is outside of festival times. So it's not like it has exploded with development in the last 3 years since my visit. I'll challenge you to a downtown smackdown any day. If you'd like you can do a virtual tour on one of the mapping sites for restaurants, bars boutiques, etc. There were 57 downtown restaurants and bars on a list put forth by the visitor's bureau.
Granted, most people prefer "walkable" neighborhood commercial districts and L'ville is the clear winner. No argument there.
Are you serious? DT Louisville handily beats Knoxville.
I can agree dt Louisville needs more work, but that is only bc Louisvilles neighborhoods are so awesome, as you readily admit.
9 hotels are under construction, 2 billion in bridge work, and probably 2000 plus apartment units. I am sorry, Knoxville is nice, but this is not really that comparable. Louisville's a top convention city. That alone makes it not a fair comparison. Louisville's downtown is FAR from dead. Do not believe internet hype from some thread. You have obviously not seen it lately, if hardly much at all last time you were here. There have been 3 distileries open since eye were here, 3 hotels have already open, and 9 more either planning, under construction, or in development. And multiple brands from different companies from Hilton, to Weston, to different Marriot brands. The bourbon industry is so huge with tourism that the convention center starts a 200 million overhaul this spring and three more downtown distilleries open by 2017.
Unless it is 11 pm on a Tuesday without a single convention or show basketball game, or concert, downtown (which is rare), downtown is always vibrant
Knoxville is comparable to Lexington, KY, not Louisville. Knoxville is not building a 600 room, 450 foot skyscraper with 200 luxury apartments and will self contain around 7 restaurant and bars, plus a grocery.
Louisville has almost as many restaurants in SUBURBAN downtowns. New Albany, IN has at least 30 downtown restaurants on a google search. 57 restaurants is a drop in the bucket. Downtown Knoxville is very nice and more vibrant than people give it credit for here. But comparing downtown Knoxville to downtown Louisville is like comparing downtown Louisville to say, downtown Portland. Sure, there are a few superficial comparisons, and both have nice spots, but its a completely different league of downtown in every measurable way. Creek sitter, you usually are pretty informed on your posts, but here you are just lacking information. Maybe you were in Louisville on a Monday night at midnight in January when no events were in town. That is not the common way dt Louisville looks.
Excuse me, I was comparing DT Knoxville to DT Louisville.
You can look no further than the current "old Louisville" thread in your forum for comments about how dead your downtown is outside of festival times. So it's not like it has exploded with development in the last 3 years since my visit. I'll challenge you to a downtown smackdown any day. If you'd like you can do a virtual tour on one of the mapping sites for restaurants, bars boutiques, etc. There were 57 downtown restaurants and bars on a list put forth by the visitor's bureau.
Granted, most people prefer "walkable" neighborhood commercial districts and L'ville is the clear winner. No argument there.
And it still loses to Louisville. Downtown Louisville is building multiple hotels, residential high rises, and even office space. Knoxville cannot say the same. The city is still cleaning up and patching up old buildings with no new growth. The only area that is seeing decent urban development is around UT, and that's not downtown. Knoxville also has no match for the urban park system, dense neighborhoods, retail and restaurants surrounding downtown Louisville. Knoxville has no answer for the Kentucky Derby, Midwest Music Festival, Oxmoor Center, UPS, or international airport which sees more than twice the number of passengers, annually.
And it still loses to Louisville. Downtown Louisville is building multiple hotels, residential high rises, and even office space. Knoxville cannot say the same. The city is still cleaning up and patching up old buildings with no new growth. The only area that is seeing decent urban development is around UT, and that's not downtown. Knoxville also has no match for the urban park system, dense neighborhoods, retail and restaurants surrounding downtown Louisville. Knoxville has no answer for the Kentucky Derby, Midwest Music Festival, Oxmoor Center, UPS, or international airport which sees more than twice the number of passengers, annually.
And so much more...Forecastle Music Festival....Idea Festival, Shakespeare in the Park, Humana New American Festival of Plays, 21C museum hotel Slugger Museum, Speed Museum, Ali Museum. St James Court Art Fest, KY derby festival, the st patricks parade, pegasus parade, Thunder Over Louisville....the list goes on and on and on...Ironman Festival, TWO gay pride parades, one of the largest zombie walks in the USA, Breeders cups and multiple PGA tourneys, NCAA Regional Basketball Final this year...Louisville has a top 10 science museum, a huge and expanding zoo with hundreds of millions in improvement. Louisville is putting more money into an infrastructure project alone than is probably being spent in ALL of metro knoxville...almost 2.5 million. This doesn't count the other 2 plus billion in downtown development on top of this.
Just take the small example of the zoo. This is not even really a key attraction in Louisville, yet Louisville's zoo is THREE times the size with THREE times as many animals. Also with over twice the attendance.
Almost every one of these events is substantially bigger and a higher cultural form than anything in Knoxville. Its true, UT saturday football games are impressive, but this is a totally different type of city.
Please, compare the college towns of Lexington KY and Knoxville TN. Two small but cosmopolitan cities with improving downtowns and more to do than you think.
I realize there is a lot of new hotel and office construction in downtown Louisville.
My visit was mid-afternoon and I rode around on my bike. Outside of the (fourth?) ave redevelopment block (the one with hard rock café) I saw less than a dozen restaurants and fewer retail establishments. Did I miss something? Do the new developments include street level retail? Here's the comment I was referring to:
Quote:
The life in downtown is mostly limited to the T shaped area of Main Street and Fourth Street. I hate to say it but it is substantially less busy during the evening, really any time outside of the lunch hour, though when there are events going on it is far from a ghost town.
Knoxville is pretty active evenings and weekends - especially when the weather is nice. On Saturdays with the farmers market is going on Market square is jam packed.
I think we focus on what is important to us. To me it is street level commercial and pedestrian activity. You do have some beautiful, beautiful tall older buildings on the street across from the waterfront. But the street level wasn't particularly welcoming.
Also, I'll admit I prefer older historic buildings. So the new buildings don't ping my radar as much.
Last edited by creeksitter; 03-02-2016 at 09:11 PM..
I realize there is a lot of new hotel and office construction in downtown Louisville.
My visit was mid-afternoon and I rode around on my bike. Outside of the (fourth?) ave redevelopment block (the one with hard rock café) I saw less than a dozen restaurants and fewer retail establishments. Did I miss something? Do the new developments include street level retail?
I think we focus on what is important to us. To me it is street level commercial activity. You do have some beautiful, beautiful tall older buildings on the street across from the waterfront. But the street level wasn't particularly welcoming.
Also, I'll admit I prefer older historic buildings. So the new buildings don't ping my radar as much.
You missed tons. Honestly tons. dt Louisville is as large as dt knoxville, UT and old city combined geographically. It has surrounding districts which are more like a "big city" not a college town like Knoxville. The street where Hard Rock is, that block...it has over a dozen restaurants alone...so all you had it do was look at that block and see that. And you are right, that is probably the most generic block downtown. But its no different than the tourist block in any major city, meant to attract convention goers...every major convention city has it...Vegas with the strip, Orlando with City Walk, Indy with Circle center and monument circle, Nashville with broadway, etc. Knoxville is not big enough nor does it really have any convention traffic to support a block like that.
If you were in the SW quadrant of downtown, you may "felt" the way you did, but even in that quadrant there are restaurants. So no, you cannot judge a city the size of Louisville on one half day on a bike. To think that a city this size has "less than a dozen" restaurants downtown in one of the top rated restaurant cities in the region is either an oversight or something else.
One thing that may have negatively swayed you was some surface parking lots, several of which have been built on since you were there. But your comments are so way off base I question if you have ever set foot in Louisville, or are just basing it off google street view.
You do realize that Louisville was historically the largest city in the SE after New Orleans until the post war era right? So there are probably more old buildings in downtown area alone than all of metro knoxville.
So, I can see how the surface parking lots may have negatively swayed you. I will give you credit for that.
March 12 is a huge st patricks parade in Louisville's highlands. There is a WHO concert downtown. Come up that day and I will be happy to show you around. I think you will be shocked at the depth of development and historic, urban stock here, that stretches clear into the Indiana "suburbs."
I think you may not realize I don't consider the highlands ( bardstown road )downtown. When I say downtown I am referring to the central business district. Not the adjoining neighborhoods.
I think you may not realize I don't consider the highlands ( bardstown road )downtown. When I say downtown I am referring to the central business district. Not the adjoining neighborhoods.
Ok, even to CBD to CBD this is no comparison. But you, like many who really don't know Louisville, assume Highlands is the only other vibrant urban hood. Thats probably bc most cities this size only have one area like that (if that).
No, I am talking about basically extensions of the CBD, so they have to be in the CBD. i.e., 1 mile from where you were...Nulu, Butchertown, Phoenix Hill, etc. even dt Jeffersonville, IN fits this, to a degree.
trust me, this is just not a fair comparison and this shows you really do not have a good handle on Louisville.
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