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I wasn't under the impression that Kathryn was looking to argue with you.
I can say that I agree that some of these lists are just completely unfounded, but, at the same time, I don't believe that there is any solid, unarguable measure for which city should be number one. I believe that people can only speak from experience and personal taste. That's it.
If someone has a strong preference for southern cuisines and their food culture, then San Francisco will no doubt come up short and Atlanta will certainly gain some points.
Honestly, as someone who moved here from Atlanta a year ago, I've had better southern style food in SF than I've back in Atlanta.
I disagree with that. For fine dining, Chicago really is second only to New York.
Unlikely. The Bay Area is probably second to NYC in fine dining. And LA is probably second to NYC in ethnic dining.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawn.Davenport
In terms of thriving immigrant communities, Chicago can only be beat by New York. I think Chicago has the best Vietnamese and Mexican food in the country.
That's silly. The foreign-born communities are much bigger in other metros. Chicago doesn't even have a particularly large Vietnamese community, and the Mexican community is many times larger in LA (and somewhat larger in Houston and Dallas).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawn.Davenport
Gyros, the Jibarito, Flaming Saganaki, the Italian Beef, and Chicken Vesuvio were all invented in Chicago.
Wait, what? Gyros are from Greece, not Chicago. Where did you come up with that claim They've been doing lamb on a spit in the Middle East for many centuries before the US even existed. The rest are just local things that aren't exactly world-renowned.
Yes, some Jewish restaurants will serve kibbi. But most Jews I know(European/White) don't know what kibbi is and don't know much about Middle Eastern food other than falafel, hummus, etc.
Jews in NYC, especially in Brooklyn and Queens, are heavily Sephardic. This means that Middle Eastern food is Jewish food in most of NYC.
Contrary to popular stereotype, if you go to a hard-core Jewish area of Brooklyn and Queens, you will not find "deli food". This is not really Jewish food. You will find, however, tons of Middle Eastern food, since Sephardic Jews dominate. Everything with saffron and olives and cumin and the like.
Back in the 50's, when these neighborhoods were less religious, and more Ashkenazi Jews from Central Europe, you could find the stereotypical "deli" food. But this migrated to the burbs along with the assimilated Reform Jews of the era.
If you visit an area like Kings Highway in Brooklyn in 2014, you will see dozens of kosher sushi bars, kosher indian restaurants and even kosher Argentine steakhouses before you see a place to get pastrami on rye. Strange but true.
as for the gyro, chicago's claim on that is that it invented "mass production" of gyros similar to somebody inventing a mass production of hot dogs...gyros already existed, so did hot dogs. Or like saying Mueller's invented spaghetti. This tale usually goes back to Kronos gyro meat, which is definitely not as good as the real deal you get from a proper greek restaurant and not a fast food joint serving burgers/dogs/gyros that are allover Chicago.
I was surprised also when I saw that in some article years ago then did my own research.
Honestly, as someone who moved here from Atlanta a year ago, I've had better southern style food in SF than I've back in Atlanta.
Only you can speak for yourself, and I certainly can't say that you're wrong for feeling that way. However, I'd say that it's quite unlikely that you tried the best the Atlanta area offers in southern cuisine. There are a few exceptions, but the best restaurants to offer up genuine, down-home cooking are often these small, run down, easy to miss, hole-in-the-wall establishments that are only open for a few days a week and are commonly located in rough neighborhoods.
Even if you did try one of those spots, to come back thinking that SF's southern food is better only means that you prefer California's interpretation of southern cuisine and aren't as fond of authentic southern cooking.
You are reaching now. San Francisco is better than Atlanta's food scene overall but it doesn't come close to Atlanta's southern cooking.
LA has a much better southern cooking scene than San Francisco IMHO.
Having spent a few months in Atlanta for work, I have to agree. Atlanta does have better Southern cooking than SF. LA isn't much better in this category. That being said, there are some great Southern style restaurants in SF and the Bay Area, but it doesn't compare to Atlanta.
When was the last time you spent any significant time in Houston? The food scene there, especially regarding authentic international food, is fabulous!
My top 5 foodie cities would be:
New Orleans - also lots of international restaurants - NOT just "the same **** over and over again
Houston
Miami
NYC
Atlanta tied with San Fran
I've seen some interesting lists on city data, but this is taking it pretty far. New Orleans is a great food city, and you listing it #1 actually doesn't bother me. I'd place it 5th in the US because compared to many other cities, the international food is lacking. But overall, its a great eating city.
But Houston and Miami above NYC and San Francisco? And San Francisco tied for 5th with Atlanta? I have a strong feeling that you've never actually ate out in SF and simply didn't know where to place it. There is a reason why many call it the "Foodie capital of America." It doesn't have the same amount of options as NYC, which has 8,000 restaurants, but your average restaurant in SF is often of far better quality than your average in NYC. Both are great food cities.
Having been to every city you listed, including having lived in Atlanta and Houston for work(I'm going back to Atlanta for 9 months in March), I don't think either of those cities belong in a top 5 food city list, especially Atlanta. Houston is what I would call an underrated food city, in a similar way that Philadelphia is underrated. It has better ethnic food than most people would expect and most cities in general. However, its still a long way from competing with NYC or SF. Houston is several years behind either of those cities.
Last edited by SFNative87; 01-14-2014 at 07:36 PM..
I've seen some interesting lists on city data, but this is taking it pretty far. New Orleans is a great food city, and you listing it #1 actually doesn't bother me. I'd place it 5th in the US because compared to many other cities, the international food is lacking. But overall, its a great eating city.
But Houston and Miami above NYC and San Francisco? And San Francisco tied for 5th with Atlanta? I have a strong feeling that you've never actually ate out in SF and simply didn't know where to place it. There is a reason why many call it the "Foodie capital of America." It doesn't have the same amount of options as NYC, which has 8,000 restaurants, but your average restaurant in SF is often of far better quality than your average in NYC. Both are great food cities.
Having been to every city you listed, including having lived in Atlanta and Houston for work(I'm going back to Atlanta for 9 months in March), I don't think either of those cities belong in any top 5 list, especially Atlanta. Houston is what I would call an underrated food city, in a similar way that Philadelphia is underrated. It has better ethnic food than most people would expect. However, its still a long way from competing with NYC or SF. Houston is several years behind either of those cities.
...and I don't disagree. But, hey, come back in 5-10 years and I'm sure you'll be thoroughly impressed with the improvement. Houston has just now arrived at a point in its history where its working on an identity that it can export. We know we have a great city, but we've finally decided that we want everyone else to know, too. Part of that process is the cultivation of our culinary scene.
My personal opinion is that Houston is top tier, when it comes to taste and variety alone. We lose points for innovation and accessibility.
Jews in NYC, especially in Brooklyn and Queens, are heavily Sephardic. This means that Middle Eastern food is Jewish food in most of NYC.
Contrary to popular stereotype, if you go to a hard-core Jewish area of Brooklyn and Queens, you will not find "deli food". This is not really Jewish food. You will find, however, tons of Middle Eastern food, since Sephardic Jews dominate. Everything with saffron and olives and cumin and the like.
Back in the 50's, when these neighborhoods were less religious, and more Ashkenazi Jews from Central Europe, you could find the stereotypical "deli" food. But this migrated to the burbs along with the assimilated Reform Jews of the era.
If you visit an area like Kings Highway in Brooklyn in 2014, you will see dozens of kosher sushi bars, kosher indian restaurants and even kosher Argentine steakhouses before you see a place to get pastrami on rye. Strange but true.
I know that there are many Sephardic Jews in NYC, but there are still far more Ashkenazi. When my family moved here from Palestine our next door neighbor was actually a Syrian Jew who was born in NYC. NYC used to have a large concentration of Syrian Jews. I thought that most new Jewish immigrants to NYC were actually Eastern European and that the Sephardic Jews arrived in the 19th and early 20th century.
My point was that most Jews in the US, of which most are Ashkenazi, don't know what Middle Eastern food is outside of the stereotypical dishes like falafel.
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They've been doing lamb on a spit in the Middle East for many centuries before the US even existed. The rest are just local things that aren't exactly world-renowned.
