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Sorry to hear that man, but that is not what I'm referring to. I said "head in the clouds" because it seems that posters here are underplaying the incredibly high crime rate in Philly, which is even higher than infamous Chicago and Atlanta. You, having been a victim of crime, know that it would be disingenuous to discuss Philly without pointing out its biggest problem: crime. It would be even more silly to not discuss it when comparing Philly to Toronto, one of the safest cities in North America. That is the point of my argument; I am not implying that people in Philly live in constant fear.
LOL.No I was not a victim of crime.I was in the military and I have lived in som truly sketchy cities world wide..
Crazy characterization? Granted, I may not speak for all natives of Philly, some of whom, based on this discussion, are not concerned because they limit themselves to very specific areas of town.
Nonetheless, your premise is flawed. Of course crime is not what most people that hang out are concerned about. I never said that. I just said it is A concern, not THE concern. And I didn't speak for all people, either. If anything, you are making a greater and more dangerous generalization by saying that people are simply not concerned about it. How can you speak for everyone? Shouldn't they be? Is the solution to avoid all areas except a few safe parts of town? Sounds complacent to me.
Remember the context of my argument.My statments were in reference to being in the entertainment areas in Philly as being dangerous.
Most people that go out obviously don't think it is that dangerous or they simply would move away or not go out.
Crime is large problem in America.Period.Even inn Canada things like gang violence is growing.
No one should ever be complacnt.That was never my point.
My parents live in South Georgia in a a nice town with relatively low crime yet I worry about them being a victim of a home invasion or car jacking because my mom drives a 2013 M-5.
Its hardly something I should worry about but I do because I have seen so much uglines in the world.
I am former military so I am also thinking of the worst no matter where I am.Even Toronto I never let my guard down.Not saying everybody should be that way but I am and Im fine with that.Being aware and prepared makes me comfortabble.
The bottom line is that some posters here feel personally attacked because of an opinion shared by many about Philly. How do I know that many people share that opinion? Because Philly simply does not have a good reputation and the stats support it. Are you going to argue that? People aren't flocking there even though its a pretty cool place. Crime may not be the only reason why its underrated, but its up there. It has come a long way from its scarier days, but it still has a long way to go. Yes, there are safer parts of town. I never denied that.
Anytime you talk about someone elses home whether true or not,you should expect to get challened on it.Philly has never been my home but I love it.It has so much character and history thatfew cities can match(including Toronto)
Philly does have a perception of crime that is well deserved.Im not arguing that.That was never what I responded to because that is not the comment that people took offense with.
Philly has alot of urban blight.I have seen it first hand.Its the worst I have ever seen anyhwere other than Detroit and Camden NJ.
People may not be flocking there but they are notfleeing there like they use to either.Philly proper is acually growing and it evident.
Philly has great bones to work with.The more they redeveop and curb the crime,this wil continue.
Toronto was not the great city it is today 20 years ago.It was pretty boring and not nearly as vibrant as it is today.Things change and peoples perception of Philly will catch up to reality once it really does become as safe as it should be.
So maybe crime doesn't put a damper on going out for many people, but to say that a good amount (including tourists, women, couples) are NOT concerned about crime when going out in one of the most dangerous major cities in America is an even greater generalization. Even with safer neighborhoods, you can't live in a bubble inside a few city blocks.
What city in America or even Canada should a woman not be cautious?More so in America but still women get victimized at a higher rate everywhere.
Yes you are right.You can;t live in a bubble.However in highly populated parts of the city where people are out eveywhere in Philly entertainment districts,you generally are not too concerned with safety.Now on a dark street where no one is around ,yes sure but that is not what we were discussing is it?
This is a prime example of what I mean about downplaying crime in Philly. Here you imply that the dynamics of each place are similar or the same. Toronto is certainly not devoid of crime, yet Philly is 10 times worse. People generally do not flee the city of Toronto to the suburbs because of crime, like they do in Philly. Some may, but not many. Many leave because they want a quieter lifestyle or a bigger house, but many of the sketchier areas are actually in the outskirts and not the actual city.
Please keep my statements in context of the original conversation.Philly's has crime.Higher than many cities.
Yes they are not fleeing Toronto but neither are they fleeing Philadephia(at least not anymore).Again you are doing exactly what you accuse me of doing.Do you have any data that people are fleeing Philly STILL?
People generally move out of cities for many reasons.In America its usually because of crime,high city Taxes,expesive real estate and schools.
To be honest I think crime is a reason but I think most people move because of cost of living more than crime which is probably the same reason people move out of Toronto proper. Census: Philadelphia population grows again, but rate slows
A lot of blacks are actually leaving the city for southern cities or the suburbs which is what is keeping Philadelphia's growth rate down and making the growth of the city seem smaller than it actually is. Philadelphia is not only growing, but the demographics and dynamics of the city are DRASTICALLY changing.
A poll was taken in Philadelphia, and here was a reason why people would leave the city if they have to. Notice "safety concerns" was a very low percentage.
Philly has a lower crime rate than Atlanta bud. If I'm not mistaken, Philly also had a lower crime rate than Chicago last year. If not lower, than certainly very similar stats. There are plenty of major U.S. cities with higher crime rates than Philly: Atlanta, Miami, New Orleans, Baltimore, Detroit, Oakland, Cleveland, etc.
2013 city murder rates:
Chicago: 15.2 per every 100,000 people
Philadelphia: 15.9 per every 100,000 people
2012 metropolitan murder rates (2013 isn't out yet):
Chicago(land): 7.1 per every 100,000 people
Greater Philadelphia: 8.6 per every 100,000 people
The murder rate of Chicago at the metropolitan level is a stain on the city's image. It's frankly unacceptable hoodlum characteristics that I hope each passing year improves to respectability. As a former resident of Chicago, it is quite an embarrassment for the great city of Chicago and Chicagoland as a whole. Here's to hoping for improvement for Chicago and Philadelphia.
Last edited by Trafalgar Law; 05-18-2014 at 06:54 PM..
Philadelphia is finally moving pretty fast. National developers who long neglected the city are now looking at it as a potential goldmine. Local developers have been going full speed for the past 10 years. The city already has an amazing urban footprint and with all the development going on 3-5 years from now there will be some eye opening being done. 20 years from now Philadelphia's reputation as an urban gem will be right there with Chicago and SF.
IMO Philadlephia is an 18th + 19th century city undergoing a rebirth,coming out of a century long nap. Toronto is a 20th century city that is on fire right now.
A quick story in regards to Phil/Tor. About 10 years ago was at small music venue in Philly(TLA) to see a band called North Mississippi All-Stars. It was the night before Eagles/Carolina Panthers playoff game. Carolina QB Jake Delhome was at the concert and getting absolutely inundated with insults and razing. He turns around and say Philly you Suck. You'll never be NYC,Chicago or Toronto.
I think it's telling that schools are such a large issue. As a millennial, I'd have no problem going back to the city proper because I don't have a family or kids. The state of public schools in Philly is downright abysmal though (I don't think anyone can reasonably argue otherwise), and I don't know what I would do in that situation. Sure there's Masterman and Central, but the overall system is in dire straights.
I think it's telling that schools are such a large issue. As a millennial, I'd have no problem going back to the city proper because I don't have a family or kids. The state of public schools in Philly is downright abysmal though (I don't think anyone can reasonably argue otherwise), and I don't know what I would do in that situation. Sure there's Masterman and Central, but the overall system is in dire straights.
Masterman, Central, Greenfield, Penn Alexander, Central for high school. There are a few other good public schools as well. Also Charter schools, Private and Catholic schools.
Other than that, the surrounding suburbs have not only the best schools in the state of PA, but some of the best in the country. If people who are having kids can't get their kids in the aforementioned schools above, then they move to the suburbs.
2012 metropolitan murder rates (2013 isn't out yet):
Chicago(land): 7.1 per every 100,000 people
Greater Philadelphia: 8.6 per every 100,000 people
The murder rate of Chicago at the metropolitan level is a stain on the city's image. It's frankly unacceptable hoodlum characteristics that I hope each passing year improves to respectability. As a former resident of Chicago, it is quite an embarrassment for the great city of Chicago and Chicagoland as a whole. Here's to hoping for improvement for Chicago and Philadelphia.
No response from the Philly homers on that one huh. Philly more dangerous than Chicago.
I've been to Toronto several times, and I live here in downtown Philly. Philly will never be all these great things every homer on here keeps claiming. It is, and always will be a local hometown city with the same people moving in and out, the same stupid high tax rates, the same political party owning the town, the same unions destroying job growth, and the same "we are not NYC" attitude. The transit system here is 2nd rate given the size of the city and density. Two dinky subway lines and a huge chunk of the city (the Northeast) stuck with buses.
There is no mad rush of people moving here. I was at a graduation party today for someone getting their degree from Penn. The vast majority of his class are leaving town shortly after and heading elsewhere. Philly has no great jobs draw going on, and most just don't want to be stuck in Philly.
The mayor is a failure as the next one will be as well with the same political party pulling all the strings. They keep talking about tackling crime as the way they did in NYC and we never ever get to the lower levels that NYC has. Philly cannot hold a candle to Toronto or Boston, Chicago, SF, etc. etc.
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