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I think fundamentally, Alexandria is its own independent city/urban core that predated the DC metro and was eventually enveloped by the suburban growth of Washington, DC. It’s more akin to a Wilmington, Delaware in that sense in terms of its history/relationship to the principal city (although I recognize that Alexandria is much closer/more integrated with Washington than Wilmington is to Philly, but in historical terms I still wouldn't refer to Alexandria as a "suburb.")
Actually, the original ten-mile-square District of Columbia included all of Arlington County (note its western borders still follow the diamond) and about half, including all of the older built-up part, of Alexandria (continue Arlington County's southwest border to the southeast and note how it splits Alexandria in two; the southernmost point of the original District lies (IIRC) on the Virginia bank of the Potomac in Alexandria just below the Woodrow Wilson Bridge, a piece of which lies in the District still, and I think that an original boundary marker survives there).
The towns of Alexandria, Va., and Georgetown, Md., predate the creation of the District and were absorbed into it in 1790. The portion of the District that was carved out of Virginia was returned to that state in 1846.
To me Philly offers a more classic "big city" experience. Tall skyscrapers, ethnic markets, local neighborhood bars and restaurants, long time residents (less transient residents), a more loyal and longterm sports fanbase. Also, there is an excitement in being in a fast-paced northeastern city (bridges, trains, hustle and bustle, Italian accents, markets, etc.).
To me Philly offers a more classic "big city" experience. Tall skyscrapers, ethnic markets, local neighborhood bars and restaurants, long time residents (less transient residents), a more loyal and longterm sports fanbase. Also, there is an excitement in being in a fast-paced northeastern city (bridges, trains, hustle and bustle, Italian accents, markets, etc.).
DC’s urban core is more vibrant and moves at a faster pace than Philly’s urban core. Center City is more vibrant than downtown DC, but DC’s urban core is larger and more vibrant than Philly’s.
DC’s subway system covers more of the city than Philly’s does which probably explains the difference in vibrancy between the urban core’s.
DC being a high-rise apartment city compared to Philly being a row-house city is the largest factor for DC’s urban core being faster paced than Philly’s. It’s really by design.
DC’s urban core is more vibrant and moves at a faster pace than Philly’s urban core. Center City is more vibrant than downtown DC, but DC’s urban core is larger and more vibrant than Philly’s.
DC’s subway system covers more of the city than Philly’s does which probably explains the difference in vibrancy between the urban core’s.
I really don't think most people would come away with that impression due to reasons of DC's height limits alone, to say nothing of Philly’s much smaller blocks and much narrower streets. These factors create a synergy of urban core vibrancy that just isn't present in DC.
It's certainly true and I'll acknowledge that DC gains (or at least, did) a much larger number of commuters during the day, most of whom would commute via Metro. But I have to wonder how DC is impacted nowadays (I haven't had the chance to visit in a few years). Its core is extremely office building heavy, with a notable lack of finely-grained residential neighborhoods until you leave downtown.
Philadelphia is much more thoroughly mixed use throughout its core. In a post-COVID era, I'd definitely be looking at the latter format for vibrancy when office uses are not going to contribute to vibrancy like they used to, for a long time (if ever).
I really don't think most people would come away with that impression due to reasons of DC's height limits alone, to say nothing of Philly’s much smaller blocks and much narrower streets. These factors create a synergy of urban core vibrancy that just isn't present in DC.
It's certainly true and I'll acknowledge that DC gains (or at least, did) a much larger number of commuters during the day, most of whom would commute via Metro. But I have to wonder how DC is impacted nowadays (I haven't had the chance to visit in a few years). Its core is extremely office building heavy, with a notable lack of finely-grained residential neighborhoods until you leave downtown.
Philadelphia is much more thoroughly mixed use throughout its core. In a post-COVID era, I'd definitely be looking at the latter format for vibrancy when office uses are not going to contribute to vibrancy like they used to, for a long time (if ever).
What is your definition of urban core office buildings?
I don’t feel like it’s a stretch to say DC’s core is more than an area around the White House. Is That not obvious from pictures or maps? If not experience.
I also need to ask. People seriously would prefer Philadelphia’s row homes to Washington’s? I feel like not only are the ones in Washington just downright beautiful and for the most part, Philadelphia’s generally are not.... Philadelphia is so tight with lots of concrete, narrow roads, no trees, no tiny little front yard to decorate. Like Baltimore.
I’ll take DC’s tree-lined ornate rowhomes with wider streets for dedicated and protected bike lanes over Baltimore & Philly’s rowhomes.
Last edited by Charlotte485; 03-02-2021 at 09:17 AM..
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Yea Philly and DC feel the exact same level of "Big City" to me in the aggregate. No doubt Philadelphia is the bigger city proper, and Center City wins DT easily. But outside of that, due to the mixed used nodal nature of Washington, not to mention it's surrounding urban core and metro area being so deeply connected to the DT, this gives it a mature major city feel that only Chicago, NYC, SF, LA feel much grandeur than (and LA really feels like sprawl honestly). DC/Arlington has secondary downtowns, and Metro connections in and out of the city with elite level transit activity. The metro areas are same population, but DC's feels bigger IMO, in part due to traffic, sprawl, Transit-oriented nodes well outside the Downtown etc. DC has as many bridges, trains, and at least a couple primary artery tunnels under downtown as Philly does. I also am at a loss for how Italian accents mean a place is more big city.
What is your definition of urban core office buildings?
I don’t feel like it’s a stretch to say DC’s core is more than an area around the White House. Is That not obvious from pictures or maps? If not experience.
I also need to ask. People seriously would prefer Philadelphia’s row homes to Washington’s? I feel like not only are the ones in Washington just downright beautiful and for the most part, Philadelphia’s generally are not.... Philadelphia is so tight with lots of concrete, narrow roads, no trees, no tiny little front yard to decorate. Like Baltimore.
I’ll take DC’s tree-lined ornate rowhomes with wider streets for dedicated and protected bike lanes over Baltimore & Philly’s rowhomes.
I lived in DC for a collective 5 years, so I'm pretty familiar with the city's layout. I'm not referring to the large institutional/monument federal buildings. I'm speaking of its large, expansive modern office district and how it's generally much less mixed-use in feel and much less finely-grained compared to Philadelphia. Those elements matter greatly for vibrancy.
In my view, your question of aesthetics of architecture are unrelated and subjective. There's no doubt that DC generally has more ornate rowhomes on average, and they are lovely. But the variety of Philly rowhomes--ornate, colonial-styled, post-modern, tiny, massive, brick, stone, etc. etc. The list is incredibly varied that it's impossible to generalize, and each style has its own merits.
One other point to add that folks don't seem to understand quite yet: Philadelphia's larger, multi-family mixed-use projects are popping up regularly now beyond Center City, some with very impressive scale. Some recent examples below:
To me Philly offers a more classic "big city" experience. Tall skyscrapers, ethnic markets, local neighborhood bars and restaurants, long time residents (less transient residents), a more loyal and longterm sports fanbase. Also, there is an excitement in being in a fast-paced northeastern city (bridges, trains, hustle and bustle, Italian accents, markets, etc.).
Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09
Yea Philly and DC feel the exact same level of "Big City" to me in the aggregate. No doubt Philadelphia is the bigger city proper, and Center City wins DT easily. But outside of that, due to the mixed used nodal nature of Washington, not to mention it's surrounding urban core and metro area being so deeply connected to the DT, this gives it a mature major city feel that only Chicago, NYC, SF, LA feel much grandeur than (and LA really feels like sprawl honestly). DC/Arlington has secondary downtowns, and Metro connections in and out of the city with elite level transit activity. The metro areas are same population, but DC's feels bigger IMO, in part due to traffic, sprawl, Transit-oriented nodes well outside the Downtown etc. DC has as many bridges, trains, and at least a couple primary artery tunnels under downtown as Philly does. I also am at a loss for how Italian accents mean a place is more big city.
I didn't say Italian accents mean a place is more big city. Please re-read what I wrote (see above). I used that as a descriptor of a "fast-paced northeastern city," with particular focus on the "northeastern" characteristic of the city.
I didn't say Italian accents mean a place is more big city. Please re-read what I wrote (see above). I used that as a descriptor of a "fast-paced northeastern city," with particular focus on the "northeastern" characteristic of the city.
Does an Italian accent make a place seem tougher than it would otherwise be?
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