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That stat was not used to make an argument, it was used to point out a flawed argument that I have often seen people from the LA side make.
If you really are making LA is urban arguments because of the "human, walking scale" like you have been claiming, and not population density, then I suppose you're not one of them and don't have to worry about it.
Maybe clarifying your argument a bit might help. You agree that using the population density numbers of entire cities as a whole to compare cities isn't useful, is that correct?
That's exactly the kind of flawed logic I keep trying to address. Why does it matter if DC doesn't have "dense" suburbia exactly? There is nothing that's urban about most of what's in a CSA's outskirts and suburbs. I have seen too many LA posters point this density in suburbia bit out like its some sort of a positive thing or something, and its really weird.
Good god, I seriously don't get how a person that claims himself to be an adult is this indifferent about making his posts legible.
Since this whole post is filled with silliness, I'll just address the most obvious one. Your just dissed pretty much everything outside of core DC over density in your two posts combined. And yet, you just boasted about Long Beach, CA...a place with lower density than that of Alexandria, VA. I mean what in the...
If that doesn't say how goofy your arguments really are, then I don't know what will.
Ugh.
I've been to Alexandria many times. It's not like Long Beach CA in any way. It has an old town section, and some smalll Tods. The rest of it is quiet residential neighborhoods with little commericial sections. I guess it has some 15 story highrises around Landmark, but it's suburban. Very little streetlife.
Long Beach is a city of almost 500,000. It's much bigger than Alexandria. Long Beach isn't on the CSA outskirts, yet is very urban for a suburb. Most people dont even want to count it as one, but it is.
I dont know why you're bringing in the CSA outskirts up in the first place. For LA, that would be like Palm Springs, Palmdale etc.
Nobody is mentioning these places.
Yes, I'lll take LA's denser suburbs. I lived in DC burbs. They're just blah for the most part.
LA has much higher population density than DC in it's 66 core sq miles.
If you actually want to make things fair. I know that's a concept that doesn't happen often on this forum though.
If you want to extend DC's boundaries to 465 sq miles like LA, it will be far less dense than LA's 465.
No, DC isnt denser.
The biggest problem with this thread is that nobody has given a definition of what urban is so all of you are going in circles. The definition that Developers, Zoning Commissions, Urban Planners, Architects, Civil Engineers, City Council's, Mayors, and Permit Offices in all these cities use is completely different than the definition you guys are going by. Find out what the highest level of urban design is for a neighborhood and go from there.
To get on the same page, here is a start:
What FAR should be used as the standard? Most importantly, what is the maximum lot occupancy for the zone? Is it 100%, 80%, 65% etc.?
What streetscape requirement should be used as the standard?
What mix of building uses should be the standard?
What type of housing should be the standard?
What type of multimodal transportation infrastructure should be the standard?
Last edited by MDAllstar; 07-31-2016 at 06:18 AM..
So, I decided to look at this from an actual factual basis versus the way most of you have been looking at this. Based on the zoning regulations, DC can actually build at a higher FAR than LA over a longer distance. Also, DC's front yard setback is zero almost everywhere and side yard setback is also zero almost everywhere which is not the case in LA. This explains why LA is built the way it is. Here are the zoning summary specifications for you guys to review.
DC Interactive Zoning Summary and Map (Click Definition)
Just a side note, DC has eliminated parking minimums in the downtown core zones and reduced them everywhere else. That puts DC in another league when it comes to urban lifestyle.
**Floor area ratio (FAR) is the ratio of a building's total floor area (gross floor area) to the size of the piece of land upon which it is built.**
Last edited by MDAllstar; 07-31-2016 at 07:26 AM..
So, I decided to look at this from an actual factual basis versus the way most of you have been looking at this. Based on the zoning regulations, DC can actually build at a higher FAR than LA over a longer distance. Also, DC's front yard setback is zero almost everywhere and side yard setback is also zero almost everywhere which is not the case in LA. This explains why LA is built the way it is. Here are the zoning summary specifications for you guys to review.
DC Interactive Zoning Summary and Map (Click Definition)
Just a side note, DC has eliminated parking minimums in the downtown core zones and reduced them everywhere else. That puts DC in another league when it comes to urban lifestyle.
**Floor area ratio (FAR) is the ratio of a building's total floor area (gross floor area) to the size of the piece of land upon which it is built.**
I didnt say urban in the last post. I said denser in two different areas. DC posters just can't accept this, so they flat out ignore it.
I didnt say urban in the last post. I said denser in two different areas. DC posters just can't accept this, so they flat out ignore it.
Another league? LOL
I thought this thread was about the "Most urban city outside the top 5?" Did you mean to post in a different thread? LA does have a higher population density than DC, but what does that have to do with this thread? Population density has nothing to do with the built environment. The use of the building and type of building dictates population density. The structural built environment dictates urban design and our cities are very specific about where they want the most urban construction practices to take place.
I know you guys enjoy talking about city-data topics; however, I was thinking you all would benefit from having an actual industry discussion using the terminology and definitions that the people who actually build cities use.
A couple DC posters did try to use the population density thing. The last poster before you, used it multiple times.
He used with with his Long beach and Alexandria compariison.
That's the thing with you guys. You're constantly contradicting yourselves.
because Philly is a dump. I'm rating desirable urban cities not cesspools like philly
Philly is great, don't be a hater
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