Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I would choose Phoenix between the two, but then again, I'm biased. I just notice that we are the perennial whipping boy on this site, and seem to lose almost every comparison poll. In my opinion, California is the only other place I'd live besides here
You know, I really get that. I feel like both cities tend to get whipped on. They have lackluster skylines for their size. They fly under the radar compared to some other cities in the region. They're not ultra-hyped hipster destinations like Austin or Denver, although they've had rapid growth of their own and always had that latent potential to jump into that club. There's always that one person that insists that a city in a neighboring state has WAAAY better stuff in every thread that crops up, and I think we all know which deeply conceited cities and states those are.
Both are in states with excellent scenery and some decent spots for day trips but the biggest attractions are a committal drive from the city. Both have good economies. I think it ultimately comes down to whether you prefer deserts or forests, or a metro of 2 million vs a metro of 4 million.
Murkside, I thought I remembered that you were from Fayetteville? Do I have that wrong? What’s your connection to the Murk?
Fwiw, I lived in LA for a year, still have friends there, but am not from there. Went back to CA a couple of years ago in 2018 and it was not for me. I enjoyed seeing my friends and relatives but the fires were so bad. There was smoke everywhere including Sacramento when we stopped by there. We cut the trip short and came home to NC. On the plane to RDU I heard a mom explaining to her little kids from CA that the fascinating (to them) rainstorm was “cleaning the air”
I was born at Mercy in Sacramento and spent my earliest years in South Sac's Fruitridge district...
I come from a line of chaos and dysfunction and bounced around with relatives because both of my parents were unavailable to me. Spent most of my elementary school years in Los Angeles, lived in/from the Expo Park neighborhood that borders USC. Bounced in between Los Angeles and Northern Virginia for a few years because my dad was in the Army at the old Fort McNair in SW Washington...
Came out to the East Coast for good heading into middle school where I was mostly in Greater Richmond with a yearlong stay in Memphis. My dad was away for two years and got stationed back in the states at Fort Bragg when I was 16, which is when I first came to North Carolina. The initial house he bought in Fayetteville was on the Murk...
I left at 17 and spent my adult years in between Upstate New York, Charlotte, a return to Fayetteville, Atlanta, more frequent trips to California but never permanent residence, stints back in Virginia in both Richmond and Virginia Beach, and now, approaching two years, in Raleigh. I'm 31...
Between my two biological parents, I have 13 siblings, of which my 32-year old brother in Fayetteville is the oldest and I'm the second-oldest, of all 14 of us. My mom has lived in suburban Atlanta since 2015, after living in California most of her life (born in Arkansas; moved to Atlanta from Sacramento). My dad is in prison in Washington State until 2027 and is a born and raised Californian though he's lived stints in Texas, Oregon, and Washington. Most of my biological family is almost exclusively from California and still lives there, exceptions being a sister in Oregon, a sister in Arizona, a sister in Kansas, a sister in Georgia, two brothers in Georgia, my brother in Fayetteville (six siblings still in California). Being that I didn't have a relationship with either side of my biological family growing up, it was my 20s in the decade that just passed that I was able to establish those relationships.
When you hear me reference "my parents" who live in Fayetteville, thats a reference to the people who mostly reared me and I've had a long relationship with since a child, who were both in the service and retired at Fort Bragg. They had no other children other than my brother who is my dad's biological; my mom was never able to have children. Neither are my biological, I'm not adopted, my dad is my older brother's biological father who was married to my biological mother at the time I was born. He was living in DC when I was born as he and my bio mother had separated. Neither one of "my parents" are from the East Coast, though my mom was raised partially in Upstate NY back in the 70s. Neither one of them have any ties to NC other than my dad doing his last ~6 years of service here (retired '11) and my mom doing her last year and change here (retired '07)...
They loved it here abd decided to live out their lives, it'll be 16 years in April that my dad first got here. My brother, who was 17 back then, has never left Fayetteville and loves it. Neither one of my parents has any family in The Carolinas and no family between Florida (my mom has a sister in Jacksonville and a cousin in Orlando) and Upstate NY (mom spent half her childhood there and has most of her dad's family in Buffalo, Elmira, and Corning). My dad has no East Coast family at all...
In the near-16 years we've been in NC as a family, I've lived here for going on 6. Never lived here longer than a two-year stretch at once, though that will change and be eclipsed greatly as I have children here now. I've only lived here for close to 6 years, but I've been coming around here since Summer '05, and I first visited Raleigh in '06, so I accept myself as an adopted Carolinian (much of adulthood), an adopted Virginian (where I spent most of my formative years and much of adulthood), and a native Californian...
Gotcha! I thought I was remembering the Murk connection with Fayetteville, but when you talked about going to school in LA I got a little unsure. You have been a lot of places! I always thought Oxnard reminded me a little of Fayetteville, but obvs no Pacific Ocean coastline.
Murk with the cray response. Jeez. It's fun to see Charlotte folks be all "We host things and have bad pro sports!" every time Raleigh is a topic. This wasn't about Charlotte. Phoenix probably beats both not by much. Arizona has Spring Training - a bigger performance industry than than the lol DPAC. I wish that people in the triangle realize that most cities have theaters.
International Buyers Association (IEBA) - Theater of the Year Award (2018)
Billboard Magazine - #7 in Gross Sales in the US for Venues up to 5,000 Capacity (Mid-Year 2020)
Pollstar Magazine - #5 in Attendance in the US (Mid-Year 2020)
Obviously, it's not Broadway, but it's better than average. Here is Pollstar's top ten for ticket sales:
Quote:
https://www.pollstar.com/Chart/2019/...Venues_773.pdf
Tickets - Promoter - Location - Gross
1,001,532 Auditorio Nacional Mexico City, MEXICO $41,653,794
956,608 Radio City Music Hall New York, NY $88,117,649
487,612 Fox Theatre Atlanta, GA $33,092,521
370,939 Durham Performing Arts Center Durham, NC $24,912,652
347,028 Paramount Theatre Seattle, WA $25,606,586
340,511 Park Theater At Park MGM Vegas Las Vegas, NV $68,599,210
331,706 Fox Theatre Detroit, MI $17,976,698
312,968 Providence Perf. Arts Ctr. Providence, RI $24,984,666
298,647 Beacon Theatre New York, NY $25,816,342
298,167 Chicago Theatre Chicago, IL $18,705,701
282,590 AFAS Live Amsterdam, NETHERLANDS $14,723,311
Phoenix's Comerica Theatre is #144
Quote:
37,462 Comerica Theatre Phoenix, AZ $1,901,656
Sacramento didn't have a theater that made the top 200.
All this is irrelevant if you prefer Spring Training and pro sports. But it might help you get a feel for the crowd in Raleigh and the Triangle. We are a suburban lot who get really excited about college basketball and support our local theaters. We also have a great music scene with one of the top rock clubs in the country according to Consequence of Sound. Again irrelevant if that's not your interest.
For years and years and years here on C-D, I have heard people diminish Raleigh and the Triangle, over and over and over again. I used to care, but I don't anymore.
Raleigh doesn't need the validation, or the predictions of it being the next thing because it does quite well without all of the homerism/boosterism.
Among the cities that are rapidly growing, Raleigh may be the least branded among the lot. It doesn't have a cultivated narrative that precedes it, other than the ones that come from others to dismiss it regularly. This is really evident on these forums.
The reality is that Raleigh doesn't need to convince people to move to it, or keep people from leaving it. It doesn't need to beg for a talent pool to support the next generation of STEM jobs. It doesn't have to hope that it's going to grow, or change, or evolve. All these things are either in place, or are already happening.
If Raleigh's not your thing, then fine. Nobody is going to force it on you. In the meantime, Raleigh will continue to work toward living North Carolina's Motto: To Be, Rather than to Seem.
They do, but most don't have the support that DPAC does.
Obviously, it's not Broadway, but it's better than average. Here is Pollstar's top ten for ticket sales:
Phoenix's Comerica Theatre is #144
Sacramento didn't have a theater that made the top 200.
All this is irrelevant if you prefer Spring Training and pro sports. But it might help you get a feel for the crowd in Raleigh and the Triangle. We are a suburban lot who get really excited about college basketball and support our local theaters. We also have a great music scene with one of the top rock clubs in the country according to Consequence of Sound. Again irrelevant if that's not your interest.
I think that's great about DPAC, but don't you think you're being a little disingenuous in regards to Phoenix? The Valley is not simply a sports destination. The Phoenix metro has MANY performing arts venues (including theaters, concert halls, pavillions, amphitheaters, arenas, and stadium venues). Furthermore, Comerica (now named Arizona Federal Theatre) was designed to fill the need for performers that don't need a huge sports stadium, but are too large for the smaller, intimate venues. Just in downtown Phoenix alone, Arizona Federal Theatre competes with the PHX Arena (Suns), Chase Field, Herberger Theater, Arizona Theatre Company, Orpheum Theatre, The Van Buren, The Pressroom, Symphony Hall, Valley Youth Theatre, and Phoenix Theatre Company, among others. Not to mention the other stadiums and venues in other parts of Phoenix, the Cardinals Stadium and Coyotes Arena in Glendale, all of the venues associated with ASU in Tempe, Mesa, Scottsdale, East Valley, West Valley, etc...the list could go on and on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnc2mbfl
For years and years and years here on C-D, I have heard people diminish Raleigh and the Triangle, over and over and over again. I used to care, but I don't anymore.
Raleigh doesn't need the validation, or the predictions of it being the next thing because it does quite well without all of the homerism/boosterism.
Among the cities that are rapidly growing, Raleigh may be the least branded among the lot. It doesn't have a cultivated narrative that precedes it, other than the ones that come from others to dismiss it regularly. This is really evident on these forums.
The reality is that Raleigh doesn't need to convince people to move to it, or keep people from leaving it. It doesn't need to beg for a talent pool to support the next generation of STEM jobs. It doesn't have to hope that it's going to grow, or change, or evolve. All these things are either in place, or are already happening.
If Raleigh's not your thing, then fine. Nobody is going to force it on you. In the meantime, Raleigh will continue to work toward living North Carolina's Motto: To Be, Rather than to Seem.
We both started on CD at about the same time. I can understand your perspective and I'll add that Phoenix has easily been one of the most chit on cities in the CD threads year after year and people continue to diminish and dismiss it.
In any case, let's hope the new year is better for everyone and both of these cities.
I think that's great about DPAC, but don't you think you're being a little disingenuous in regards to Phoenix? The Valley is not simply a sports destination. The Phoenix metro has MANY performing arts venues (including theaters, concert halls, pavillions, amphitheaters, arenas, and stadium venues). Furthermore, Comerica (now named Arizona Federal Theatre) was designed to fill the need for performers that don't need a huge sports stadium, but are too large for the smaller, intimate venues. Just in downtown Phoenix alone, Arizona Federal Theatre competes with the PHX Arena (Suns), Chase Field, Herberger Theater, Arizona Theatre Company, Orpheum Theatre, The Van Buren, The Pressroom, Symphony Hall, Valley Youth Theatre, and Phoenix Theatre Company, among others. Not to mention the other stadiums and venues in other parts of Phoenix, the Cardinals Stadium and Coyotes Arena in Glendale, all of the venues associated with ASU in Tempe, Mesa, Scottsdale, East Valley, West Valley, etc...the list could go on and on.
We both started on CD at about the same time. I can understand your perspective and I'll add that Phoenix has easily been one of the most chit on cities in the CD threads year after year and people continue to diminish and dismiss it.
In any case, let's hope the new year is better for everyone and both of these cities.
Phoenix gets undeserved hate. I think Phoenix's location hurts it because it is more isolated. If you live on the east coast or even more centrally and travel often, you have more cities to explore. Raleigh is "on the way" to more destinations. You would have to take the time to research what Phoenix has to offer because there is so much that is not really advertised.
They do, but most don't have the support that DPAC does. Obviously, it's not Broadway, but it's better than average. Here is Pollstar's top ten for ticket sales:
Phoenix's Comerica Theatre is #144
Sacramento didn't have a theater that made the top 200.
All this is irrelevant if you prefer Spring Training and pro sports. But it might help you get a feel for the crowd in Raleigh and the Triangle. We are a suburban lot who get really excited about college basketball and support our local theaters. We also have a great music scene with one of the top rock clubs in the country according to Consequence of Sound. Again irrelevant if that's not your interest.
For theaters, the Pollstar list doesn't include the top performing arts center in the Phoenix area. The Frank Lloyd Wright designed gem called ASU Gammage is among the largest university-based presenters of performing arts in the world. It's annual economic impact was $90 million back in '15-'16 and as noted in the link the Wicked Run that year alone topped 300K visitors. But for some reason your list doesn't include it, maybe they don't report numbers as part of the University. https://ktar.com/story/681525/singin...90m-to-valley/
Comerica is mainly concerts, standup, it does not host many Broadway shows etc... I do see that Mesa Arts Center also on the list which highlights another key difference, at Phoenix's size there's a lot of theaters.
That Consequence of Sound list is a bit outdated, 2016 but it's nice to see that the Phoenix music scene was on the chart as well. Kings at 59 in Raleigh and Crescent Ballroom at 58 in Phoenix.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
