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Is there something wildly different they do over cities like, Chicago? Is it because of how dense/built up? Police patrolling? There has to be some systematic reason since NYC is a very segregated city.
If there is a wild reason to why that CAN be replicated, why isn't it being replicated?
In addition to what others just said - I read a book years ago on planning for public spaces and they emphasized the need to bring people out into the street. That helps reduce crime. Its hard to mug someone when there are other people watching.
What New York City has, especially Manhattan, is tons of people walking about.
In addition to what others just said - I read a book years ago on planning for public spaces and they emphasized the need to bring people out into the street. That helps reduce crime. Its hard to mug someone when there are other people watching.
What New York City has, especially Manhattan, is tons of people walking about.
Its really neat, Boston, New York and San Diego are all large cities with low identical murder rates. Maybe Chicago can see how socioeconomically disadvantaged communities work/thrive and play.
One point that I think gets exaggerated in NYC's favor a bit is location in relation to other metros.
I"ve seen posts pretty much saying its "corn fields" once you get out of Chicagoland and in NYC you're zipping around to other glamorous metros.
There's obviously a grain of truth to that but, Chicago is the same distance to Milwaukee as NYC to Philly, and Detroit is only like 50 miles further than Boston is from NYC. Obviously Acela gives NYC an advantage, but the portrayal of one region as barren vs. the other seems really overstated.
I don't feel that's an exaggeration. Having driven to, through, and around both cities, the urban area around Chicago is very noticeably smaller and does indeed turn into farm fields rather dramatically from some directions. And then the closest urban areas are similarly much smaller. Chicago-Milwaukee may be the same distance as NYC-Philadelphia but that's 26 million people compared to 11 million. Just my opinion.
Oh, Ok. I mean I guess if NYC doesn't have it, it must be some kind of weird fringe thing that's not really needed.
Wait, hang on, upon further research, looks like in addition to Chicago L- San Francisco BART, Seattle Link, Portland MAX, Atlanta MARTA, Dallas DART, Cleveland RTA (since the 1960's) all have one.
I live in San Diego where people constantly complain about the lack of a light rail airport station to the point where there have to be news articles telling us where SANDAG is on that project all the time.
Wow, some people might look at that and see it as a big failure on basic urban planning for NYC!
As of this year, Dulles as well in addition to the others mentioned.
I think Chicagoans in general are very very dismisssive of cities below them on the list. The fact is Chicago is more like SF, Philly, Boston, DC than New York in overall urban form (and at a metro level has the lowest transit share).
You have Chicagoans dismiss places like Philly as “small towns” in a way a Philadelphian wouldn’t do to like a Pittsburgh or Charlotte or some ther similarly “smaller” cities.
I agree. Chicago is a very special city but if the focus is tall buildings and urban neighborhoods, NYC has more of both. NYC also has a significantly more cosmopolitan/international feel while Chicago to me felt more Big10/white bread. It should have even more of a cosmopolitan feel than it does and I'm baffled as to why it doesn't. Not that it's necessarily lacking, just that it looks like it should be even more international. It looks world class but not as world populated.
Not trying to be critical because overall Chicago is top tier, but my impression was that lots of day and weekend visitors drive there. Lots of parking garages all over and outside my hotel window, Royal Sonesta River North, there was even a surface lot. It kinda felt like DTLA a bit just from the driving perspective.
You'll be hard-pressed post-COVID to find a New Yorker who would agree with that. We were just reeling from a dude who was randomly stabbed to death by a crazy homeless guy in Bed-Stuy in front of his girlfriend after a wedding. A crazy guy in Greenpoint has been assaulting and sexually harassing women for years and the NYPD refuses to do anything. There is a huge homeless problem and they often are extremely aggressive. This is in addition to many people constantly checking their backs in the subway due to us fearing we may be randomly pushed.
Statistically, it's better than Chicago. I have lived in Chicago as well, and I can with 100% confidence say that in 2023, while the bad areas of New York are significantly better than the bad areas of Chicago, there's no difference in feeling between the North Side of Chicago and the good areas of New York in terms of how safe I feel. I was able to avoid bad areas of Chicago easily. In New York, I can too, but many "good" areas now feel extremely sketchy at night and I don't feel safe (mind you I'm a 6'1 man). Mind you - Chicago was the same way.
I know a few victims of violent crime in the city, luckily not murder of course, but the few I know involved teenagers or (seemingly) homeless people. It's ironic because when I lived in Chicago I did not. I don't feel safer in New York than I did in Chicago. I'd like New York to get it's act together so I can.
I agree. Chicago is a very special city but if the focus is tall buildings and urban neighborhoods, NYC has more of both. NYC also has a significantly more cosmopolitan/international feel while Chicago to me felt more Big10/white bread. It should have even more of a cosmopolitan feel than it does and I'm baffled as to why it doesn't. Not that it's necessarily lacking, just that it looks like it should be even more international. It looks world class but not as world populated.
Not trying to be critical because overall Chicago is top tier, but my impression was that lots of day and weekend visitors drive there. Lots of parking garages all over and outside my hotel window, Royal Sonesta River North, there was even a surface lot. It kinda felt like DTLA a bit just from the driving perspective.
Yeah - it is not as international as New York, that's very much a given (it's third of size after all and doesn't specialize in most industries outside of finance like New York). It doesn't feel as international as LA either. Famous people in pop culture in general just don’t live in Chicago. Less so than even DC or Miami. Chicago had a mix of Midwest and Northeast feel - but certainly more Midwest than northeast. And once you leave the city and go into the suburbs, unlike NY which has the lovely Hudson Valley of hills, it’s mostly flat farmland (though driving along the North Shore burbs on the lake on Highway 41 is quite beaituful). You have to go two hours North to Wisconsin to see some true hills.
And there are parking lots in the Loop, but it's nothing like DTLA, and it's definitely not like LA where you need to rent a car (or are advised to) if visiting.
The El takes tourists where they need to go and they have a very good CTA bus system and Metra system as well for distant areas. It’s in need of improvement in terms of speed but chicago has great public transit overall.
It's better than LA by far in that regard and the parking lots in the loop aren't anything comparable to LAs I think. I was lucky enough to live in all three big cities and my observation was Chicago was much closer to NY in terms of urbanity, density, public transit, and walkability significantly than LA, and a few other US cities are as well. LA is getting much better in terms of all of those but it's significantly still behind Chicago.
Not trying to be critical because overall Chicago is top tier, but my impression was that lots of day and weekend visitors drive there. Lots of parking garages all over and outside my hotel window, Royal Sonesta River North, there was even a surface lot. It kinda felt like DTLA a bit just from the driving perspective.
Downtown Chicago feels more cosmopolitan to me than downtown LA. I think I remember reading a quote by Gary Oldman after he wrapped up the Dark Knight saying something to the effect of downtown LA looks like they started to build the next Chicago and then just gave up.
You'll be hard-pressed post-COVID to find a New Yorker who would agree with that. We were just reeling from a dude who was randomly stabbed to death by a crazy homeless guy in Bed-Stuy in front of his girlfriend after a wedding. A crazy guy in Greenpoint has been assaulting and sexually harassing women for years and the NYPD refuses to do anything. There is a huge homeless problem and they often are extremely aggressive. This is in addition to many people constantly checking their backs in the subway due to us fearing we may be randomly pushed.
Statistically, it's better than Chicago. I have lived in Chicago as well, and I can with 100% confidence say that in 2023, while the bad areas of New York are significantly better than the bad areas of Chicago, there's no difference in feeling between the North Side of Chicago and the good areas of New York in terms of how safe I feel. I was able to avoid bad areas of Chicago easily. In New York, I can too, but many "good" areas now feel extremely sketchy at night and I don't feel safe (mind you I'm a 6'1 man). Mind you - Chicago was the same way.
I know a few victims of violent crime in the city, luckily not murder of course, but the few I know involved teenagers or (seemingly) homeless people. It's ironic because when I lived in Chicago I did not. I don't feel safer in New York than I did in Chicago. I'd like New York to get it's act together so I can.
1. I am in NYC at the very least 6 days a week. My job allows me to travel between nearly all corners of the city. Last week I was in Lower Manhattan, Midtown Manhattan, the Upper West Side, the Upper East Side, Washington Heights, Knightsbridge, Fordham, Corona, Flushing, East New York, Downtown Brooklyn, Mid Island SI, Northern SI, Port Richmond and lastly, Tottenville. Thats a pretty comprehensive NYC experience for just one week of work. So yes, I am around it a lot.
2. While a lot of New Yorkers may feel the city is letting them down and not a safe place to be, statistics show that New York City is wildly safe. In the top tier of cities with Boston and San Diego.
3. You're examples show one-off incidents in a city of almost 9 million people. It is very sad that those guys died, but in a city of 9 million people, wouldn't you expect some crime? I mean thats almost as many people as the whole state of New Jersey. More than Massachusetts and Rhode Island combined. The city has 40% of the population of Florida! NYC still has 300 murders a year. And that number is a fraction of nearly every city, bar a few aforementioned above.
4. I am also a 6'1 Man. A night, yes, NYC can feel sketchy... especially since it really isn't a 24/7 city anymore. However, that is really part of the NYC edge... its called Gotham for a reason. However, the city is huge so pinpointing these neighborhoods out can almost be said on the reverse. There are definitely neighborhoods in Chicago... which is still my favorite city in the United States ... that irk me at night as well.
5. I am not insinuating NYC is a better place than Chicago. By no means. NYC is extremely overrated and boosted by posters on this site. Step onto R*ddt, Arch Forums or Transit**** and that is not the case. I am NOT doing that. I am simply saying that NYC is a really low crime rate and IS safe (can't deny that), so why can't the practices be translated to Chicago. Find some things that work and copy and paste, in layman's terms.
1. I am in NYC at the very least 6 days a week. My job allows me to travel between nearly all corners of the city. Last week I was in Lower Manhattan, Midtown Manhattan, the Upper West Side, the Upper East Side, Washington Heights, Knightsbridge, Fordham, Corona, Flushing, East New York, Downtown Brooklyn, Mid Island SI, Northern SI, Port Richmond and lastly, Tottenville. Thats a pretty comprehensive NYC experience for just one week of work. So yes, I am around it a lot.
2. While a lot of New Yorkers may feel the city is letting them down and not a safe place to be, statistics show that New York City is wildly safe. In the top tier of cities with Boston and San Diego.
3. You're examples show one-off incidents in a city of almost 9 million people. It is very sad that those guys died, but in a city of 9 million people, wouldn't you expect some crime? I mean thats almost as many people as the whole state of New Jersey. More than Massachusetts and Rhode Island combined. The city has 40% of the population of Florida! NYC still has 300 murders a year. And that number is a fraction of nearly every city, bar a few aforementioned above.
4. I am also a 6'1 Man. A night, yes, NYC can feel sketchy... especially since it really isn't a 24/7 city anymore. However, that is really part of the NYC edge... its called Gotham for a reason. However, the city is huge so pinpointing these neighborhoods out can almost be said on the reverse. There are definitely neighborhoods in Chicago... which is still my favorite city in the United States ... that irk me at night as well.
5. I am not insinuating NYC is a better place than Chicago. By no means. NYC is extremely overrated and boosted by posters on this site. Step onto R*ddt, Arch Forums or Transit**** and that is not the case. I am NOT doing that. I am simply saying that NYC is a really low crime rate and IS safe (can't deny that), so why can't the practices be translated to Chicago. Find some things that work and copy and paste, in layman's terms.
That’s why I’m saying New Yorkers are complaining about the crime and the city not feeling as safe anymore. (just looked up at it was 433 murders in 2022, certainly not 300). Much better than Chicago and I’m not sure where these murdered are centered, but we’re having a problem with crazy homeless people here that randomly attack innocent people. Like I said, a crazy guy in Greenpoint is keeping the neighborhood on edge while the NYPD (which many call useless now) does nothing.
I don’t care about Chicago to be honest or anyone’s opinion of it so I’m not sure why you’re acting like I was saying Chicago was safer (which it’s definitely NOT clearly).
Only on City Data will you mostly hear arguments saying “well, at least New York isn’t Chicago”. People are upset about the crime here and safety.
Also can you show me the data that NYC is equally as safe as Boston and San Diego? I can’t find that data and find it hard to believe but by no means am denying it.
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