Best Large Town/Small City of the Northeast (population, people, Boston)
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I agree with you on Scranton (and Erie fits the same)…regional centers but mind numbingly boring and boring architecture.
I remember Chris Matthews saying Scranton was the last north east “Irish” boss type city. So there is that. Of the cities on the list Scranton is still solidly old school with no immigration of note. But they have their train and I’m sure people out there like it the way it is.
While Scranton is historically known for its Irish, Italian(particularly Pittston) and Polish populations, it has been getting quite a few black and Hispanic folks from the NYC area that move to the area(including Wilkes-Barre, which started getting people from the NYC area before Scranton). Just to illustrate this, here are demographics for Scranton High School: https://nces.ed.gov/globallocator/sc...D=422109006413
I would say that places such as Erie and Wilkes-Barre in PA, Binghamton NY and Burlington VT are other cities in the region and within much of the criteria would be worth looking into.
Binghamton is kind of a sleeper, as it has quite a bit for its size and may be due to being where IBM started. They have an opera, an orchestra, other performing arts venues, minor league sports(Baseball and Hockey), Division 1(mid major) college sports(Binghamton University), it is affordable, it is culturally diverse and becoming more so(has one of the most culturally diverse school districts in NY State), it is within a few hours of NYC and Philadelphia, it is a short drive to the Catskills of NY and the Poconos of PA, places such as Ithaca/Syracuse/Cooperstown/Corning/etc. are within an hour/hour and a half away, it has a 3 am last call on the weekends, it is generally a safe city/area and has some walkable neighborhoods(Downtown, West Side south of Main, the First Ward, the middle/central portion of the South Side and the East Side). Nearby communities such as Johnson City and Endicott offer walkability due to being company towns built around industry. Vestal offers more upper middle class suburbia and is home to Binghamton University. Endwell, parts of Chenango and even parts of Endicott and Johnson City(in their outer northern portions) offer a more middle/upper middle class environment(Binghamton's West Side south of Main/western third of the South Side does as well). It has a nice park system, which includes carousels at many of them: https://visitbinghamton.org/things-to-do/carousels/ It also has one of the oldest zoos in the country(5th oldest): https://rossparkzoo.org/
Just to add more about the bolded two communities, they also offer a decent degree of diversity in terms of school enrollment, as does Vestal. With Vestal, there is a quite substantial Asian student population(13% of the district's students). Ethnically/historically, Vestal is also known for its Jewish population, Endicott for its Italian population and Johnson City for its Eastern European population. Johnson City is adjacent to Binghamton to the west, while Endicott is further west and Vestal touches Binghamton to the SW and is across the Susquehanna River from the other 2 communities.
I like both cities. What I was going for was a city that was definately its own thing. Frederick and Alexandria are in the DC metro no question.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod
While Scranton is historically known for its Irish, Italian(particularly Pittston) and Polish populations, it has been getting quite a few black and Hispanic folks from the NYC area that move to the area(including Wilkes-Barre, which started getting people from the NYC area before Scranton). Just to illustrate this, here are demographics for Scranton High School: https://nces.ed.gov/globallocator/sc...D=422109006413
So, it is a city/area that has become more diverse demographically.
Tho I’m a minority I’m not one of those people that would knock a city for lack of it. I will say it does add a degree of variety to a city, new blood as it is. Places like Allentown and Reading has gotten a kind of new life from it fwiw. Especially a place like Lancaster; where most people see it as an Amish trading post or something and find it much more cosmopolitan (it’s still an Amish trading post though!) Lol. York is so cosmopolitan it even has a history of race riots. That’s another topic of interest; how new residents interact and assimilate or not assimilate into the insular nature of small cities. I know some cities have experience small scale white flight.
Granted I don’t know much about Scranton but I did know POC from the area (Native American surprisingly) and family that spent time in Williamsport up the same way so I know there is a level of diversity in upstate Pennsylvania.
Last edited by PHILLYUPTOWN; 04-21-2023 at 12:21 AM..
Scranton does have a growing Latino population, but it's still decades behind the Lehigh Valley. In 2020 it was about 15% Hispanic. You have to head southwest to Hazleton to find a large concentration of Latinos.
Latinos are slowly filtering north/west into all of Pennsylvania's smaller dying cities though. Hope they make it into Western PA before everything decays to nothing.
Poor Scranton is really getting hammered on this thread. I think it has a lot more vibrancy and assets (certainly architecturally, as well) than folks have been giving it credit for. The downtown absolutely has great bones and actually is pretty intact for a post-industrial small city. It just needs more infill for cohesion:
And I, too, prefer brick residential areas to wood-frame style (part of my innate Mid-Atlantic sensibilities), but you also can't deny the Victorian charm in areas like this, to say nothing of a lovely hilly natural setting:
It's funny; Scranton actually feels the most ”New England-esque” architecturally of any sizable PA city to me; not shocking I suppose as it's the closest sizable PA city to that region.
Poor Scranton is really getting hammered on this thread. I think it has a lot more vibrancy and assets (certainly architecturally, as well) than folks have been giving it credit for. The downtown absolutely has great bones and actually is pretty intact for a post-industrial small city. It just needs more infill for cohesion:
And I, too, prefer brick residential areas to wood-frame style (part of my innate Mid-Atlantic sensibilities), but you also can't deny the Victorian charm in areas like this, to say nothing of a lovely hilly natural setting:
It's funny; Scranton actually feels the most ”New England-esque” architecturally of any sizable PA city to me; not shocking I suppose as it's the closest sizable PA city to that region.
Scranton absolutely has potential as a city, and It's certainly a plus that there aren't really depopulated ghettos to speak of (though really none of the cities in question other than Atlantic City have those on the list).
Scranton is close enough to NYC I suppose that it could be "discovered" as a satellite city, the way that the Hudson and Lehigh valleys have been. It has the bones to be something better, but it needs an influx of new people to revive it.
I would say that places such as Erie and Wilkes-Barre in PA, Binghamton NY and Burlington VT are other cities in the region and within much of the criteria would be worth looking into.
Binghamton is kind of a sleeper, as it has quite a bit for its size and may be due to being where IBM started. They have an opera, an orchestra, other performing arts venues, minor league sports(Baseball and Hockey), Division 1(mid major) college sports(Binghamton University), it is affordable, it is culturally diverse and becoming more so(has one of the most culturally diverse school districts in NY State), it is within a few hours of NYC and Philadelphia, it is a short drive to the Catskills of NY and the Poconos of PA, places such as Ithaca/Syracuse/Cooperstown/Corning/etc. are within an hour/hour and a half away, it has a 3 am last call on the weekends, it is generally a safe city/area and has some walkable neighborhoods(Downtown, West Side south of Main, the First Ward, the middle/central portion of the South Side and the East Side). Nearby communities such as Johnson City and Endicott offer walkability due to being company towns built around industry. Vestal offers more upper middle class suburbia and is home to Binghamton University. Endwell, parts of Chenango and even parts of Endicott and Johnson City(in their outer northern portions) offer a more middle/upper middle class environment(Binghamton's West Side south of Main/western third of the South Side does as well). It has a nice park system, which includes carousels at many of them: https://visitbinghamton.org/things-to-do/carousels/ It also has one of the oldest zoos in the country(5th oldest): https://rossparkzoo.org/
I really hope to see more and more people from the major metros on the East Coast (and frankly much of the US) rediscover the Binghamtons and Scrantons of the US.
Especially with insane housing costs that I don't even think a real estate "correction" will resolve much, these smaller cities are very livable and have much more to offer than outsiders realize.
Lowell, MA: The city has really turned itself around through a combination of the growth of UMass Lowell and new Asian immigration. Very intact and thriving downtown, with a unique layout since it's basically ringed by a series of canals.
New Bedford, MA: It has really capitalized well on its waterfront/turned into a nice satellite city of Boston, while remaining true to its working-class, Lusophone history. Nice downtown,great seaside charm.
Kingston, NY: My favorite of the small cities of the mid-Hudson Valley. It actually has two different downtown areas: Stockade (built around the old Dutch fortress) and Roundout (down near the Hudson). A fair amount of activity on Broadway between them as well (though this area is still patchy).
I really hope to see more and more people from the major metros on the East Coast (and frankly much of the US) rediscover the Binghamtons and Scrantons of the US.
Especially with insane housing costs that I don't even think a real estate "correction" will resolve much, these smaller cities are very livable and have much more to offer than outsiders realize.
I agree and I think a thread like this helps, as it gets the word out about these cities. What makes the Binghamton area very interesting is that Johnson City and Endicott also have good bones. Same for Pittston, Clarks Summit and Dunmore in the Scranton area.
@eschaton, the area near Cornell is called Collegetown and the area of Kingston that Broadway goes through is Midtown.
Another New England city I like is Newport RI, which also has multiple business districts.
Last edited by ckhthankgod; 04-21-2023 at 11:00 AM..
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