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Austin is actually the least typically Texan place in Texas. My idea of an authentic Texan city would be Fort Worth, Amarillo and Abilene. Everyone I know whose been to Austin tells me it feels different from the rest of Texas except for the country music scene. And this has to do with the city itself not even due to UT being there. I highly doubt that the children of Panhandle cattle ranchers, Houston oil executives, and Rio Grande Valley Mexican Catholics suddenly become flaming liberals the moment they step onto the UT campus. To be honest, my only personal experience during a plane stop at the airport during the virus, there was a guy playing guitar and there was a sign saying that because of the virus you had to tip him through Apple pay or Cash App. This is the kind of thing you expect in New York or California. This was when my undeniably Southern town in Louisiana had bars staying open with live music in open opposition to the government. Austin is way too liberal to be Southern or even the "real Texas", the fact that a jury will convict an Army serviceman for defending himself when attacked by armed protesters. This would not have happened in Louisiana outside of New Orleans.
I don't even consider Texan to be Southern overall. The image of cowboys and the open range is very different from the classic Southern images of live oaks, Spanish moss, plantations, Southern belles and the culture of grace and gentility. I only include East Texas as part of the South, like Houston (marginally), Beaumont, Port Arthur, Tyler, Texarkana, etc. Houston feels like a city with Southern roots that's been overrun with transplants and immigrants similar to NOVA, Atlanta, and Charlotte but more of its roots remain compared to those 3 places. But even so, NOVA is still even less "Southern". Northern Virginia is today, regardless of its history, a part of the North, no different culturally than New Jersey, New York and Boston to me. Everything from the liberal politics and the pace of living and the rudeness and unfriendliness is very Northeastern to me. Its unfortunate that NOVA now controls Virginia where nobody else has a voice. I actually in Maryland for 15 years before coming home to Louisiana and have spent a lot of time in Louisiana including exploring the Civil War history and battlefields and visiting President Davis's home in Richmond so I get the thing about the liberal elites "North of Richmond". Richmond is where the South and the real America begins.
Easy. Houston locals still have a Southern accent. In NOVA they're non-existent.
That is wayyy too generalized.
I won't comment on NOVA nor am I making the argument that Houston isn't Southern. But Ive been here 8 years. Of the people I know who were born and raised in Houston, they overwhelmingly do not have a Southern accent. Some do (namely African Americans or those raised in places like Baytown or Conroe), but most don't. Most people around here, even if they grew up in Houston, were born in a foreign country or born to parents from another country and you are more likely to hear those accents.
This is what suprirsed me most when I visited Austin. I also read and heard so much about Austin prior to going so I'm not sure what I was expecting but I definitely did not a SF vibe. Austin still feels like a city in Texas which I wasn't expecting since people try so hard to separate it from Texas' culture.
One of the big thing I would say is that Austin's Asian presence is still a joke compare to SF overall. For all the talk about "tech bros" that vibe is limited to certain areas of Austin. The suburbs? Feel not too different from DFW suburbia. Towns around it? You gets that "southwest" feel (similar to San Antonio) mix in with the old central Texas German influence from the Hill Country. Oh...and you still eat Texas BBQ and Tex-Mex in Austin.
I agree, though - neither are really "southern" like Nashville or Atlanta-esque southern. Austin feels more southwest while NOVA is 100% Mid-Atlantic. If one has to pick, Mid-Atlantic definitely has more stuff mix from the "traditional south" than Southwest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by As Above So Below...
That is wayyy too generalized.
I won't comment on NOVA nor am I making the argument that Houston isn't Southern. But Ive been here 8 years. Of the people I know who were born and raised in Houston, they overwhelmingly do not have a Southern accent. Some do (namely African Americans or those raised in places like Baytown or Conroe), but most don't. Most people around here, even if they grew up in Houston, were born in a foreign country or born to parents from another country and you are more likely to hear those accents.
Well, there's always Liberty County.
Houston is a crossroads betweeen the south, Louisiana Gulf Coast (with their old-time French influence), and southwest (Hispanics) anyway - and it shows.
Houston is a crossroads betweeen the south, Louisiana Gulf Coast (with their old-time French influence), and southwest (Hispanics) anyway - and it shows.
On a historical level I very much agree.
The thing I don't like about thread regarding "which city is more Southern/Northern/whatever" is that people try really hard to take transplants and the impact they have on a place out of the equation. To pretend that large number of transplants don't change the character of a place. They (we) VERY much do. Doesn't mean there aren't still Southern/Northern/whatever roots, but for example, Houston/Atlanta/Dallas are less Southern today than they were 30 years ago because of transplants. It just is what it is. We shouldn't cling to the idea that these things don't change.
The thing I don't like about thread regarding "which city is more Southern/Northern/whatever" is that people try really hard to take transplants and the impact they have on a place out of the equation. To pretend that large number of transplants don't change the character of a place. They (we) VERY much do. Doesn't mean there aren't still Southern/Northern/whatever roots, but for example, Houston/Atlanta/Dallas are less Southern today than they were 30 years ago because of transplants. It just is what it is. We shouldn't cling to the idea that these things don't change.
I agree - then there is the demographic changes from international migrations. Houston and DFW, for example, seen not just Hispanic migrations (some of the Hispanics had been in Texas for years anyway), but also East Asian both from California/NY and internationally, and also the Indians with B-1/B-2 etc. (some are also domestic migrants). Even Atlanta has change from international immigrations (albeit more limited compare to DFW and Houston). Then there are those African immigrants from West Africa in Houston.
Either way - having such an international population create a certain cosmopolitan vibe that is just different from the "old south". Growing up in suburbia Houston it just doesn't feel southern at all - other than the perhaps the presence of megachurches.
The thing I don't like about thread regarding "which city is more Southern/Northern/whatever" is that people try really hard to take transplants and the impact they have on a place out of the equation. To pretend that large number of transplants don't change the character of a place. They (we) VERY much do. Doesn't mean there aren't still Southern/Northern/whatever roots, but for example, Houston/Atlanta/Dallas are less Southern today than they were 30 years ago because of transplants. It just is what it is. We shouldn't cling to the idea that these things don't change.
Correction: "The South today is different than it was 30 years ago"
Correction: "The South today is different than it was 30 years ago"
That isn't a correction and it misses large parts of the point.
Sure the South is different than it was 30 years ago. But Atlanta, Houston, DFW, etc. are far more different from 30 years ago than places like Mississippi and Alabama. That doesn't mean the later havent changed. But the former changed a lot more BECAUSE of the large number of transplants. The later haven't gotten many transplants.
That isn't a correction and it misses large parts of the point.
Sure the South is different than it was 30 years ago. But Atlanta, Houston, DFW, etc. are far more different from 30 years ago than places like Mississippi and Alabama. That doesn't mean the later havent changed. But the former changed a lot more BECAUSE of the large number of transplants. The later haven't gotten many transplants.
Rural areas always keep their heritage more so than urban areas. Not just in the south. I.e. New England.
I don’t disagree that the cities mentioned have drifted from their old southern heritage as compared to Montgomery, Alabama. I disagree that the change makes them less southern. I see it as the South evolves and by nature, rural cities and smaller towns maintain their heritage the most.
Ive been in Texas for 13 years now and I havent encountered anywhere that seems like NASCAR is popular. Living in Dallas in Houston, few and far between hunt. Cant imagine Austin is any different than that.
Mega churches though, those are everywhere in Texas.
I think it’s the crowd you hang out with. Two big NASCAR events are in Austin and Fort Worth. Trust me it’s popular here in Texas.
Im not the only one who has posted on this thread in Texas who says they don't know anyone into it...
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParaguaneroSwag
Rural areas always keep their heritage more so than urban areas. Not just in the south. I.e. New England.
I don’t disagree that the cities mentioned have drifted from their old southern heritage as compared to Montgomery, Alabama. I disagree that the change makes them less southern. I see it as the South evolves and by nature, rural cities and smaller towns maintain their heritage the most.
In the end, its subjective. How much a places is Southern/Northern/etc. depends on the person who is viewing. I am not saying which places is more "Southern", rather which places have changed the most away from the roots which they had and how transplants have influenced it.
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