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Some MA colleges that I don't think have been mentioned yet:
-Emmanuel College
-Wheelock College
-Simmons College
-Boston Conservatory (music school)
-Curry College
-Smith College
-Mount Holyoke College
-Hampshire College
-Wheaton College
-Williams College
-College of the Holy Cross
-Assumption College
-Worcester Polytechnic Institute
-Regis College
-Babson College
-Mount Ida College
-Stonehill College
Some, but not all, of those colleges are also very highly regarded institutions.
Actually it is a collection of 10 "campuses" and it has only one president. In my experience that makes it one school. But yes, that is one heckofa school!
Touche!
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomDot
How's this:
California wins with sheer numbers but pound for pound Massachusetts wins.
I have no beef with this statement. I mean, to answer the OP I think it doesn't necessarily apply, but I can agree with what you're saying here.
I guess you've not heard of Olin (1997) or Hampshire (1970). But age of a university shouldn't matter in this debate. Its based on quality/quantity of higher education.
And to add to your list of premier higher education schools ..
MA:
Boston University 1839
Harvard 1636
Amherst 1821
Wheaton 1834
Tufts 1852
MIT 1861
Boston College 1863
WPI 1865
UM Amherst 1863
Becker 1784
Williams 1793
Holy Cross 1843
Brandies Babson Hampshire Mount Holyoke Smith Wellesley Berklee SMFA Radcliffe
plus many other schools of superior music, art, education, medical, business, religion and law schools
I dont think you realize the amount of excellent LACs in MA. And this is not taking into account the rest of the excellent schools in New England, a much smaller footprint in America than California.
do a comparison 6.5 mil vs. 36.7 mil /number of public/private colleges/unis.
Of cousre you've neglected to list or acknowledge that there are a ton more quality schools in CA that haven't been mentioned. But that's okay.
Praise is always given to the NE above anywhere else in so many ways, so let's not pretend like its overlooked b/c of its diminutive size on a map. CA's borders include huge expanses that are sparsely populated too, so if you look at its densest population centers they are quite a small footprint on America as well.
And again, I don't have any idea why some of you are so hung up on the old national university colony that exists in MA, b/c the concentration of colleges per sq mi/per capita makes no freaking difference when looking at which state has better universities! The big dogs are always the Ivies, and the fact that CA schools are able to hang with them is amazing. Don't try to downplay it by saying, "oh you guys have so much land and people out there your schools should automatically outdo Harvard." That's just retarded.
If you're saying that Massachusetts has a huge amount of schools within its boundaries, then okay, fine. But how does CA's population and landsize being so much greater have anything to do with it having top notch schools that can compete with the schools that were tops before the CA ones even existed?? If we were asking which state has MORE schools, then the size thing could come into it. But we're talking about which state has better schools here.
Of cousre you've neglected to list or acknowledge that there are a ton more quality schools in CA that haven't been mentioned. But that's okay.
Praise is always given to the NE above anywhere else in so many ways, so let's not pretend like its overlooked b/c of its diminutive size on a map. CA's borders include huge expanses that are sparsely populated too, so if you look at its densest population centers they are quite a small footprint on America as well.
And again, I don't have any idea why some of you are so hung up on the old national university colony that exists in MA, b/c the concentration of colleges per sq mi/per capita makes no freaking difference when looking at which state has better universities! The big dogs are always the Ivies, and the fact that CA schools are able to hang with them is amazing. Don't try to downplay it by saying, "oh you guys have so much land and people out there your schools should automatically outdo Harvard." That's just retarded.
If you're saying that Massachusetts has a huge amount of schools within its boundaries, then okay, fine. But how does CA's population and landsize being so much greater have anything to do with it having top notch schools that can compete with the schools that were tops before the CA ones even existed?? If we were asking which state has MORE schools, then the size thing could come into it. But we're talking about which state has better schools here.
Talking about population/geographical size of the state is how people justify MA "winning" an otherwise close contest.
Talking about population/geographical size of the state is how people justify MA "winning" an otherwise close contest.
Man, I mean MA is very impressive in what it has and pound-for-pound it does offer the best. I don't think that's disputable. It's schools set the standards for how great universities should be. But I just don't see the need keep trying to equalize this when we're comparing the quality of 2 states universities here.
@ Montclair, Jman, PDX: I agree with that 100% too. I don't think there's anything wrong with talking about how impressive it is that Massachusetts has so many great schools within its tiny borders, or how impressive it is that California has so many amazing institutions despite the fact that it got started 150-200 years later than its Eastern counterparts...however those factors don't make one state's intitutions better than the other's.
Boston can take on any city but California as a whole dominates.
I don't think you can say it dominates. It may win in some people's opinions, but as it was mentioned before from the US News rankings, Cali has 12 top 100 schools and Mass 9. Both have 2 Top 10 schools.
For Liberal Arts schools, Mass has 3 Top 10, Cali 1. And of the top 30, Mass 5, Cali 4 (all in Claremont!). As I was saying before, you can definitely make a case for either side...but it's tough to say either one dominates the other.
If you're talking strictly about Public schools, then yes, Cali dominates.
I don't think you can say it dominates. It may win in some people's opinions, but as it was mentioned before from the US News rankings, Cali has 12 top 100 schools and Mass 9. Both have 2 Top 10 schools.
For Liberal Arts schools, Mass has 3 Top 10, Cali 1. And of the top 30, Mass 5, Cali 4 (all in Claremont!). As I was saying before, you can definitely make a case for either side...but it's tough to say either one dominates the other.
If you're talking strictly about Public schools, then yes, Cali dominates.
I nominate this for most rational post of the thread! Thank you for always keeping things in perspective tmac.
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