Colorado State Fair in Pueblo (Denver, Rangely: unemployment, pool, relocation)

[Josseppie]

Originally Posted by McGowdog

Wut?

So, Pueblo County and two others are 1,000,000?

Let's have a factual count here again.

Pueblo - 108k.

Pueblo County - 160k.

Pueblo County and Fremont county and Custer County thrown in for fun... and Huerfano and Las Animas just for Ss and Gs... 210k.

El Paso County? Who cares? Because they have NOTHING TO DO WITH US DOWN HERE!

Actually a study done by the fair shows most people who come outside of Pueblo county come from El Paso county and it's what a 30-45 minute drive? About the same as it is from Highlands Ranch to the stock show in Denver. I mean think about it the Springs really has no event that compares to the state fair not even their county fair. So it is important and as Pueblo, Fremont, and El Paso counties grow so will the fair.

[eatsDEN]

Originally Posted by Josseppie

You made my point about it being a off season issue. So at this point let's sit back and see what the fair manager will do to increase off season revenue.

As far as local money. It was detailed how much we give and it's more then $300,000 but I would support giving more. Also, I joined the state fair foundation to put my money where my mouth is about supporting the fair. As the foundation grows it will contribute more money as well.

no, i didn't make your point.

you cannot judge a business or program by peak season profitability (which is basically break even, and not profitable in a macro perspective, from my understanding) -- the program needs long term sustainability -- that means attracting year round events and bookings - basically the venue needs somewhere on the order of $10K daily

[Josseppie]

Originally Posted by eatsDEN

no, i didn't make your point.

you cannot judge a business or program by peak season profitability (which is basically break even, and not profitable in a macro perspective, from my understanding) -- the program needs long term sustainability -- that means attracting year round events and bookings - basically the venue needs somewhere on the order of $10K daily

It's not a business it's a fair and educational facilty for the 4H and FFA complete with dorms. Additionally the stock show has the same issues in Denver why they needed the state money to upgrade the complex as they could not do it on their own.

Now I agree they need to increase offseason business but how much I'm not sure. It will be interesting to see what the new manager and fair board come up with in the next year.

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by eatsDEN

....- basically the venue needs somewhere on the order of $10K daily

I got it. The Colorado State Weed Exchange and Grower's Market. No one-ounce limits. Smoke on-site in The Black Light Lounge or The Lava Lamp Disco. It'll make a fortune! Imagine the munchie sales!

[Josseppie]

Originally Posted by Mike from back east

I got it. The Colorado State Weed Exchange and Grower's Market. No one-ounce limits. Smoke on-site in The Black Light Lounge or The Lava Lamp Disco. It'll make a fortune! Imagine the munchie sales!

I know you said that in jest but why not a large weed festival every year? It could be rented out complete with bands for that type of crowd. Essentially a mini Woodstock every year on 4/20? I would support the idea.

[eatsDEN]

Originally Posted by Josseppie

It's not a business it's a fair and educational facilty for the 4H and FFA complete with dorms. Additionally the stock show has the same issues in Denver why they needed the state money to upgrade the complex as they could not do it on their own.

Now I agree they need to increase offseason business but how much I'm not sure. It will be interesting to see what the new manager and fair board come up with in the next year.

OK, not a business, but a govt. "program" (as I had mentioned above) that also seems to be desired, by those at the state capitol, to be self sustaining... which has not been the case for the last 10+ years...

I hope they brought in someone in who understands the program impact that the "generally accepted accounting principles" have on their operation and how it is evaluated - instead of someone who talks of the "reality" while manipulating (disposing of expenses or adding to revenue streams) the profitability analysis to suit their needs...


BTW - the stock show needed the state contribution exactly because they didn't reinvest in the program and infrastructure over time - which is what the depreciation charge on your books is supposed to remind you of the necessity of...

which is why I have such a hard time with Wiseman's statements about the fair's "actual" profit and loss - after including the bail-out and excluding the depreciation charges from his analysis

[eatsDEN]

Originally Posted by Mike from back east

I got it. The Colorado State Weed Exchange and Grower's Market. No one-ounce limits. Smoke on-site in The Black Light Lounge or The Lava Lamp Disco. It'll make a fortune! Imagine the munchie sales!

imagine if the neighboring states authorities agreed not to stop folks leaving our fine state;
for the week or so surrounding the event! PROFIT!

[Josseppie]

Originally Posted by eatsDEN

OK, not a business, but a govt. "program" (as I had mentioned above) that also seems to be desired, by those at the state capitol, to be self sustaining... which has not been the case for the last 10+ years...

Not even a government "program" more of a educational institution with the same mission as any college to educate the youth but through 4h and FFA.

Originally Posted by eatsDEN

I hope they brought in someone in who understands the program impact that the "generally accepted accounting principles" have on their operation and how it is evaluated - instead of someone who talks of the "reality" while manipulating (disposing of expenses or adding to revenue streams) the profitability analysis to suit their needs...

They just started the search and already have close to 80 applicants. It will be interesting to see who they get.

Originally Posted by eatsDEN

BTW - the stock show needed the state contribution exactly because they didn't reinvest in the program and infrastructure over time - which is what the depreciation charge on your books is supposed to remind you of the necessity of...

Kind of the same place the fair finds itself in. I would like to see the state/ city/ fair sit down and come up with a plan to remodel the fair grounds as I think that would help them in the off season.

Originally Posted by eatsDEN

which is why I have such a hard time with Wiseman's statements about the fair's "actual" profit and loss - after including the bail-out and excluding the depreciation charges from his analysis

Remember the numbers he quotes come from the independent auditing firm.

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by eatsDEN

imagine if the neighboring states authorities agreed not to stop folks leaving our fine state; for the week or so surrounding the event! PROFIT!

I'm talking all year long! Rent out the dorm rooms too, legalize the world's oldest profession in the city of Pueblo. Cancel the fair, let it go, convert it to gambling, sex, drugs and rock and roll. The sin capitol of I-25, they'll come from 500 miles away! Okay, for the "educational tax free" IRS 501-c-3 status we can offer sex ed classes and all manner of classes that go with it. We'll add lanes to I-25, double the airport, and a special Amtrak Train to bring in the Shriners! Can we spell BILLION$ boys and gurls!

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by Josseppie

It's not a business it's a fair and educational facilty for the 4H and FFA complete with dorms. Additionally the stock show has the same issues in Denver why they needed the state money to upgrade the complex as they could not do it on their own.

Now I agree they need to increase offseason business but how much I'm not sure. It will be interesting to see what the new manager and fair board come up with in the next year.

The duplicity in this statement is implying that the state is coming in to fund the Stock Show upgrade. An implication that completely ignores that the Stock Show upgrade is being funded to the tune of $700M by the city. So, 60-70% of the upgrade funding is coming from local sources.

Meanwhile, in Pueblo, the State Fair has seen reduced local contributions and what seems like zero political will from the local rubes to pony up additional funding to see the Fair and it's economic benefits remain in Pueblo- let alone to expand it. This continued financial issues of the Fair and Nevling's rumblings about going after the Fair's subsidies unless a turn-around is implemented will hopefully garner some call to action at the local level in Pueblo. As soon as, or "if" to be pessimistic, Pueblo announces an effort to secure additional local funding, such as a local bonding initiative with state contributions, to upgrade the fairgrounds all of these relocation rumblings will cease. Should that not happen, this topic will come up year after year.