Columbus City and Suburban Development News (Franklin, Hubbard: rain, towns, boundary)

[jbcmh81]

Tax credits key to redevelopment of former Madison

An update on the old Madison's and the adjacent building at 72-84 N. High Street. The Day Companies has applied for historic preservation credits, but those may not be available or perhaps a year or so. The plan is for office and residential with new restaurants on the ground floor.

[Mplsite]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

COTA awarded $38M in federal funding for its CMAX service along Cleveland Avenue - Columbus - Columbus Business First

Good news for the Cleveland Avenue BRT line. It was awarded a federal grant that will cover 80% of the projected cost. The project is supposed to be completed in spring of 2017.

Still at a loss at how it's going to take nearly as long to install as LRT; I thought one of the major advantages of BRT was that it's much faster to install for similar service and all at a much lower cost up front. It took 3 years and 9 months to construct and open the Green Line between Minneapolis and St Paul. Or is this another "unrealistic" expectation of mine?

[Mplsite]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

Some comments... the population is undercounted, and I would say possibly by a decent amount. Even so, the 7,080 estimate is a growth rate of over 250 a year since 2010. Continued on through 2020, that would be about 8,600. I think the actual population was closer to 7,600 in 2014. and that the population will be closer to 10,000 in 2020. The two main reasons I think this... the report uses the 2013 tract estimates, which actually showed population decline in both downtown census tracts. That, of course, is nonsense. The other reason is because there are more units getting built per year (about 369) than they have in population growth. Vacancy rates are in the 1% or less range, meaning that there is no reason to not assume that almost every unit built is filled. That would mean a lot more people.

Even so, 10,000 by 2020 is pretty slow. Our downtown now holds 10% of the city's population (40k in a city of 400,000). Even if we stick to original urban boundaries which are pre-annexation it's a long way to go to reach 10% at 20,000 or so downtown residents at the current pace. I would think it has to pick up, but when? Or has it recently?

[I_am_Father_McKenzie]

Originally Posted by Mplsite

Still at a loss at how it's going to take nearly as long to install as LRT; I thought one of the major advantages of BRT was that it's much faster to install for similar service and all at a much lower cost up front. It took 3 years and 9 months to construct and open the Green Line between Minneapolis and St Paul. Or is this another "unrealistic" expectation of mine?

I was thinking the same thing. Why the hell does it take so long? And cost so much? Not to mention, it won't even have a dedicated lane. The LRT in Phoenix took 3 years to build, and it has all street-grade crossings. It goes from midtown, through downtown, and through Tempe to Mesa. The three densest areas of Phoenix. This BRT is going straight down one road of mainly not-so-urban developments. Tempe has been working on plans for a streetcar for what seems ages, but I bet even that is built and operational before this BRT. COTA needs to be trashed and started from scratch with all new leadership.

[Mplsite]

I hope you're kidding about the no dedicated lane thing because that would instantly revoke the "R" in BRT. But then again, this is Columbus we're talking about.

[I_am_Father_McKenzie]

Originally Posted by Mplsite

I hope you're kidding about the no dedicated lane thing because that would instantly revoke the "R" in BRT. But then again, this is Columbus we're talking about.

It's no joke. We're spending almost $50 million on this thing. It will still take 35 minutes to get from 161 to downtown. Those estimates are usually on the low side. It takes less than half that time to drive that in a car. Isn't rapid transit supposed to get people to use public transport? This will only be marginally better for people who already have to take the Number 1.

COTA is clueless. For example, the "express" lines that run $85/month. Who wants to ride that thing from Westerville to downtown when it takes 1+ hours to do so? It stops at every other Number 1 stop down Cleveland. Express lines should go from downtown Dublin, Westerville, Hilliard, Grove City, Gahanna et. al. park and rides, and use the highway to get downtown.

[I_am_Father_McKenzie]

Originally Posted by Mplsite

Even so, 10,000 by 2020 is pretty slow. Our downtown now holds 10% of the city's population (40k in a city of 400,000). Even if we stick to original urban boundaries which are pre-annexation it's a long way to go to reach 10% at 20,000 or so downtown residents at the current pace. I would think it has to pick up, but when? Or has it recently?

The only way you have 40,000 is if you're including the highly populated areas around University of Minnesota. How large exactly is your "downtown"? You're definitely denser, but it's not as dramatic as you make it seem. Also, Columbus urban area is about 1 million smaller than MSP (almost half).

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Mplsite

Still at a loss at how it's going to take nearly as long to install as LRT; I thought one of the major advantages of BRT was that it's much faster to install for similar service and all at a much lower cost up front. It took 3 years and 9 months to construct and open the Green Line between Minneapolis and St Paul. Or is this another "unrealistic" expectation of mine?

I suspect part of the reason was finding the funding for it. The actual study didn't take that long. Now that the funding is there, it'll be about 2 years to complete.

Almost 4 years isn't exactly fast, either. I really expected more from MSP.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by I_am_Father_McKenzie

It's no joke. We're spending almost $50 million on this thing. It will still take 35 minutes to get from 161 to downtown. Those estimates are usually on the low side. It takes less than half that time to drive that in a car. Isn't rapid transit supposed to get people to use public transport? This will only be marginally better for people who already have to take the Number 1.

COTA is clueless. For example, the "express" lines that run $85/month. Who wants to ride that thing from Westerville to downtown when it takes 1+ hours to do so? It stops at every other Number 1 stop down Cleveland. Express lines should go from downtown Dublin, Westerville, Hilliard, Grove City, Gahanna et. al. park and rides, and use the highway to get downtown.

We as in who? The federal government is paying for most of it.

I agree, though, that the lack of dedicated lane is a real issue and I've been critical of this from the first announcement. It's inexcusable. The only hope is that they'll decide to put it in last minute. That said, I think this is really a COTA leadership issue. It's why the bus system has been pretty terrible as well. For whatever reason, they just seem to still be more concerned about catering to cars rather than improving the alternative transit business they're responsible for. It makes me worried about the fate of the proposed rail and how they might screw it up. Columbus has demand for serious alternatives, but this is one issue that I mostly agree with Mplsite on... it still has a small-town mentality on this and they need to be more forward thinking.

[Mplsite]

Originally Posted by I_am_Father_McKenzie

The only way you have 40,000 is if you're including the highly populated areas around University of Minnesota. How large exactly is your "downtown"? You're definitely denser, but it's not as dramatic as you make it seem. Also, Columbus urban area is about 1 million smaller than MSP (almost half).

No U of M: Downtown is well within the confines of surrounding highways.