Will Columbus become largest Ohio metro? (Cleveland, Cincinnati: school, organic, live)

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by kpl1228

Columbus is the closest thing Ohio has to a true growth city, a Phoenix.
That's not necessarily a compliment. Though it could be.

Phoenix sprawl is insane. 52% of all Columbus metro growth is within the city, 71% within Franklin County. Columbus just isn't sprawling the way so many Sun Belt places are.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Great, but your long term issues with Cleveland betrays your ''couldn't give two ****s about Cleveland''.

Nothing says big city metro like a generic Arena District and Perry County.

The AD was pretty innovative at the time, and it's been really successful. I wouldn't knock it.
I would also disagree about Perry County. Considering the commuting exchange required to include new counties to metros, that would suggest that Columbus has a strong influence at least that far away.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Stop reading after first sentence or so. My post responded to the hung-up on Cleveland poster trashing the city and its sports franchises; summary of my post is ''don't throw rocks when you live in a glass house''.

Btw, no one is talking about college sports and the taxpayer funded iconic Horseshoe.

What cities are or did ''clamor'' to get an MLS franchise? So it's all about MLS stadium location in Columbus for crappy attendance; given that Columbus is supposed to be the big MSA in Ohio, yet only has 2 pro teams, why would the MLS stadium location matter?

As far as generic stadiums go, it's not an opinion as it's just another example of how generic cities are becoming generally.

Cincinnati. Austin. Miami. Nashville, etc. There are quite a few cities without MLS teams trying to get them. They're already in most of the major markets- New York, Boston, Chicago, Houston, Atlanta, LA, etc. While the sport is still growing in the US, it's number 1 in almost every other nation in the world. It's only going to become more popular.

Columbus lack of major teams has everything to do with the fact that Cincinnati and Cleveland have long had franchises in the 3 biggest sports, and they got them when both cities were much bigger cities nationally. If there were no NFL, MLB or NBA cities in Ohio right now, which city do you think would be most likely to be a candidate to get one? Columbus is unlikely to get one now because of current market saturation, along with ownership in those cities preventing expansion. After all, having a home team means less eyes and market dollars for teams in the other 2-Cs. Columbus has expressed interest in both MLB and NBA teams and was basically shot down by those owners. OSU is secondary at best or Columbus wouldn't have any other teams in anything.

[Losfrisco]

Originally Posted by brock2010

As far as you know, are there any plans to restart rail transit in Columbus?

All I know is that some politicians are seen as heroes within Columbus for blocking a simple rail connection to CIN and CLE. Columbus does actually have more density than several metros that have already gone all in on interurban rail, but it seems extremely unlikely that even a simple streetcar would ever get past the proposal stages in Columbus.

[Losfrisco]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Define ''rail transit up until the end of the Viet Nam War''? You're talking about Amtrak? Viet Nam War ended in 1975. Otherwise, what rail tranist into the mid-'70s are you talking about?

Amtrak, yes. Imagine a country in Europe or Asia the size of Ohio with three 2 million metros all right in a line, and then being told "oh, that one in the middle doesn't have a train station."

[Losfrisco]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

What? This is just dumb. Columbus didn't dismantle anything. The only rail transit it had were trolleys- which disappeared in the 1940s-1950s, the same time they did in every other city as people switched to cars- and Amtrak. The single Amtrak line was not heavily used by the 1970s and was shut down through no decision of the city. The city had no control over either event.
The relative density was related to area size. The density dropped due to border expansion, not necessarily because the density in the urban city dropped. The annexation was partially dictated by ongoing water shortages during the early 1950s and the recognition early on that the burgeoning expansion of suburbs was going to syphon people and money away from the city. IMO, it was one of the smartest decisions Columbus leadership ever made. It spared them from half a century of stagnation or decline, and the negative perceptions that brings with it. For the record, though, the city's density has been rising for 3 decades after bottoming out in the 1980s. A few years ago, it passed Cincinnati's overall density despite being 3x larger in area, and will eventually pass Cleveland's. It also has the highest density neighborhoods in the state.
In addition, Columbus does NOT have Ohio's most metro suburban sprawl. That distinction goes to Cincinnati. Columbus' overall development pattern is actually quite compact.
But I know all this will fall on deaf ears because this is not about facts, this is about having an axe to grind.

They didn't dismantle anything-except for literally hundreds of miles of urban streetcar track.

[216facts]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

If there were no NFL, MLB or NBA cities in Ohio right now, which city do you think would be most likely to be a candidate to get one?

The one with the largest media market?

[Losfrisco]

Originally Posted by I_am_Father_McKenzie

You have a dirty, slow, old "transit" system that no one rides. Congrats. Columbus is looking to the future with autonomous vehicles, and other more efficient transportation technology. They're not wasting billions on tech that already fell by the wayside once when better options came along 100 years ago. No one rides rail because they want to. They do so because where it's "successful" is where it's the best option. If there are better options rail doesn't succeed. And there are better options now, and only getting better.

Another way of saying this is that Cleveland is one of the handful of cities in the western hemisphere that actually has a heavy rail subway, and that Columbus is a city approaching 1 million population that does not have a simple streetcar because "270 and driverless cars".

Your comments are right in line with the PR "leapfrog light rail" talking points from the city.

What they are basically saying is that the cities that are literally pumping billions into urban rail right now-Los Angeles, Seattle, New York, Phoenix, Atlanta, San Diego are all just wasting money on technology that is imminently about become obsolete, while Columbus is smartly waiting to pounce on "the next thing" whatever that is, and whenever it comes along.

Right now the issue in Columbus is %80 of vehicles on the road are ONE PERSON IN ONE CAR.....how are autonomous vehicles addressing this? What is the "other more efficient transportation technology?" Columbus should share their secrets with the rest of the country so they can catch up to C-bus!

[Urban Peasant]

It all comes down to politics. Cleveland has many physical and cultural attributes that make it an attractive city with many opportunities. What it lacks is good leadership. There seems to be too much of the "same ol, same ol" attitude towards solving problems, no good agreements between stakeholders, and the multiple term mayor is too smug and entrenched to want to do anything bold to make the city better. Here's the latest article from just today about the man's perplexing attitude towards economic development:

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2019/...or-region.html

Until the leadership cares as much about the city and region as the citizens they serve, Cleveland and Cuyahoga County will not overcome their struggles. Too bad because there are prime opportunities to strike a chord and rival Columbus in economic development.

Maybe it is time to ask when will Cleveland overtake Columbus in population and wealth. That will at least start up a conversation.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by Losfrisco

They didn't dismantle anything-except for literally hundreds of miles of urban streetcar track.

How is this unique to Columbus? How would Columbus have controlled the changing demand? Hundreds of cities lost their streetcars when cars became dominant. This is a silly, dishonest argument on your part, but par for the course.