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Weak minded people have a right not to be manipulated just to foster someone's personal standing in a community, dont they?
Didnt Adolph Hitler kill the mentally ill, and disabled, having simular thoughts about natural selection? Wasnt he supposed to be a bad guy??
Not even a remotely close analogy. Murder and coercing are two totally different things. "Hey Jew, go kill yourself while I watch because I think you're worthless" is far different from "come here Jew, I'm going to kill you because you're worthless".
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn
But Clampdown, the guy yelling fire never told movie goers to riot. They chose to (no different than the gazelle you spoke of), and must accept the consequences of their bad decision, via your 1st amendment has no limits M.O.
You are being inconsistent regarding yelling "fire".
Do people always riot when they think there's a fire? Every time I've been involved in an actual fire alarm, most of the participants just quickly move towards an exit. No hysterical screaming, nobody getting trampled.
I understand what you guys are saying, but you have to do better with the comparisons. ConeyGirl, if someone told me to murder you and I did it, should I go to jail or should the person that told me to? bob, that's not really what free speech means. Saying something like, "I hate blacks because they eat all the chicken and watermelon" is free speech. Is it offensive? I'm sure someone will find it to be so. But can you stop them from saying it just because you don't like it? No, you can't. That's the essence of free speech.
Yes it's the law obviously we have established that. I'm not arguing that it's law or not in that state, I'm sure the DA who pressed the charges didn't pull the charge out of her behind. It's also the law in Dubai to execute apostates.
I'm arguing the validity of the law. It should not be illegal to be a bad person, it should not be illegal to be cruel or a bully because that is not something tangible and definite that can be agreed on (ex someone who stabs someone is a murderer and no one can dispute that).
Prosecuting immorality is a pandora box one should not open if you value a free society because immorality is not something that means the same to everyone. I'm willing to wager that if you put it to vote that a majority of the people in Alabaster, Alabama would say that sodomy abortion are immoral whereas I doubt that the people of San Francisco would feel the same.
She is a bad person no doubt in my mind but that doesn't mean she should go to prison because she didn't do anything but speak words.
Yes this was a kid who was loved by his family, and I'm gonna guess they are distraught and looking for someone to blame because the reality of it - that their beloved child is dead because HE chose to end his life - is a hard thing to face.
Take emotions out of it, the law is not about emotions ("the law is reason, free from passion" -Aristotle)
If you take feelings out of it because feelings are irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, she didn't do anything but talk.
Location: Subconscious Syncope, USA (Northeastern US)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veezybell
Not even a remotely close analogy. Murder and coercing are two totally different things. "Hey Jew, go kill yourself while I watch because I think you're worthless" is far different from "come here Jew, I'm going to kill you because you're worthless".
Veezy, just to clarify - Clamp brought up natural selection in this case. That makes my mind go to the rhetoric of Nazi Germany, which included the murder of the deformed and mentally disabled. Im also told it included the Romi (Gypsies). Clamp brought up random Jews being gased for being Jewish, which was never a part of my thought process nor related to the topic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clampdown69
"You all should go kill yourselves. You're stupid and horrible."
See I just said it, if any of you commit suicide, is it my fault? Hell no. Unless someone legitimately put the noose around your neck/administered the poison, it is not their fault that someone kills themselves. You don't have to do whatever people tell you. Yeah, she's a total ((female dog)) and probably a sociopath, neither of which are crimes.
I'm very sad that the person is dead, however tbh someone so weak minded to listen to that wasn't cut out for society and its almost natural selection eliminating the weakest links.
I guess we can blame revisionist history for people assuming Hitler only hated/killed Jews. It did not foster his Aryan Supremacy theories to have deformed and mentally disabled Germans running around either.
Last edited by ConeyGirl52; 02-28-2015 at 11:01 PM..
She is sick in the head, but she didn't murder the guy. She never laid a hand on him. He killed himself! This is a tragic thing all the way around. Let's not make it worse by throwing murder and manslaughter charges around. We are supposed to be a civilized people, but all we want is blood...someone to pay for the suicide of someone else. How many times have we heard this before...always blaming everyone except the one who committed suicide?
Location: Subconscious Syncope, USA (Northeastern US)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Javacoffee
She is sick in the head, but she didn't murder the guy. She never laid a hand on him. He killed himself! This is a tragic thing all the way around. Let's not make it worse by throwing murder and manslaughter charges around. We are supposed to be a civilized people, but all we want is blood...someone to pay for the suicide of someone else. How many times have we heard this before...always blaming everyone except the one who committed suicide?
Okay, but she HAS been charged with involuntary manslaugter already. She answers the charge in April.
Okay, but she HAS been charged with involuntary manslaugter already. She answers the charge in April.
Duh! That's a fact but it's a stupid fact nonethless. The other dude said it more eloquently than I because I'm just blunt but the fact that he is dead does not negate his responsibility for things he did while alive, one of those things he did was murder himself. He had free will like every other human and unless she is a witch and put a spell on him (which didn't happen) that means he chose to kill himself. Sorry it's true.
As for the the holocaust, every Jew, gypsy, gay guy, Jehovah's witness, socialist, Slav etc was actually murdered. Either by being gassed or being locked up and starved or being worked to death or being shot etc.
If hitler or the national socialist German workers party (NDSAP or the Nazis as they're known) just said "you filthy [insert label here]! You are untermensch and don't deserve to be alive!" Do you really think anyone would be dead? Maybe one Jew who was already insane and really cared what they thought but that would be his psychosis not their fault.
It's not her fault that the kid was mentally ill and a sheep who listens whenever someone tells them to do something, she should've told him to pay my rent instead
Location: Subconscious Syncope, USA (Northeastern US)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clampdown69
Duh! That's a fact but it's a stupid fact nonethless. The other dude said it more eloquently than I because I'm just blunt but the fact that he is dead does not negate his responsibility for things he did while alive, one of those things he did was murder himself. He had free will like every other human and unless she is a witch and put a spell on him (which didn't happen) that means he chose to kill himself. Sorry it's true.
As for the the holocaust, every Jew, gypsy, gay guy, Jehovah's witness, socialist, Slav etc was actually murdered. Either by being gassed or being locked up and starved or being worked to death or being shot etc.
If hitler or the national socialist German workers party (NDSAP or the Nazis as they're known) just said "you filthy [insert label here]! You are untermensch and don't deserve to be alive!" Do you really think anyone would be dead? Maybe one Jew who was already insane and really cared what they thought but that would be his psychosis not their fault.
It's not her fault that the kid was mentally ill and a sheep who listens whenever someone tells them to do something, she should've told him to pay my rent instead
Lol! (at the rent) she's still taking advantage, but not for her own benefit, and at least no one had to die.
Yeah, its easy to think people who think like you do are eloquent. I think bobtn is eloquent on this thread, but the boards wont let me give bob any more rep, lol. *shrugs*
The woman did not kill him directly,but she did encourage him to commit suicide,telling him to get back in his truck.
I am kind of in the middle and do not know what to really think of this.
On one hand,he was fragile already.
On the other hand,she did not hold a gun to his head.
My thoughts? Until all the evidence comes out in the trial, I really don't have much of an opinion. I'd have to read every single email, see the timeline and so on.
When I dumped my abusive ex, he kept threatening to kill himself in order to manipulate me into going back with him. I had repeatedly told him to get professional help and leave me out of his issues. But he kept threatening and guilt-tripping me until my patience ran out, and I told him to just do what he wants.
Did I want him to commit suicide? Absolutely not. I just wanted him to leave me alone.
Of course, he didn't kill himself. He's still alive as far as I know, though last I heard, he's in prison now.
Point is, maybe the same thing was the case with that girl. Maybe him getting out the truck was another manipulative ploy ("last chance") attempt to manipulate her into giving him what he wanted. Maybe she thought she was just calling his bluff by telling him to get back into the truck. And maybe unbeknownst to both of them, the suicide attempt ended up successful.
I don't claim that this was what happened. But I also wouldn't rule it out just yet.
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