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Old 07-31-2019, 01:19 PM
 
46,946 posts, read 25,972,151 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arktikos View Post
His fly by the seat of his pants approach had worked for him up until then, so why not keep going?
That's known as confusing the absence of failure with the presence of success, and that's an attitude that has cost untold lives and treasure. The odds catch up sooner or later.

As Aredhel points out the contrast to an ocean racing crew couldn't be starker: These are people who know in their bones that they're up against an opponent that'll kill them stone dead sooner or later if they're not vigilant in their planning, skill-building and choice of equipment.

McCandless didn't succumb to an objective risk, like an unpredictable accident or equipment failure. He killed himself the day he entered a hostile environment without skills, knowledge and gear. The fact that his actual death came later doesn't change that.
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Old 07-31-2019, 02:21 PM
 
Location: Southern Illinois
10,364 posts, read 20,791,358 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post

McCandless didn't succumb to an objective risk, like an unpredictable accident or equipment failure. He killed himself the day he entered a hostile environment without skills, knowledge and gear. The fact that his actual death came later doesn't change that.
Did you ever see the movie Jeremiah Johnson? When he first got to the mountains he didn’t have the faintest idea what he was up against. He was a greenhorn. The movie was based on a book called Mountain Man by Vardis Fisher, which was a very good read btw. As Fisher describes in the book, many folks wanted to be mountain men and of course they were all greenhorns when they started out but a lot of them died. They knew going out that it was a possibility but they went anyway. Sometimes they were tortured or scalped before they died.

You can stay home and die a little every day or you can risk your life following your soul. Yes, perhaps he should’ve prepared better, but so what if he died doing what he wanted to do.

Here is a question I’ve been thinking about lately...would you rather die happy, while things seem to be going well for you, or would you rather die old and cranky and without friends? Yes I know there are more choices in the world, but these are the ones I’m presenting for this discussion.
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Old 07-31-2019, 02:35 PM
 
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The man was a legend. I've been tempted but could never quite go through with some journeys. The spirit of McCandless still lives within me. As I sit here doing this insurance job many times I dream about sitting in a tree in the wilderness eating grapes.
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Old 07-31-2019, 02:41 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
10,352 posts, read 7,980,919 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stepka View Post
You can stay home and die a little every day or you can risk your life following your soul. Yes, perhaps he should’ve prepared better, but so what if he died doing what he wanted to do.
But Chris McCandless didn't die doing what he wanted to do. The "Please help me!" note he pinned on the bus for potential rescuers to read shows that quite clearly. He didn't go out there with the intent of slowly succumbing to starvation. If he'd deliberately chosen to go out into the wilderness to die this would be a very different discussion.

And he didn't even want to be out there any more. Remember, he'd tried to walk back the way he came in, only to find the river he'd easily crossed back in April was now in full flood and unsafe to ford. By the end of July he was finished with his "life in the wild" Alaskan wilderness experiment. Unfortunately, the wild wasn't quite finished with him.

He wasn't an ascetic who'd chosen to slowly starve himself in the pursuit of enlightenment. He was a kid who simply over-estimated his abilities and lost his life as a result.
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Old 07-31-2019, 03:04 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aredhel View Post
But Chris McCandless didn't die doing what he wanted to do. The "Please help me!" note he pinned on the bus for potential rescuers to read shows that quite clearly. He didn't go out there with the intent of slowly succumbing to starvation. If he'd deliberately chosen to go out into the wilderness to die this would be a very different discussion.

And he didn't even want to be out there any more. Remember, he'd tried to walk back the way he came in, only to find the river he'd easily crossed back in April was now in full flood and unsafe to ford. By the end of July he was finished with his "life in the wild" Alaskan wilderness experiment. Unfortunately, the wild wasn't quite finished with him.

He wasn't an ascetic who'd chosen to slowly starve himself in the pursuit of enlightenment. He was a kid who simply over-estimated his abilities and lost his life as a result.
That's pretty much my take on it, as well.
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Old 07-31-2019, 04:35 PM
 
Location: Riding a rock floating through space
2,660 posts, read 1,554,286 times
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Check this video, starting at 2:27 what this guy says is consistant with my suicide theory. Chris died a virgin, was really socially awkward, had a lot of anger towards his parents. What kind of 22 year old gives away $24k and abandons their car to become a hobo? A suicidal one. I think his last words about "happiness is only real when shared" was more of a final recognition that his attempts at finding happiness alone were a fail. He already knew he couldn't find happiness with others because he failed to connect with others his whole life. It angers me that his parents allowed Krakauer to make public this poor kids life and demise, and turn the truth into some romantized bs. Krakauer is a very persuasive writer, but I knew what this was from the first page to the last when I bought the book the year it came out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZy2HzNZ5MI

Last edited by duke944; 07-31-2019 at 04:47 PM..
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Old 07-31-2019, 04:41 PM
 
9,576 posts, read 7,329,017 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
What kind of 22 year old gives away $24k and abandons their car to become a hobo? A suicidal one.
Where did you get your PhD in Psychology or MD in Psychiatry from?
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Old 07-31-2019, 04:41 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
10,352 posts, read 7,980,919 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
Check this video, starting at 2:27 what this guy says is consistant with my suicide theory. Chris died a virgin, was really socially awkward, had a lot of anger. What kind of 22 year old gives away $24k and abandons their car to become a hobo? A suicidal one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZy2HzNZ5MI
Or just a very confused one.
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Old 07-31-2019, 04:41 PM
 
1 posts, read 391 times
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Default m' or 1=1 limit--+

asdasdas
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Old 07-31-2019, 05:43 PM
 
Location: Southern Illinois
10,364 posts, read 20,791,358 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
Check this video, starting at 2:27 what this guy says is consistant with my suicide theory. Chris died a virgin, was really socially awkward, had a lot of anger towards his parents. What kind of 22 year old gives away $24k and abandons their car to become a hobo? A suicidal one. I think his last words about "happiness is only real when shared" was more of a final recognition that his attempts at finding happiness alone were a fail. He already knew he couldn't find happiness with others because he failed to connect with others his whole life. It angers me that his parents allowed Krakauer to make public this poor kids life and demise, and turn the truth into some romantized bs. Krakauer is a very persuasive writer, but I knew what this was from the first page to the last when I bought the book the year it came out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZy2HzNZ5MI
I’m not convinced by the suicide theory. I was a pretty socially awkward teen and young adult my own self and I went thru some pretty bad times back in those days and I shared many of his dreams. I don’t idealize him at all...it’s just that I can relate. And never once did I even come close to committing suicide. I’d say the best way to have any inkling about what was going on in his head would be to find out what books he was reading as a kid and also to study his writings. I don’t remember if that was mentioned in Krakauer’s book but I don’t think so, at least I don’t think he talked about the books. Yet I could probably put together a reading list that would come pretty close to what he read.

Also, I remember having this weird idea as a kid that I would learn someday to live without any money...just exist in the woods. Then as a teenager I would hitchhike to different parts of the states and dreamed of going to Alaska, but then a girl got her arms cut off by a driver and I realized (duh!) that there might be fates worse than death. That might’ve been me. It’s a personality type and I share it. Yes I’ve cooled it down a bit since then but I’m closer to being a Wiser and older Chris, or a starving woman with bear in the woods than I am to the folks who are accusing him of being an idiot. Not saying you’re wrong but y’all will never understand.

Last edited by stepka; 07-31-2019 at 05:53 PM..
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