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I just rented a satellite phone for a trip my husband is taking soon to Big Bend where he'll be doing primitive camping in an area with no cell coverage.
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Originally Posted by Veritas Vincit
Many people underestimate how quickly "rural" turns to "remote" in the West.
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Originally Posted by Bluefox
I’ve been to the hinterlands in Nevada and it is truly desolate. You could drive for hours and not see a soul.
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Originally Posted by sheerbliss
I'm from Colorado and live in Indiana now. People here don't realize that there are places out west where you can drive for hours without seeing anyone.
I've lived in central Indiana my entire life. I didn't get "out west" until I was thirty years old. Been out west a few times now, and also the Yukon and Alaska. Some people just don't grasp just how desolate these places can be. Here in Indiana we do still have some places with no or minimal cell signal, but not like out west. People drive two counties out of their small to medium sized metro area in Indiana and will say "There is nothing out here." They are likely a ten minute drive to some small town with at least one gas station and within an hour drive to some metro area of at least 500K people.
For heading out to more rural areas, one should always have the following:
A personal locator beacon (PLB). I don't suggest the models that integrate a GPS unit with a PLB messaging function. Just get a stand alone PLB. The battery on mine just expired this month so I'll be sending it in before venturing out to Utah and Colorado later this year. In five years it will expire again, but I'll likely just spend the money for an updated model.
A decent GPS unit that uses both GPS and GLONASS. If one wants to pay for a subscription service to send text messages, etc., that is available on some models.
Always rent a satellite phone. These are only $100-$130 for a week and around $250 for about thirty days.
Some more basic stuff: A signal flash mirror used to reflect sun rays back to aircraft. A loud whistle. A signal flare gun (might not want to use in a dry forest area though). A hand crank device that has various plugs (wall sockets, USB, etc.) and also likely with a built in flash light.
Food and water: Just have plenty of water available. Buy boxes of protein bars, trail mix, etc. type foods.
I was given some advice if I ever got into a situation where my cell phone didn't have a signal and I needed help. Change my voicemail message with as many details as possible so anyone calling my phone would know what was going on. I'm going to try it next time I'm in a dead zone.
I don’t think that would work unless you did it before you were in a dead zone
The message you set for when you don’t answer or maybe your phone is in dead zone is saved on the big server of the phone company==that is where people leave a message for you when they get that response—-on the company server—not on your specific phone—you call it up when you call the server bank—takes no time at all if you aren’t in a dead zone…
The incoming calls get your message not after accessing YOUR phone but on the company’s server bank if your call can’t be completed—
An incoming call rebounds so to speak after hitting the phone mast as close to your phone’s location as it can go and then going BACK to the company server—so the caller can leave a message—
You might try to save it in a dead zone but I don’t think anyone will get it because if someone can’t get IN to your phone—your phone can’t get OUT the company server or anyone else’s phone
At least that is how I understand reception works—-
I know but they obviously didn’t have either
And some RV people DO camp off grid for short periods of time
This couple just was not really prepared
And I bet the wife tried to get him to turn around sooner and he refused
Hard to say without seeing where they were, but given that they were in a motorhome with a toad, turning around might not have been possible-the road may have been too narrow with no turnouts. And with the car in tow, backing up any distance isn't practical. Now-given that they were elderly, they should have known enough to recognize when things weren't looking good and not gotten in that position in the first place. Due to it's size and weight, a RV has no place in the backcountry in the hands of an inexperienced operator. At the least, unhook the car, scout ahead with it and make sure the road was open, or at the least that there was a place to turn around, before bringing the RV up there.
Out of 126 riders on one of my last ADV treks (Backroads) - (1) person had a satellite emergency locator device. 90% of the riders were far younger and more tech savvy than me. (And they have been employed in the last 20 yrs so could probably afford something like this). They ride once a month for a weekend very remotely, and usually 2-3 long trips (10 - 14 days into Mexico) / yr, yet no-one carries this type of device (except the one person).
I may get one, since investments are doing so well. The money to fund it is actually attainable now.
Yesterday, I did 're-up' one of several Air Evac memberships I keep current. That is only valid if they find me alive. (unlikely since I travel solo most of the time and no one knows where I am going everyday (including me). When it gets dark I try to be near home, but missed that by an hour again tonight. I am lost a lot of the time, but that is the adventure (Kinda knowing where you are). You don't want to try that with a partner that can't find or physically get home if you croak or get injured.
Dang, that's a big group to ride with-how was the dust? I've done a few Best of Montana 1000s, the Idaho BDR and a few other "unnamed" trips. The BOMs ususally had 20-30, but split up into smaller groups during the day, only getting together at the camp site at night. We did have one ride where we lost several members for several hours-got onto a stretch of trail that turned into a nearly trackless slog through a bog. Ended up fine. The good thing, at least with a group, you have enough people so some can ride from help if there's an injury while some stay with the patient. But...it may take hours to find somewhere to make contact.
"Last year, Indiana processed a record 203 Silver Alert requests with a record 153 activations. In all, 152 people were located, with 96 credited to Indiana State Police activating a Silver Alert." https://www.wthr.com/article/news/lo...e-62ff4933ba70
Here in Indiana, "The [Silver Alert] Clearinghouse will offer analytical support from the Indiana Intelligence Fusion Center (IIFC), Public Information Office, Cybercrime & Investigative Technologies Section, K-9, and additional ISP investigators and officers." Silver alerts are for high-risk or endangered people regardless of where they are from. https://www.in.gov/isp/files/IN-Silver_Alert_Plan.pdf
The family members are frustrated because it took over three days for Nevada to start searching and eight days to issue a silver alert. Maybe someone from Nevada or in search and rescue or law enforcement can explain Nevada's procedures. I agree that the couple got themselves into a mess, but that's exactly the sort of scenario that search and rescues are for.
The important part of that article.
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"If we issued a Silver Alert every single time someone comes up missing, then at some point, these alerts are not going to mean anything and nobody's going to be paying attention,” Ringle said. “Mistakes do happen, but that criteria have to be met for this program to be successful."
I think they already mean nothing. Okay so one quarter of the people are never located even with the Silver Alert, wow. Another quarter are found but not because of the Silver Alert and less than half are supposedly found because of the Silver Alert. But I would like to know how many of those would have been found anyway even without the Silver Alert. My guess most.
If a family is frustrated because authorities aren't issuing a Silver Alert, then there are other options. They can just contact the local news media themselves. If there is some story behind the disappearance, then at least one local news media would probably be happy to report the story and alert the public.
Actually... a broadcast silver alert with their vehicle combination description would have likely brought a response from some of the 'several' vehicles they apparently met on their detour (including RV's according to the survivor.) There were really very few places they could have been if taking a wrong turn. (unless they had been RV-jacked to Mexico, another possibility the LE needed to weigh.)
As a frequent 'back-roader', I size up every vehicle I meet in case either I or they may need future help, and especially if I consider they should not be headed the direction they are going. (Low likelihood of coming back or getting through). They had a pretty big and modern rig combination for 'BLM / boondocking', so I bet several people said WTH are they doing here? Very surprising they were in a few days without meeting another vehicle, IF they were on a 'through' route. I would guess they took a turn, kept going due to too big to turn around and after a few turns and hills they were not seen. Bothers me that I flew over (Commercially) enroute to LAS on the days they were missing. I always scan the backroads and compare with my backcountry GPS app so I can find future ADV tracks. But... that flight I grabbed an exit row seat over the wing, so was not able to survey so much territory. Thousands of people flew over them every day. emergency mirror signaling, flares, or sacrificing the RV (or Kia) in a fire would have been an option when death is eminent.
Note to self... Throw in a mirror and few flares for my next adventure.
It was a through route, but it's not a major route. They were basically off roading in an RV. Have you ever driven in Nevada? I have driven for up to 30 minutes on both US-50 and US-95 and never saw another car. And those are major highways. If you get off the main highways it's anybody's guess how many days or even weeks it might be before you see another vehicle.
I think they already mean nothing. Okay so one quarter of the people are never located even with the Silver Alert, wow. Another quarter are found but not because of the Silver Alert and less than half are supposedly found because of the Silver Alert. But I would like to know how many of those would have been found anyway even without the Silver Alert. My guess most.
If a family is frustrated because authorities aren't issuing a Silver Alert, then there are other options. They can just contact the local news media themselves. If there is some story behind the disappearance, then at least one local news media would probably be happy to report the story and alert the public.
In my state (Oklahoma) it seems the Amber and Silver alerts on my phone are statewide. It it seems they are usually more than 100 miles away. So for that alone I usually ignore them. But I suppose if its happening nearby they may be of value. Or when they put them on highway signs.
But out in the middle of nowhere. No one else is out there. So how would it have helped?
Out of 126 riders on one of my last ADV treks (Backroads) - (1) person had a satellite emergency locator device. 90% of the riders were far younger and more tech savvy than me. (And they have been employed in the last 20 yrs so could probably afford something like this). They ride once a month for a weekend very remotely, and usually 2-3 long trips (10 - 14 days into Mexico) / yr, yet no-one carries this type of device (except the one person).
I may get one, since investments are doing so well. The money to fund it is actually attainable now.
Yesterday, I did 're-up' one of several Air Evac memberships I keep current. That is only valid if they find me alive. (unlikely since I travel solo most of the time and no one knows where I am going everyday (including me). When it gets dark I try to be near home, but missed that by an hour again tonight. I am lost a lot of the time, but that is the adventure (Kinda knowing where you are). You don't want to try that with a partner that can't find or physically get home if you croak or get injured.
They cost like $300 for the device and $12 a month for service. You hardly have to have good investments to buy one. Most people spend way more than that for their smartphones, which are not as capable.
Last edited by Cloudy Dayz; 04-09-2022 at 09:52 AM..
People drive two counties out of their small to medium sized metro area in Indiana and will say "There is nothing out here." They are likely a ten minute drive to some small town with at least one gas station and within an hour drive to some metro area of at least 500K people.
LOL, that's exactly how people here describe a drive to Ohio.
This reminds me of an episode of Better Call Saul where Mike (a transplant from Philadelphia) left someone by the side of the road in the badlands of New Mexico thinking someone would surely come by in a while and help. Nope.
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Originally Posted by indy_317
For heading out to more rural areas, one should always have the following:
...
I would add electrolytes; warm, water resistant clothes; and a change of shoes and socks. Even in the summer. It's roasting hot in the daytime and it rapidly gets chilly when the sun goes down. If you end up stuck where it's wet, you'll need dry shoes and socks after getting out of your car to go to the bathroom or get supplies from your trunk or gather snow to melt.
I would also have something to start a fire for warmth, melting snow and signaling others.
Even if you can communicate with rescuers, it could be hours or days (think high winds or blizzard) before they can get to you.
Most of all, I'd use the ol' noggin: should I believe GPS or my own eyes?
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Originally Posted by loves2read
The incoming calls get your message not after accessing YOUR phone but on the company’s server bank if your call can’t be completed—
Think of it this way: where there's no signal, messages can't get in and they can't get out. The charge on a cell phone would be better used as a light to signal rescuers.
Last edited by sheerbliss; 04-09-2022 at 09:42 AM..
In my state (Oklahoma) it seems the Amber and Silver alerts on my phone are statewide. It it seems they are usually more than 100 miles away. So for that alone I usually ignore them. But I suppose if its happening nearby they may be of value. Or when they put them on highway signs.
But out in the middle of nowhere. No one else is out there. So how would it have helped?
Well there you go. I suspect that the vast majority of people are like you and ignore them.
I think Amber and Silver Alerts and other programs like Crime Stoppers where law enforcement ask for the public's help, just show laziness on the part of law enforcement. These type of programs didn't used to exist. Cops used to be expected to go out and find missing persons and solve crimes themselves. Sure if the public called them with a tip that helped them that was great. But they didn't just sit behind a desk and sent out alerts asking for the public's help, like they do now.
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I am lost a lot of the time, but that is the adventure (Kinda knowing where you are). You don't want to try that with a partner that can't find or physically get home if you croak or get injured.
