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Just about every HS in plano has its share of overachievers just like other top schools. But the teachers and students know they cant give A's to everyone in HS like they can in MS.
Yes the curriculum throughout pisd is same and some tests are the same. But often teachers can vary the tests and they will make it harder at jasper when they have to. Seems like teachers do use a curve.
Shepton has plenty of overachievers just not as many as jasper. That overachiever at shepton would up their game at jasper just because their peers are doing it and many of them are more than capable. They just have the luxury of not having to do it as much at shepton which is why none of them are envious of jasper kids.
Jasper kids have time for extracurriculars too. They love math and science competitions. LOL. You wont find hardly any football or basketball players in jasper honor track, mostly band and orchestra types.
But if you want your child to be truly ready for the rigors of good colleges there is no other place like jasper where they can really excel and be popular amongst others of their peers. Yes, the smart kids are popular at Jasper. LOL
Last edited by Peter5457; 08-15-2015 at 05:25 PM..
There are many transfers throughout Pisd. But I think most of the kids in the Jasper honors track persevere and become stronger just like the IB students at plano east. I dont see too many kids from the honors track transfering after 9th grade. The transfers have moved on before 9th grade and some have dropped honors classes beginning of 9th grade. They dont usually drop honors track after 9th grade.
As for clubs and sports, i dont think it is hard to get into at all, seems like plenty of clubs and activities for everyone. One of the benefits of such a large school. Even for sports because they are not as good as other plano schools and the honors kids dont care about sports, its much easier to make the teams at jasper. Probably same for drama, drill team, etc.
Jasper is not open for incoming transfers anymore because if it was available they would get swamped with new incoming transfers students.
Last edited by Peter5457; 08-15-2015 at 05:31 PM..
hmm this makes sense. i do want them to be involved in sports and would hate for them to just study all day. how much hw does a student typically have a jasper? Are we talking about 3 hours a day on honor track or more like 5-6. 5-6 basically gives them no time for sports/activities. As far as shepton, is frankford also good or does it lag behind.
West Plano schools has more high achiever parents, hence more high achieving kids so more positive peer pressure ...
This is the biggest thing you get by sending your kids to Jasper. There are also plenty of high-achieving kids at Clark, Shepton, Vines, McMillen, even Williams (given that Otto feeds there). But you're probably looking at 2x or 3x the number of high-GPA gunners at Jasper than at the other schools.
As the quote below shows, that's a 2-edged sword.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Souleiado
...you have to expect an excellent student to be in the bottom third compare to other schools. Many of my friends have that issue with their children at Jasper. The competition is so high that even a good and hard working student can feel totally inadequate and some of them will feel like failure compare to other students. It also mean that your child may not have access to many clubs and activities due to the heavy competition. Many parents in that area choose to transfer to other HS.
This is absolutely true. For example, my kid (at a "lesser" PISD middle school) was able to compete at the regional MathCounts for three years straight. There's no way that would have happened someplace like Rice MS, where grabbing one of the 8 spots per school, even as an 8th grader, is unlikely.
Similarly, as a junior at Plano Senior, he's had the opportunity to attend (for free!) academic-related competitions in Chicago and San Antonio. No way that would have happened for a junior at Plano West - too many seniors angling for those spots.
Quote:
Originally Posted by coltseaver
So you're saying that a student who can get an UW 4.0 at Shepton may not be able to get that same UW4.0 at Jasper because there are more overachievers at Jasper?
Yes, that's what we are saying. Why? Because of this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter5457
Just about every HS in plano has its share of overachievers just like other top schools. But the teachers and students know they cant give A's to everyone in HS like they can in MS.
... often teachers can vary the tests and they will make it harder at jasper when they have to. Seems like teachers do use a curve.
Yep. For a (made-up) example:
The Pre-Calc teacher at, say, Clark may give a test and have 2 kids score in the 90s, 5 in the 80s, and the rest in the 70s or lower. You can be sure that test will be curved up.
The teacher at Jasper could well be giving an identical test. But, with half her kids having an engineer dad/mom at home, and the other half having a paid tutor from UTD, the raw results will be in the 90s and 80s almost exclusively. So she either doesn't curve it, or augments the test to "Jasper-ize" it. Either way, those kids are being held to a higher standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter5457
As for clubs and sports, i dont think it is hard to get into at all, seems like plenty of clubs and activities for everyone. One of the benefits of such a large school. Even for sports because they are not as good as other plano schools and the honors kids dont care about sports, its much easier to make the teams at jasper. Probably same for drama, drill team, etc.
True to an extent, but for those hoping to play UIL varsity-level, they're going to run into the buzzsaw of Shepton kids with the money for access to elite private coaching. Same thing for the drama kids - lots of private voice and acting coaching happening in that part of town.
Quote:
Jasper is not open for incoming transfers anymore because if it was available they would get swamped with new incoming transfers students.
Uh, this isn't true.
1) Jasper IS open for transfers -there were 50 transfer spots offered in 2014 and a similar number last year. There's no reason to think that Jasper won't be open for transfers in 2016 as well. (Shepton quite possibly will not be available, due to it already being near capacity.)
2) At least in 2014, those spots were not fully claimed. Fewer people are beating down the door for Jasper than we all on C-D think. It's a hassle to transfer schools, and kids don't want to leave friends. (Surprisingly, Vines was the school that came closest to filling its transfer spots in 2014, probably from people trying to stay in the PSHS zone, yet attend a smaller campus than Clark.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by fastfingers33
..As far as shepton, is frankford also good or does it lag behind.
I live in the Frankford area. My kid did not attend Frankford. There's a school board member who lives in the Frankford area. His kids did not attend Frankford. Draw your own conclusions.
More generously: Just like all other schools, there are successful students coming out of Frankford, and there are unsuccessful students coming out of Frankford. Looking around at the results in my own neighborhood, I didn't care for the ratio. YMMV.
Jasper and Shepton were both closed for transfers for this upcoming fall 2015.
I believe it is because so many new transplants are trying to get their kids into the top performing schools. There are still plenty of Schimelphenig kids opting for Jasper too.
And just look at all the questions posters here keep asking about the west cluster. I also knew some families who bought houses in Sr cluster and transferred their kids into robinson ms. They were hoping to continue to transfer into jasper but dont think that will be possible.
But yes, transferring means no class schedule guarantee/preferences or bus transport and also leaving friends too.
Last edited by Peter5457; 08-16-2015 at 10:52 PM..
I'm reading a TON of information and I'm having troubles trying to figure out how to decipher all of this.
Basically my situation is that I'm looking to buy a home in Plano, but I'm just not sure how to filter the neighborhoods I'm looking at. Real estate agents have largely been unhelpful since they tell me that Frisco or Allen is JUST as good as Plano (Average SAT seems to suggest otherwise). I could possibly see the argument of that if not for Citydata's heavy preference towards Plano ISD vs. other school district.
Anyways, I was never a motivated student although I grasp general concept fairly easily(very average memory, but fairly good critical thinking). I graduated top of my class in a weak HS and gone on to do well, but I could imagine if I went to a tough HS, i might have been less confident and done poorly. I mention this because I can imagine my kid being a very unmotivated student but generally decently smart which is why I'm a little wary of a school like jasper>plano west. I'd hate for my kid to suffer through a school just cause they don't work super hard, but otherwise would've been highly successful if they went to a school that didn't require so much studying.
I get that all schools have the same curriculum and the similar test. However, if we were to factor out competition, which schools have flat out the best teachers and opportunity? I seem to notice that a school like frankford probably has lesser teachers. I don't want a slacker culture, but I'd like to at least provide my kids with good teachers in a good facility.
I'm open to buying not in just plano west, but also plano senior or plano east as long as I have a good confidence that the teachers are roughly just as good and the only difference in SAT is driven by the students and parents.
I seem to notice that a school like frankford probably has lesser teachers.
I wouldn't say that's true. I think the performance difference stems from, as you say, the students and the parents. Still not a fan of Frankford, but I don't think it's the teachers' fault.
Quote:
I get that all schools have the same curriculum and the similar test...
However, if we were to factor out competition, which schools have flat out the best teachers and opportunity? ...
I'm open to buying not in just plano west, but also plano senior or plano east as long as I have a good confidence that the teachers are roughly just as good and the only difference in SAT is driven by the students and parents...
It's impossible to separate the various factors, but it would be hard to make the case that the West cluster teachers are inherently better at their jobs than the Central or East cluster teachers.
If that were the case, you'd be seeing all the eastside teachers moving "up" to jobs at Plano West and its feeders as they become available. Over my kid's PISD career, I have witnessed precisely ZERO teachers making that kind of move. There are people trying to move up to the next level of grades - from MS to HS, or from the 9/10 campus to the 11/12 campus, and there are teachers angling to move into administration. But I've never seen anyone on faculty in PISD trying to move clusters just for the sake of getting to the west side.
So, in my opinion, the teaching quality will be largely uniform across the district.
Now, that doesn't mean the learning quality will be identical, since the peer environment plays a big role in that. As hashed out upthread, the most challenging peer environment may well present less opportunity for a specific kid.
Figuring out that sweet spot is a tough question - not that different from deciding whether to go to UT and be a B- student, or OU and be an A- student, or something in-between.
Yes, that's what we are saying. Why? Because of this:
...
Yep. For a (made-up) example:
The Pre-Calc teacher at, say, Clark may give a test and have 2 kids score in the 90s, 5 in the 80s, and the rest in the 70s or lower. You can be sure that test will be curved up.
The teacher at Jasper could well be giving an identical test. But, with half her kids having an engineer dad/mom at home, and the other half having a paid tutor from UTD, the raw results will be in the 90s and 80s almost exclusively. So she either doesn't curve it, or augments the test to "Jasper-ize" it. Either way, those kids are being held to a higher standard.
It's been stated many times on this board that the teachers aren't "better" at one school or the other. I think we all also agree that the tests given are the same across the board. You'll have to excuse my ignorance. (Mine are graduated now and were never a threat for valedictorian.) It seems logical to me that I would want my kid going to, (using your example), Clark. You're basically saying there's a bunch of dummies at Clark. So if my kid is smart, wouldn't I want them taking advantage of the curves and non "Jasper-ization"?? Both of my kids are at very large colleges with fairly tough auto admission standards. (Think P5 not Ivy League.) Where they went to high school never really came up. (They both went to Vines/Plano). I guess I'm wondering, are there some schools that actually care if a prospective student went to Jasper over Clark?
Regardless, this is pretty good intel. PISD prides itself on making things the same across every campus in the district. So much so, that it actually hurts some over achieving academic and athletic programs and their respective boosters. If what you're saying is really true, there's great potential for investigations, lawsuits, etc. At the very least, maybe some change.
Dear OP, Whatever you do, DO NOT trust any realtor's knowledge or opinion about schools. Most of them don't have the knowledge and almost all of them twist it to support their interest. ALL Plano schools are good, some are great. Teachers, curriculum and PISD resources are distributed evenly. If you pick a top school, your kid would have a more stimulating learning experience but a tough competition. We are on Renner, Shepton, PWSH track and couldn't be happier. You pick your house according to high school, middle schools wouldn't matter as much if he is paying attention in class.
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and be an A- student, or something in-between.
