Third commercial airport for Dallas area? (Houston, Fort Worth: live, wealthy, suburbs)

[brock2010]

https://www.fool.com/investing/2023/...third-airport/

It even mentions that potentially a fourth or fifth airport could be added. Do you think a third airport is needed or the DFW area is fine with just 2?

[Mr. Clutch]

I could foresee a third airport in DFW, but I'm really iffy on McKinney making sense. Yes, its in a fast growing, wealthy part of the Metroplex, but it's still on the edge of the metro overall. I think of how long Dulles Airport in Virginia was in this situation - it was a relative ghost town for decades and it's just getting to the point where there's enough population around it for it to be a preferred airport for a critical mass of people.

I could totally see the McKinney Airport as a white elephant with few or no flights for a very long time. I can think of three better uses of airport funding over supporting conversion of McKinney to a commercial airport:

1. Expand DFW by adding terminal F
2. Expand Love Field by 10-20 gates and lift the ban on international flights there
3. Explore restarting commercial flights on the Ft. Worth side

Number 3 is probably the most iffy but the first two options would offer way more bang for the buck than building a terminal to support a couple of flights a day. The LA region has five commercial airports, but LAX still handles 80% of all LA-area operations despite being gate constrained. DFW Airport still has plenty of room to grow and I just don't see the point of another airport, especially on the Dallas side. Fort Worth side would be a maybe.

[tmtex]

I said No. Although I dont live up there, could you image a southwest plane landing in Mckinney

[jbb303]

Originally Posted by Mr. Clutch

I can think of three better uses of airport funding over supporting conversion of McKinney to a commercial airport:

1. Expand DFW by adding terminal F

I don't know that there's an either/or situation at play here and one of the two happening wouldn't hurt the chances of the other.

2. Expand Love Field by 10-20 gates and lift the ban on international flights there

I don't see this happening, not in our lifetime anyway. If Dallas thought they had the momentum to do it, the process would be well underway. This is a hill that a lot of people in the area will die on.

3. Explore restarting commercial flights on the Ft. Worth side

The government of the city of Fort Worth has zero interest in passenger service anywhere other than DFW. There's little to no mention of it in the new Meacham master plan. There's also almost no infrastructure to support commercial passenger traffic. Alliance and Meacham are also about half the distance away from DFW as McKinney. That doesn't take anything away from the fact that there's still a lot of growth happening to the west, but distance combined with the growth in the area adds to the appeal of McKinney.

[Mr. Clutch]

Originally Posted by jbb303

I don't know that there's an either/or situation at play here and one of the two happening wouldn't hurt the chances of the other.



I don't see this happening, not in our lifetime anyway. If Dallas thought they had the momentum to do it, the process would be well underway. This is a hill that a lot of people in the area will die on.



The government of the city of Fort Worth has zero interest in passenger service anywhere other than DFW. There's little to no mention of it in the new Meacham master plan. There's also almost no infrastructure to support commercial passenger traffic. Alliance and Meacham are also about half the distance away from DFW as McKinney. That doesn't take anything away from the fact that there's still a lot of growth happening to the west, but distance combined with the growth in the area adds to the appeal of McKinney.

With respect to the first point, perhaps I just don't see the market. What airlines would fly to McKinney and why? They are proposing a four-gate terminal so that's essentially enough for 30-40 flights a day initially. American wouldn't fly there for obvious reasons. Delta already flies to Love so maybe they could fill up a regional jet to Atlanta a couple of times a day. United maybe ditto to Newark, SFO, and/or Houston. Perhaps Delta or United would try an LAX flight. I can't see any advantage to the Spirits and Allegiants of the world trying something there. Its hard for me to see the volume there for significant mainline services and a few regional jet flights to major hubs isn't competitive with what's available at DFW or Love. All those frequent fliers and elites from Plano/Frisco/McKinney/Allen etc. aren't going to give up frequent service and mainline for that.

The prospect of Southwest starting service at McKinney is a wildcard, and that leads to the second point...

In a couple of years, Southwest will be able to fly out of DFW (if they want) without having to give up gates at Love Field. I don't really think they want to do that and go head to head with American, but they have been making a lot of noise about wanting to expand in the Metroplex and frustration about the lack of ability to do so at Love. Some speculate they could start ops out of McKinney. I think that could happen only if the city of Dallas refuses to play ball at Love regarding expanding the terminal and lifting the international ops ban. And I think that, given the choice to lose out on growth to the suburbs (again), they will eventually agree to lift the ban and expand the airport. The local residents will fight it tooth and nail but I think it will eventually happen and Southwest will have the ability to expand there.

Roger that on the Fort Worth piece. Meachem would need a complete airside rebuild to be commercial-ready and that's probably even less practical than setting up McKinney for commercial.

[rabbit33]

I don't know what you mean ”third airport” or ”fine with just 2”.

Addison
Arlington Municipal
Dallas Executive (or, as real Dallasites know it, Red Bird Airport)
DFW
Love Field
Meacham Field
Alliance

And then there are a number of other small airstrips.

[widespreadfan]

Originally Posted by rabbit33

I don't know what you mean ”third airport” or ”fine with just 2”.

Addison
Arlington Municipal
Dallas Executive (or, as real Dallasites know it, Red Bird Airport)
DFW
Love Field
Meacham Field
Alliance

And then there are a number of other small airstrips.

Mesquite and Denton also have decent municipal airports. I think we will see commercial service at a 3rd and possibly 4th airport as the DFW Metroplex continues to grow.

[brock2010]

Originally Posted by rabbit33

I don't know what you mean ”third airport” or ”fine with just 2”.

Addison
Arlington Municipal
Dallas Executive (or, as real Dallasites know it, Red Bird Airport)
DFW
Love Field
Meacham Field
Alliance

And then there are a number of other small airstrips.

I was talking about commercial airports. DFW and Love are the only ones that offer those services.

[ThomasCrown]

The problem with McKinney being the choice for another airport is that it's far from where the growth corridor is, which is more or less centered on the land between/near the DNT and Preston Rd.



It would make a lot of sense to me to have Celina host a commercial airport, where access would be easy for Plano, Frisco, Prosper, McKinney, Gunter, etc... while having plenty of land to build it right and mitigate traffic and development woes. I think you'd get Southwest to commit, and I also think you'd get American to commit some of their shorter regional routes there to compete. At that point, Delta and United would probably look at putting some of their regionals there too.



The plans for extending the DNT already go up to Hwy 82 if I'm not mistaken. Putting a new airport in somewhere between Tioga and Gunter would serve the growth that has occurred over the past two decades and the growth expected over the next 20-30 years.

[unknown00]

Why would anyone vote no? All the massive expansion in DFW is north north north and just making the commute to any airport unbearable. They need an airport up north, please!!