one way to reform a low-performing school (Dallas: employment, buyers)

[Pintea]

Loves2read, it's so interesting to read your opinions regarding education!
I think parents have to be involved, there is no other way.
My son brought home some school work the other day. His teacher wrote on it "great job, keep it up"!
One of the words was "hosiery". He wrote "hoistery" and he also used the word in a sentence. Oh yes, he used the plural form - "hoisteries" of course!
A day later she said "millenium" was spelled incorrectly.
It's always a struggle, I feel like I'm actually homeschooling and he goes to school for a little bit of fun and socializing.

[aceplace]

It's unrealistic to expect students to want to study in school... that's why they're forced to be there by law. They wouldn't be there otherwise. The curriculum is mandated by the state, and the student is forced to endure it. The students do not see the benefit of studying history or math... how many 10 year olds have a burning desire to learn about Texas history?

What we have is basically a group of people being forced to work, to fill the priorities of those with power over them... no different than a forced-labor plantation. At least that is the way the students can see it. The kids do not appreciate the concerns that their parents have... they're too inexperienced to appreciate education.

Rather than force a slave to work, we pay a free man to do it. Very few people put in 8 hours a day on the job out of concern for the overall economy... they do it for their personal benefit, and they try to build their skills in order to make more money and earn more power and status.

If we really want to motivate students to learn, we need to build in a system of rewards and prestige to be gained for excelling at it... just as their parents gain materially for the value and quality of their work. As it is now, the only thing to gain from good grades in school is ostracism and harassment.

Blaming a teacher for students' failure to pass exams is about as mad as blaming slave drivers for laziness by the slaves.

[aceplace]

To sum up my previous post...

Schools are doomed to fail or at most only marginally succeed because they are an unnatural social system.

The "work" done by students is not seen as valuable by the students themselves.

In order to succeed, the schools need to reward the students for achievement, either with monetary or non-monetary rewards.

The product created by the students, i.e., their "work" has to be seen as valuable by other students.

[aceplace]

Originally Posted by loves2read

escanlan--for what it is worth--
I AM a retired English teacher--I taught for over 12 yrs--I started in one of the worst high schools in Houston when I was a new graduate and I was a pretty naive teacher back then...I thought I could teach anyone anything IF I tried hard enough and that everyone wanted to learn...I learned that even students who want to learn can sometimes have difficulties that prevent that from happening...and nothing/no one can teach a student who does not want to learn...

Loves, I admire your professionalism and dedication.

I think about the old joke that goes... how many therapists does it take to change a light bulb?

Just one...

But the light bulb has to want to change.

[aceplace]

Some people say...

...why should I have to pay school taxes? We don't have children or intend to, and none of our friends have children either?

Well then, why should you pay taxes to support prisons? Do you expect to go to prison someday? Are any of your friends in prison?

[cris006]

Parents need to take an active role in education their children, PERIOD. My parents reviewed my homework for mistakes and "tutored" me every night growing up to make sure I didn't miss anything covered by the teacher. Learning doesn't stop at the bell, and sadly teachers are too commonly the scapegoat for a failure of the districts and federal government in implementing programs that work.

[cris006]

Originally Posted by FarNorthDallas

My son left 2nd grade in public school unable to read. Once I put him in the right private school environment with specialized reading teachers and specialized reading instruction he finally learned to read. He was about 10 years old when I could say, Ok, he can read now. He is a really good reader now (9th grade), reading above grade level.

Why didn't you teach him read?

[FarNorthDallas]

Originally Posted by cris006

Why didn't you teach him read?

I tried with Phonographix, Hook on Phonics and the Bob books and one other method I'm drawing a blank on, but nothing clicked. I needed to call in professionals.

[adpace]

Originally Posted by loves2read

escanlan--for what it is worth--
I AM a retired English teacher--I taught for over 12 yrs--I started in one of the worst high schools in Houston when I was a new graduate and I was a pretty naive teacher back then...I thought I could teach anyone anything IF I tried hard enough and that everyone wanted to learn...I learned that even students who want to learn can sometimes have difficulties that prevent that from happening...and nothing/no one can teach a student who does not want to learn...

I had a more practical POV when I returned to the classroom after a pretty long hiatus while my own children were growing up...
because I had an understanding husband I was normally one of the first teachers in my bldg--there by 7 (almost an hour early) and I stayed until after 6 most evenings...the night janitors and I were often the only ones in my end of the bldg...

I was ready on any of those days to give tutorials to any student who wanted help
surprisingly there were plenty of days I was alone in my room until the bell rang or as soon as the last class...
I called parents, graded work timely and passed it back, allowed makeups to be done on failing assignments, gave extra credit work, posted grades so students always knew how they stood in my class, used a variety of teaching styles, augmented with audio-visual aids, used group learning, conferenced with counselors and other teachers about students who struggled, and I knew my subject matter...
and I still had students who failed---in all but a very small number I felt that I had done my job--I spent more time preparing for class than my students did--I worried more about their abilities (or lack of them) than they did--

a teacher can pass any student--that is not hard--there are too many teachers doing that now--giving easy grades and having low standards that measure nothing significant about learning or educational progress--that is part of the problem with students who expect learning to be painless and effortless...

there are some students who don't want to succeed for a variety of reasons--some of them are so busy making their point that they don't have to obey authority they would not leave a burning building...a growing majority of them come from homes were English is not the main language but even in many Anglo homes, learning is not valued--parents don't read to their children or read themselves--they enable their kids to call in sick when they aren't, don't care if they get caught cheating, and often times now parents need the money that older children can make working jobs after school that often last until 1 in the morning--
which makes a very tired student the next day...
who I am to say that a student should choose school over helping pay the rent or buy groceries or gas for the car ...many families today in this state are living in hardship conditions that make school a secondary concern...

it is easy to say that a teacher should do a better job of reaching those students but hard to do...especially when there is a class of 30 other students, many of whom have needs and issues of their own...
you can think what you like--
I know I certainly won't change your mind--and it won't keep me up at night
I just know that even dedicated teachers are facing hugh difficulties in teaching in today's educational system...they feel about as powerless as their students to survive the system that is demanding more of them and often providing less--money, supplies, training, equipment, appreciation...

Amen!!! This is why (I am sad to say) I left the teaching field. I did everything I could possibly do and it was never enough. In fact, there are so many willing to criticize the teacher first when the teacher is doing everything in their power to make a positive difference. As a teacher, you take a lot of heat for doing things right when the teacher down the hall from you may be handing out passing grades to kids just for showing up and getting applauded for it. I felt it was so hard to do the right thing as a teacher, but I did the "right thing" nonetheless and ended up leaving because it I just couldn't bear to see what was happening.

Just my two cents. I don't suppose it relates directly to the article, but I'm just tired of hearing how it is all the teacher's fault and they are not doing their jobs, when in reality many are trying and even being persuaded by administrations to NOT do their jobs correctly. I can't tell you how many times an administrator asked me to change a grade because they didn't want the star basketball player to fail (even though he never turned in his work or even tried to participate in class - he already thought he would just be given the grade so he could play) or they didn't want the superintendent's child to get a zero for cheating because that might look bad. I never gave in to that kind of junk, but it is happening in most every school in this country and it is so sad. It will only change when parents, politicians and anyone else with vested interest in the schools stops pointing fingers at those who can't do anymore than they're already doing and starts to make the changes that will actually help!

[loves2read]

Thank you, I think, Pintea--I take your comment to be positive...

frankly I willingly support a public school system because I believe that is in the interest of a FREE nation--
I want the future voters, the workers, the politicians, the person my grandchildren marry to have a great education--and you can't count on enough numbers getting that in private schools or in church schools...

and I don't see how anyone who was a teacher can NOT support public schools--quality public education is the only hope of the common man and in so many ways is what sustained the American Dream...

to have an educated public who is not the product of brainwashing in one political/religious system
but where people are actually taught to think and evaluate information and learn how/when a spin is being placed on knowledge--

just as what is happening now with the new adoption of the social studies curricula textbooks in Texas
where a cadre of members of the state board of education with their religious/political agenda are attempting to put a stamp of their focus on the material in the textbooks...
this is government by a narrow-minded minority POV basically because our govenor is warped and the people are too ill-educated to care...

I just don't see much hope for the future when you have people who are so polarized in their religious/political beliefs that FACTS are considered irrelavant and logic has no basis in the thought process...
a scary world folks...

Case in point--Germany prior to WWII had the highest level of personal education of any European nation yet the type of education was rote-learning in a totally autocratic, non-creative or truth-investigative type of environment--and thus superior education enabled the nazi propaganda to turn almost all levels of the German people against the Jews and other victims of the Holocaust/Nazi regime)


but where people are actually taught to think and evaluate information and learn how/when a spin is being placed on knowledge--
just as what is happening now with the new adoption of the social studies curricula textbooks in Texas
where a cadre of members of the state board of education with their religious/political agenda are attempting to put a stamp of their focus on the material in the textbooks...
this is government by a narrow-minded minority POV basically because our govenor is warped and the people are too ill-educated to care...

I just don't see much hope for the future when you have people who are so polarized in their religious/political beliefs that FACTS are considered irrelavant and logic has no basis in the thought process...
a scary world folks...