May I ask....Why all the foreign vehicles? (Center: wages, live in)

[I_Want_Snow]

Originally Posted by Get out of my way

If you need 425 hp, it better be for towing something! 150 - 250 should do fine. .

MORE POWER (grunt, grunt... as Tim the Toolman Taylor would say!!)

[I_Want_Snow]

Originally Posted by EscapeCalifornia

The money saved goes into the product. The big 3 US makers are famous for grinding their suppliers so the point where they get shoddy parts out of them. The Japanese, not so much.

Are you saying the Japanese cars use better materials? How about the metal for the overall structure and all the panels and doors? How about the paint, rims, foam and leather for the seats, windows, carpet, plastics, etc?

From what I can tell Foreign cars are just like American cars: They rust just as easy as American cars, the metal dents and crinkles, paint fades, rims get pitted, leather and foam gets wore out, plastic cracks, carpet stains and gets wore out, etc.

Maybe their motors/drive-train last longer, but does that add up to half of the vehicle cost? If I buy a Corolla for say $16,000 does the motor/drive-train add up to $8000 or half of the car?

[vegaspilgrim]

Originally Posted by mimomof2

I guess coming from MI, the "automotive capital" is why I ask this question. I have been here a couple of months and love it. I just can not believe how many Toyota's, Honda's etc. I would say at least 8 out of 10. I know automotive is not the industry here, but I can see why MI economy is horrible. GM, Chrysler or Ford for me!

Just a little vent.

Because Toyota makes superior cars.

[I_Want_Snow]

Originally Posted by vegaspilgrim

Because Toyota makes superior cars.

Then why do they pay their workers half for supposedly making SUPERIOR cars? Shouldn't the SUPERIOR companies pay their employees better than everyone else?

[EscapeCalifornia]

Originally Posted by I_Want_Snow

Are you saying the Japanese cars use better materials? How about the metal for the overall structure and all the panels and doors? How about the paint, rims, foam and leather for the seats, windows, carpet, plastics, etc?

From what I can tell Foreign cars are just like American cars: They rust just as easy as American cars, the metal dents and crinkles, paint fades, rims get pitted, leather and foam gets wore out, plastic cracks, carpet stains and gets wore out, etc.

Maybe their motors/drive-train last longer, but does that add up to half of the vehicle cost? If I buy a Corolla for say $16,000 does the motor/drive-train add up to $8000 or half of the car?

Yes, I'm saying the Japanese use better materials. American cars just feel cheap to me. Go rent a PT Cruiser for the weekend and then a Corolla and tell me which one feels like a cheap piece of plastic.

[I_Want_Snow]

Originally Posted by EscapeCalifornia

Yes, I'm saying the Japanese use better materials. American cars just feel cheap to me. Go rent a PT Cruiser for the weekend and then a Corolla and tell me which one feels like a cheap piece of plastic.

Well you got me on that one... I will NOT defend anything about the PT Cruiser!! That thing is a POS! LOL...

But why not compare the Corolla to the Ford Focus or Chevy Cobalt as those are the cars the Corolla is in the same class with.

[EscapeCalifornia]

Originally Posted by I_Want_Snow

Well you got me on that one... I will NOT defend anything about the PT Cruiser!! That thing is a POS! LOL...

But why not compare the Corolla to the Ford Focus or Chevy Cobalt as those are the cars the Corolla is in the same class with.

I rented a Focus a couple years ago. Better than the PT but still had issues. The auto-gain on the radio randomly messed with the volume and the driver's seat cushion progressively compacted over a drive, causing me to sink into it enough that I constantly had to adjust my rear view mirror. This on a car with all of 15k miles on it. I know rentals have hard lives, but come on. My wife's friend owned one and they had issues too with things breaking that should have been recalled but Ford just shined them on. Their next car was a Camry.

[backdrifter]

Originally Posted by I_Want_Snow

Well you got me on that one... I will NOT defend anything about the PT Cruiser!! That thing is a POS! LOL...

But why not compare the Corolla to the Ford Focus or Chevy Cobalt as those are the cars the Corolla is in the same class with.

Ugh... Try sitting in the seat of a Cobalt all day and then sit all day in the seat of a Honda Civic... Little things like the ergonomics of the seats or soft-touch materials in the cabin or smoothly operating controls or higher quality cloth or consistently small panel gaps make a big difference in many people's car-buying decisions. Not to mention ride quality and driving dynamics and fuel economy. I could keep going...

American cars are just not as refined as Japanese, European, or Korean cars. And more and more American cars are being built in Mexico while, you guessed it, foreign automakers are building in the U.S. Sure they pay their workers less, but I would HARDLY call it "slave labor."

I've owned a Toyota, a Honda, and now a Volvo, and I cannot see myself buying an American car for the foreseeable future unless they surprise me and build a car that is engineered, designed, and built with the attention to detail of an Asian or European car.

[I_Want_Snow]

Originally Posted by backdrifter

Ugh... Try sitting in the seat of a Cobalt all day and then sit all day in the seat of a Honda Civic... Little things like the ergonomics of the seats or soft-touch materials in the cabin or smoothly operating controls or higher quality cloth or consistently small panel gaps make a big difference in many people's car-buying decisions. Not to mention ride quality and driving dynamics and fuel economy. I could keep going...

American cars are just not as refined as Japanese, European, or Korean cars. And more and more American cars are being built in Mexico while, you guessed it, foreign automakers are building in the U.S. Sure they pay their workers less, but I would HARDLY call it "slave labor."

I've owned a Toyota, a Honda, and now a Volvo, and I cannot see myself buying an American car for the foreseeable future unless they surprise me and build a car that is engineered, designed, and built with the attention to detail of an Asian or European car.

Korean cars?? Are you serious? A KIA is better than Ford, GM, or Chrysler?

The Ford Focus has been on Car and Drivers top 10 list 5 times in 8 years. That's not bad if you ask me. It's got a great ergonomic feel.

Panel gaps?? So the Domestic cars gaps are not good? Funny I have never read anywhere about any automotive magazine talking about panel gaps being a problem.

Fuel economy?? Did you see my earlier post?
Taken from site fueleconomy.gov for 2008 models:

Toyota Corolla
26 city
35 Hwy

Honda civic
22-25 city
29-36 hwy

Chevy Cobalt
24 city
30-36 hwy

Ford Focus
24 city
35 hwy

[EscapeCalifornia]

I take magazine endorsements with a grain of salt. I can't tell you how many times Norton or McAfee have been "editor's picks" and they're two of the worst programs you could ever put on a computer. Magazine reviewers aren't spending their own money and they're not looking at the long haul with their "picks".