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I have two adopted border collies. One is a female, at least ten years old, and I adopted her nearly five years ago.
Before I adopted her she had spent most of her life in a small pen in a barn. When I brought her home she was afraid of people and loud noises, and spent most of her time hiding. After just a few months in my home, an obedience class and lots of play sessions she settled down. Now she is very intelligent, affectionate and eager to please.
However, she still has a lot of anxiety, even after almost five years in my home. Most of the time she is fine, happily playing with toys and thinking she is a lap dog. But she often paces in frantic circles, or whines nervously and won't relax for hours at a time.
Certain noises terrify her. I know many dogs are afraid of thunder and fireworks, but she gets very upset by even small, unexpected noises. For example, she totally freaked out when we were walking on a trail and someone snapped a camera case shut.
She seems to be having more severe and frequent anxiety issues as she gets older.
I have never used any type of behavior meds for my dogs, but I am beginning to wonder if I should consider an anxiety medication for her. One of my friends has a dog that had severe separation anxiety when she adopted her, but after a few months on clomipramine has become very relaxed. Her dog, a lab mix, was actually going to be euthanized before she adopted her due to the severe anxiety.
So I am wondering if anyone has any experiences or advice to share regarding anxiety meds for dogs?
Mod - would you please remove the smilie from my thread title? I intended to post a question mark, not sure how I got a smilie instead? Thanks!
Last edited by Sam I Am; 06-23-2012 at 02:44 PM..
Reason: per poster request
Location: Montreal -> CT -> MA -> Montreal -> Ottawa
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Hi Missy!
A friend of mine had his dog on clomipramine and he said that it did wonders for his dog.
When I asked my vet if she would prescribe it for Artie -- he is anxious about everything... which manifests itself as aggression until he knows he's safe -- but she said that she wouldn't, that I should get a behaviorist. I had a behaviorist, but the techniques depend on *me* and I didn't do a good job of it.
So, I don't have first-hand (or second-hand, rather, since I wouldn't be the one taking it) knowledge of clomipramine, but my friend said that it was a world of change for his dog... and I plan on talking to my new vet about it next month, now that we've moved.
Good luck! I know how frustrating and saddening it is to see your dog act so tortured.
A friend of mine had his dog on clomipramine and he said that it did wonders for his dog.
When I asked my vet if she would prescribe it for Artie -- he is anxious about everything... which manifests itself as aggression until he knows he's safe -- but she said that she wouldn't, that I should get a behaviorist. I had a behaviorist, but the techniques depend on *me* and I didn't do a good job of it.
So, I don't have first-hand (or second-hand, rather, since I wouldn't be the one taking it) knowledge of clomipramine, but my friend said that it was a world of change for his dog... and I plan on talking to my new vet about it next month, now that we've moved.
Good luck! I know how frustrating and saddening it is to see your dog act so tortured.
Hi Dawn!
When I discussed this with my vet a few years ago he said the same thing, that he would not prescribe a behavior med, but gave me a referral to a behaviorist. The behaviorist was in a different city, wanted weekly sessions, and was very expensive. My work schedule varies so much that it wasn't possible for me to set the necessary appointments so I just worked with her at home and she improved somewhat.
But now she has been getting more and more anxious. Even when we walk on the trails, which she loves, she is constantly looking behind her and jumps when someone comes up behind us. She recently heard a noise - a videocamera being turned on beside us - and she panicked. She threw herself down, pulled out of her collar and ran. She was so upset that she wouldn't come to me, and this was on a trail beside a busy 4-lane road, so I was very upset as well. She finally ran to a total stranger and sat down beside him. Very strange indeed, as she usually avoids strangers.
The clomipramine has worked so well for my friend's dog, and her vet had no hesitation prescribing the med. As I mentioned, her dog had such severe issues that she was going to be euthanized until my friend agreed to take her. I actually dogsit for her dog very often so I see what a change the med has made for her.
Location: Montreal -> CT -> MA -> Montreal -> Ottawa
17,330 posts, read 33,036,872 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by missik999
Hi Dawn!
When I discussed this with my vet a few years ago he said the same thing, that he would not prescribe a behavior med, but gave me a referral to a behaviorist. The behaviorist was in a different city, wanted weekly sessions, and was very expensive. My work schedule varies so much that it wasn't possible for me to set the necessary appointments so I just worked with her at home and she improved somewhat.
But now she has been getting more and more anxious. Even when we walk on the trails, which she loves, she is constantly looking behind her and jumps when someone comes up behind us. She recently heard a noise - a videocamera being turned on beside us - and she panicked. She threw herself down, pulled out of her collar and ran. She was so upset that she wouldn't come to me, and this was on a trail beside a busy 4-lane road, so I was very upset as well. She finally ran to a total stranger and sat down beside him. Very strange indeed, as she usually avoids strangers.
The clomipramine has worked so well for my friend's dog, and her vet had no hesitation prescribing the med. As I mentioned, her dog had such severe issues that she was going to be euthanized until my friend agreed to take her. I actually dogsit for her dog very often so I see what a change the med has made for her.
Could you change vets and go to your friend's vet? If not, maybe tell your vet all that you've just said here and see if he changes his mind. So frustrating for you... and so difficult for your poor pup.
I have two adopted border collies. One is a female, at least ten years old, and I adopted her nearly five years ago.
Before I adopted her she had spent most of her life in a small pen in a barn. When I brought her home she was afraid of people and loud noises, and spent most of her time hiding. After just a few months in my home, an obedience class and lots of play sessions she settled down. Now she is very intelligent, affectionate and eager to please.
However, she still has a lot of anxiety, even after almost five years in my home. Most of the time she is fine, happily playing with toys and thinking she is a lap dog. But she often paces in frantic circles, or whines nervously and won't relax for hours at a time.
Certain noises terrify her. I know many dogs are afraid of thunder and fireworks, but she gets very upset by even small, unexpected noises. For example, she totally freaked out when we were walking on a trail and someone snapped a camera case shut.
She seems to be having more severe and frequent anxiety issues as she gets older.
I have never used any type of behavior meds for my dogs, but I am beginning to wonder if I should consider an anxiety medication for her. One of my friends has a dog that had severe separation anxiety when she adopted her, but after a few months on clomipramine has become very relaxed. Her dog, a lab mix, was actually going to be euthanized before she adopted her due to the severe anxiety.
So I am wondering if anyone has any experiences or advice to share regarding anxiety meds for dogs?
Mod - would you please remove the smilie from my thread title? I intended to post a question mark, not sure how I got a smilie instead? Thanks!
This sounds EXACTLY like my little dog - she is almost 2. We got her at 3 months from a breeder who kept her on a huge plot of property isolated from any noises, living with 6 other dogs. We live in the City, and she often won't even go out.
Your description of the trail is exactly what just happened to her.
When she is frightened (which is most of the time) she won't take treats nor even look at us. Stays totally focused on whatever it is that scares her.
We are trying to find a behaviorist, but not having much luck finding a local one.
Good Luck - let us know if you find something that works
We have tried a thunder shirt, DAP collar, and Xanax, all to no avail.
She does great in obedience classes - but they are all controlled environments.
Could you change vets and go to your friend's vet? If not, maybe tell your vet all that you've just said here and see if he changes his mind. So frustrating for you... and so difficult for your poor pup.
I am thinking about taking her to the clinic where my friend takes her pets. I think in this case behavior meds could greatly improve my dog's life.
For Winnie, I truly believe she has a psychiatric or neurological condition. She was a rescue dog who had been through a lot of trauma. (I had another thread on that)
She is still "crazy" but a lot more tolerable. Anyone else would have euthanized her, so we figured putting her on meds was preferable, to at least give her a chance. Some behavior really isn't trainable. For example, before the meds, when we took Winnie for a walk, she would not even stop to smell things, like any normal dog. She would just "boing" off in all different directions, or get distracted by a bug or a leaf, and she wouldn't even stop to pee. With the clomipramine, she walks on the leash (not well, but my expectations weren't great) but she stops and smells where other dogs have urinated (like a normal dog), she actually pees where she has smelled other dogs (like a normal dog), she looks at butterflies but doesn't chase them, and she no longer tried to climb or bite trees.
To see if this was just an effect of time, and getting used to the leash, we tried to skip a few doses of the meds. Right away: climging and biting trees, chasing bugs and invisible things, and not even caring about smelling where other dogs have peed.
Before the meds, she had bitten me three times, not in a hostile way, but in an "altered state of consciousness" way. She was just so easily startled and hyper-reactive that she bit me without seeming to even know it. Since the meds, she had not bitten me. We still have episodes of scary snarling and growling that would frightening if she were bigger than 20lbs. But the meds have made such a huge difference, and I think that over time, training can and will reduce these episodes.
So she is much happier on the meds, and I believe they really aren't changing her behavior, so much as how she perceives and processes her surroundings.
My vet tends to be very holistic, into natural remedies over pharmaceuticals. But after I asked about clomipraine, and he saw Winnie in action, he agreed to try the meds. He admitted after almost a year that he had not had much hope for the meds, and he had thought we'd end up putting her down, so he was really pleased with the results.
To the OP, I have a rescue herding breed also, and have similar issues, I've tried the Thundershirt (waste of money), T-Touch (Odie loved it but it didn't do any good either), I've talked with several dog trainers who I trust and know very well and have instituted their behavior mods...so far no luck. I've also tried some Homeopathic remedies with marginal success and recently upped the dosage to see if that would help and it did some what. I've talked with my Vet who I've known for decades and he gave me some Ace to try, he wanted me to use injection Ace but Odie's so frantic I'm afraid I'd miss and hit me so I have oral Ace. He did give me some Clomicalm but I've decided against it as it takes 2 weeks to get into their system and work and you can only have them on it for 12 weeks and the side effects aren't charming. I've yet to use the Ace, but from upping the dosage on the Anxiety TFLN and getting firm and telling him to "knock it off" (the breeder suggested the firm knock it off)...has helped.
Let us know what you end up doing...these herding breeds can develop obssesive behaviors through out their lives in a heartbeat. Good luck!
Oh, fogot about this. If the problem is mainly fear/anxiety, try the DAP (Dog appeasing pheramone) plug-in. They have collars with DAP and little handheld spray bottles, but the plug-in version can do wonders with fearful/anxious dogs. You just plug it in and people can barely smell anything, but the dog smells it, and it triggers "comforting" neurotransmitters.
I've know several people with very anxious dogs and the DAP worked beautifully. (Winnie ate the one I bought, so it wasn't really right for her...)
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so I have oral Ace. He did give me some Clomicalm but I've decided against it as it takes 2 weeks to get into their system and work and you can only have them on it for 12 weeks and the side effects aren't charming. I've yet to use the Ace, but from upping the dosage on the Anxiety TFLN and getting firm and telling him to "knock it off" (the breeder suggested the firm knock it off)...has helped.
