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Thought-provoking article- thanks for posting it and starting this conversation.
I have been mulling this around since you first posted it. I keep coming full circle back to - very few pet owners are willing, able, or equipped to deal with an intact animal.
All of my dogs have been rescues, and fortunately, have been late s/n as they were older 1+ years old when I adopted (and they were intact when they went into rescue). That said, my next dog will be a male puppy from an outstanding breeder- a retirement present for myself My first concern is always for my dog's health, and I admit that I have always been concerned about the effect of abruptly pulling those hormones from an animal's system.
My thought process in whether or not to keep puppy intact is that since he will be trained for competition he needs to be intact, and I am able to provide the full range of training from puppyhood to adult that will support this. I also agree that I want him as healthy as possible which would preclude neutering him.
I need to do much more research on this subject before I am entirely comfortable with it though, and again, I am speaking strictly for myself; with certain exceptions, for the general population of pet owners I think leaving pets intact would be a disaster. And there is a huge part of me that is intimidated by the responsibility of ensuring that there are absolutely NO oops moments.
That said, apart from the health benefits, I was interested in the behavioral aspects alleged to be influenced by s/n. Greater focus, less ADD behavior, sounds like more balanced in general.
Whether one agrees with the article or not, the general topic of the benefits or drawbacks of s/n is worth re-evaluating in light of new studies and veterinary practices.
I would never neuter a large breed dog like a German Shepherd. Many studies have linked neutering with hip dysplasia and neutered dogs will gain weight, lose energy and eventually become obese leading to a shorter lifespan. A good owner can easily control an intact dog with fencing and leashes, neutering is simply unnecessary in most cases.
I keep coming full circle back to - very few pet owners are willing, able, or equipped to deal with an intact animal.
^^^^This x1000. If an experienced owner wants to keep an animal intact to show or to compete with in a dog sport that's one thing but IMO the average pet owner does not have the time, inclination or in most cases the ability to deal with an intact animal. Every day across the country there are many dogs the get lose from their owners or escape from the backyard. can you imagine the increase in unwanted pets if the vast majority of these dogs weren't neutered.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtoks
I would never neuter a large breed dog like a German Shepherd. Many studies have linked neutering with hip dysplasia and neutered dogs will gain weight, lose energy and eventually become obese leading to a shorter lifespan. A good owner can easily control an intact dog with fencing and leashes, neutering is simply unnecessary in most cases.
Every single one of my German shepherds have been fixed. None of them were obese. My first GSDs I lost at 14 and 12 1/2. Both had good hips which were certified by the OFA. My two current GSDs are 9 and 5. The 9 year old had bad hips which were discovered before he was neutered. My female has good hips (again confirmed by x-ray).
Have you ever had to control an intact male who wants to breed to an intact female? There is nothing "easy" about it. I've known people whose GSDs have eaten through doors, broken out of crates and eaten through a wood fence to get to try to get to an intact female. Not to mention the fact that the male will often howl if he can't get to the female. If your female is in heat you can't leave her in the back yard alone. Every intact male dog in the neighborhood will be trying to get to her there are plenty of dogs (GSDs and otherwise) who can and will jump a fence to breed a female.
Keeping a dog intact is unnecessary in most cases. The dog's weight can be controlled through diet and exercise intact or not.
Thought-provoking article- thanks for posting it and starting this conversation.
I have been mulling this around since you first posted it. I keep coming full circle back to - very few pet owners are willing, able, or equipped to deal with an intact animal.
All of my dogs have been rescues, and fortunately, have been late s/n as they were older 1+ years old when I adopted (and they were intact when they went into rescue). That said, my next dog will be a male puppy from an outstanding breeder- a retirement present for myself My first concern is always for my dog's health, and I admit that I have always been concerned about the effect of abruptly pulling those hormones from an animal's system.
My thought process in whether or not to keep puppy intact is that since he will be trained for competition he needs to be intact, and I am able to provide the full range of training from puppyhood to adult that will support this. I also agree that I want him as healthy as possible which would preclude neutering him.
I need to do much more research on this subject before I am entirely comfortable with it though, and again, I am speaking strictly for myself; with certain exceptions, for the general population of pet owners I think leaving pets intact would be a disaster. And there is a huge part of me that is intimidated by the responsibility of ensuring that there are absolutely NO oops moments.
That said, apart from the health benefits, I was interested in the behavioral aspects alleged to be influenced by s/n. Greater focus, less ADD behavior, sounds like more balanced in general.
Whether one agrees with the article or not, the general topic of the benefits or drawbacks of s/n is worth re-evaluating in light of new studies and veterinary practices.
Glad you posted, 12. Was wondering if you would. I have pretty much the same feelings you do both about the general pet owning population and my own situation with a couple exceptions.
Personally, I am not too worried about preventing an oops since we have such good control of our dogs as it is. For example, our dogs are NEVER outside in our large fenced yard unsupervised. And I am encouraged by what I've seen in recent years as a welcome increase in pet owner education and responsibility...at least in my geographical area. I continue to be exasperated, of course, but also impressed by examples of pet owner responsibility that previously had been pretty much reserved for show/performance/service/working folks.
I have so many friends who very successfully locally, nationally and internationally compete their intact dogs, both male and female, in sports that require lots of focus...such as obedience and agility...and I've always been amazed at their performance since for so many years spay/neuter has been touted as a necessary improvement to focus and behavior. Maybe the performance I've been witnessing, along with outstanding training/handling, is the benefit of a natural dog.
Regarding what I bolded in your post: YES! That was my point in starting this thread.
Jumpindogs, thanks for posting - I finally got around to reading the article. I thought the article was interesting. I will likely spay or neuter my next dog(s), but I did both my current dogs at about 5 months, and that was likely too early, so I would likely do the spay/neuter at about 18 months after the dog is fully grown.
As to your wanting to keep intact a dog you are going to train for a service dog, my personal opinion is do not wait until 2 yrs old, please. I think you'll find the dog will be better focused if he is not being distracted by hormones.
This really depends on the dog and the person. Many intact dogs in the hands of savvy owners/handlers can function with a great degree of focus.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumpindogs I meant mistakes in your personal career/hobby endeavor as a comparison to breeders' career/hobby of breeding dogs.
Find me a person who has never made a mistake in their own career/hobby that they very much wish they hadn't. You can't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by subject2change
Oh, of course. More than one or two!
Same here.
My point was that before we judge another too harshly for one mistake in an otherwise reputable and ethical career/hobby we ought to consider that perfection is impossible for all of us. The end results certainly vary...a breeder's oops litter may (or may not) take homes away from other dogs and mistakes in a hospital setting (such as where I work and I could tell you stories) can have mildly negative to disastrous consequences for people whereas mistakes in some other fields aren't as impactful...but the bottom line is that nobody can achieve perfection and I think we are wise to remember that.
Thanks for the article. I found it interesting. I have a 10 month old airedale terrier that is intact. The breeder, who was very well informed on such issues, said that recent evidence suggested that it is better to wait until the animal has fully matured (18-24 months old) before neutering. I did my due diligence and researched it out and also spoke with my vet about it. He said that it is better to wait if you can for a variety of reasons (ie growth plates, tendons, etc.). So, that's what I'm planning in doing. This is my third airedale so I'm quite familiar with the breed. Incidentally, my last airedale (what a great dog!), even though he was in very good shape most of his life, died from a malignant melanoma when he was 12 years old. He was also neutered when he was 6 months old which makes me wonder a bit if there was any relationship with that. And even though he wasn't obese, although there were some times when he got a bit hefty, he had a voracious appetite that seemed rarely satiated. My current pup eats but sometimes will leave food uneaten which I don't think I ever witnessed in my last dog.
Last edited by biggunsmallbrains; 07-17-2015 at 02:18 PM..
What the article is NOT saying and neither is anyone whos post I read ... You wait You may end up with a Dead Dog! Dogs that Reach murturity are 100% likely to fight other dogs in the home..to the death! Dogs Fixed at 6-7 months most likely never fight over being top dog!
What the article is NOT saying and neither is anyone whos post I read ... You wait You may end up with a Dead Dog! Dogs that Reach murturity are 100% likely to fight other dogs in the home..to the death! Dogs Fixed at 6-7 months most likely never fight over being top dog!
Katie1 that's just plain wrong. I have too many friends to count who have multiple dog households, all or most of the dogs intact and of same sex, where they get along just fine. And I know plenty of altered dogs who are quite scrappy with other dogs.
That is not to say that spay/neuter, as well as keeping a dog intact, does not have an affect on an individual dog's approach to other dogs. It does. That is also not to say that fights to the death do not occur. They do. But rarely when we consider the number of multiple dog households in this country. That is also not to say that the training/management expertise of the owner does not play a role. It does.
Lotsa variables.
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My first concern is always for my dog's health, and I admit that I have always been concerned about the effect of abruptly pulling those hormones from an animal's system. 
